Range of dual band devices

[k5map]

Has anyone tested the range/distance of the wireless portion of the dual band devices? 

[stusviews]

Ranges will vary greatly depending on a number of factors such as structural materials, for example, metal boxes, concrete or brick walls; large metal devices such as refrigerators and ranges; and a number of RF interfering devices (e.g baby monitors, cordless phones, etc.) to name just a few. That's why the specs, when available indicate "in open air."

 

Do you have a particular difficulty?

[oberkc]

I have not performed any controlled tests.  I also have seen no reason to doubt the specifications mentioned by stusviews and agree that the range can have a LARGE variability based on installation factors.

 

Based upon what I read around here, it seems that range can also vary by device, and even among multiple copies of similar devices.  I have a general perception that, all other things being equal, the "range extenders" have as good of range as any device.  My best guess would be that I see the most complaints about shortness of range in regards to the insteon bulb. 

 

In my own experience, I have motion sensors removed up to 30 feet (with a wall in between) from the nearest dual-band device (a range extender) and it seems to work reliably. 

 

I tend to view the RF as a "backup" to the wire communication path, best when one has many RF-enabled devices communicating amongst themselves.  I would be very hesitant to rely solely on the RF side of insteon for communication among devices.

[k5map]

I'm not having any problems.  I'm a IT professional and understand the "expected" distance for WiFi but have limited experience with INSTEON wireless.  So just trying to get a feel for what distance (not any specific situation) others have experienced with their systems.

[Teken]

I'm not having any problems.  I'm a IT professional and understand the "expected" distance for WiFi but have limited experience with INSTEON wireless.  So just trying to get a feel for what distance (not any specific situation) others have experienced with their systems.

 

From personal experience I can tell you from 90 plus installs. Once you have identified all noise makers / signal suckers that is the first step, coupled with using FilerLincs to aid in that solution. Next, it comes down to properly bridging both sides of the electrical feed with at least two dual band devices and confirming the coupling via the four tap method outlined in the users manual.

 

Once that is done I always deploy a Access Point / Range Extender in all four corners of the home, or floor, zone, level. This ensures any RF only device is XX feet from a device capable of helping move the signal to its intended device. As the others have stated I would not rely on the RF portion as the primary mode of transmission.

 

Insteon does not transmit its signal on the same power level as Z-Wave or similar counterparts.

[Brian H]

Some of the sales pages for the Dual Band Devices specify an open air  distance with no obstructions.

I have seen some say 150 feet, others greater than one hundred feet and some none specified.

[larryllix]

 

 

Insteon does not transmit its signal on the same power level as Z-Wave or similar counterparts.

Are you saying Insteon transmits more or less  power than Z-wave? Without any personal experience, I thought I have read comments indicating Z-Wave has a shorter distance capability.

[Teken]

Are you saying Insteon transmits more or less  power than Z-wave? Without any personal experience, I thought I have read comments indicating Z-Wave has a shorter distance capability.

 

I was simply stating the power output is different than z wave. It also runs on a different ISM band 908.42 and the stated distance (open air) is 100 feet vs insteons 150 feet.

 

Regardless of all the hype a mesh network is the only method to ensure consistent, reliable, and far reaching devices in the home. Playing with a few z-wave homes in my personal opinion the win goes to Insteon in terms of over all distance and reliable COM's.

 

With respect to the RF portion of the Insteon devices. If its installed into a metal junction box expect RF to be either nill or about 10-15% of the advertised spec of 150 feet.

 

Does it help, sure . . . Can the end user rely solely on a RF portion of the Insteon device, no. The only caveat is the use of the AP unit.

[Jgdavis14]

I have a dual band Outletlinc that is only 10 feet from a RemoteLInc keypad that has trouble communicating.   But there is a big bookshelf in the way and the Outletlinc is in a steel box in an old plaster wall.  Also have several motion detectors outside that are 75 feet from a dual band product and they work great.

