Monitor sump pit level with ISY

[Flex]

I have a fairly active sump pit and currently use an Insteon 2450 I/O Linc and a float switch. There are issues of reliability with the 2450 and Insteon in general. Mostly in a power fail situation. While Insteon is fine for monitoring door opening and closings, for the sump pit I want something more robust. What I would like to do (short of purchasing an Elk system, which is an expense I would like to avoid) is to find a way to input to the ISY that is not Insteon dependent. In other posts I have seen references to networked I/O boards that can serve as two or more digital I/O points and communicate them to the ISY. But from what I have seen, the packaging leaves a lot to be desired as most are just open boards for which an enclosure is needed. Also they do not seem to be commercial or industrial quality. What I would like is something like “Digital Loggers” “Ethernet sender” It has 8 inputs and can be located anywhere on the network. Does anyone know of anything like this that will interface nicely with the ISY 994i, with the network module? In addition will the ISY send messages while it and the network is on UPS power while the PLM is not? If not is there something that can be done to work around that? If not, it would seem the Elk is the only answer, as it could perform the notifications. I am not interested in Smartenit solutions due to reported reliability and other issues with them. Any Suggestions?

 

Thank You for your consideration.

[Xathros]

The 2413S PLM can be put behind a UPS as long as you provide an RF bridge over the UPS back to the powerline.  This will cost you one hop on the insteon network but it does solve the problem of keeping the ISY operational during a power failure.  That said, you may still have problems during an outage as the PLM will be unable to communicate with the rest of the insteon network that is without power and that can back things up with queued events.

 

As for networked IO devices, I really like the RaspberryPi.  Lots of capability and possibilities there. Many of the Pi packages come with descent enclosures.  You may need to build your IO interface into a separate project box however.

 

-Xathros

[apostolakisl]

Webcontrol board, Raspberry Pi, Beagle Bone, etc.  True, they don't come with enclosures, but they all have enclosures available separately.  They are all quite reliable in the application you describe and can be inserted anywhere you like on your network, even in an outside network provided you set up port forwarding.  Personally, I have lots of experience with webcontrol board which would only require a handful of lines of code to post to ISY.  If you put your webctontrol board, router/modem/switch, and ISY on a UPS, all of this will work even in power outage.  If it is email/text notification you are looking for, then webcontrol can do that directly without ISY.  If you wanted more robust, put a cellular communicator for your internet backup.. 

[Flex]

Thank for your replies,

 

If the PLM is supplied with UPS power and queued events start to back up, would the ISY still be able to send an email message based on a data from a RaspberryPi or other device? If not, another solution may be nessesary. I want to be notified if the backup sump pump is operating, or if the pit is filling up potentially flooding the basement. I have looked at webcontrol and think I like that solution better than the PI, not having any experiance with either. I am looking for a solution with a short learning curve. I'll look at Beagle Bone as I have not heard of that before. I have looked at cell phone based sump alert systems, but they require a monthly or yearly fee.

[apostolakisl]

Thank for your replies