[MikeD]

Can the end user rely solely on a RF portion of the Insteon device, no. The only caveat is the use of the AP unit.

Just wanted to add... Since installation back in 2012 my ISY, PLM, and several other IT devices are powered off of a UPS so my PLM solely relies on it's RF capability. The UPS is plugged-in to a FilterLinc. I have a DB SwitchLinc dimmer within 6 feet of the PLM, however my closest AccessPoint is about 20 feet away and down one floor. I have a few other UPS's around the house and each of those are powered through a FilterLinc.

 

I configured my PLM behind a UPS in an attempt to eliminate the possibility of it being damaged by power line spikes. I will see if this makes any difference within the next 6 months since the PLM will hit the 2 year operational mark in December.

 

~Mike

[stusviews]

Just wanted to add... Since installation back in 2012 my ISY, PLM, and several other IT devices are powered off of a UPS so my PLM solely relies on it's RF capability. The UPS is plugged-in to a FilterLinc. I have a DB SwitchLinc dimmer within 6 feet of the PLM, however my closest AccessPoint is about 20 feet away and down one floor. I have a few other UPS's around the house and each of those are powered through a FilterLinc.

 

I configured my PLM behind a UPS in an attempt to eliminate the possibility of it being damaged by power line spikes. I will see if this makes any difference within the next 6 months since the PLM will hit the 2 year operational mark in December.

 

~Mike

Once any of the devices on the UPS receives an INSTEON signal, that same signal is distributed to the other devices on the UPS via the UPS wires. And when any RF is transmitted to other devices from the UPS powered device, that receiving devices places the signal on the powerline, too.

 

But, you're giving up the advantages of dual mesh distribution. IMO, it makes sense to protect the ISY as the ISY does not communicate directly with the powerline. But the PLM does!

[Teken]

Just wanted to add... Since installation back in 2012 my ISY, PLM, and several other IT devices are powered off of a UPS so my PLM solely relies on it's RF capability. The UPS is plugged-in to a FilterLinc. I have a DB SwitchLinc dimmer within 6 feet of the PLM, however my closest AccessPoint is about 20 feet away and down one floor. I have a few other UPS's around the house and each of those are powered through a FilterLinc.

 

I configured my PLM behind a UPS in an attempt to eliminate the possibility of it being damaged by power line spikes. I will see if this makes any difference within the next 6 months since the PLM will hit the 2 year operational mark in December.

 

~Mike

 

Mike,

 

A few people have done what you did to resolve COM issues. But, in my view the better solution is to identify any noise makers / signal suckers. Also using a point of use surge outlet in place of a UPS provides you with both power line and RF capabilities.

 

Just something to consider moving forward.

[MikeD]

Stusview,

Am I really giving up the dual-mesh distribution? It is a single point of distribution via RF until it hits a dual-band device. At that point Insteon signals will probagate over the house wiring in addition to RF. I have been operating this way for over 1-1/2 years without any Insteon communication issues except for the one described below.

 

*The only drawback is placing the PLM behind a UPS will not work if you still wish to control X10 devices around the home. I still have one X10 device, the chime module, that is also behind the UPS on the same power strip as my PLM so it still functions.

 

Teken,

I chose to configure this way for the reason stated earlier. After configuring this way early on everything ran great until I used an I/O-Linc to control my garage-door opener. Occasionally I had an issue with syncronizing my KeypadLinc buttons to show the correct door status. It was discussion on this forum that pointed me towards the possibility that the opener could be a signal-sucker. This was also eliminated by running the garage-door opener through a FilterLinc.

 

I do not have a spare PLM right now but will be one of the first to order the (still in development) UDI PLM when released!

 

~Mike

[stusviews]

Yes, you are giving up the powerline capability of the PLM. I did indicate that as soon as a device receives an RF signal from the PLM, that signal is propagated on the powerline and that RF signals can be received by the PLM. But, being behind the UPS restricts the PLM to RF signals only.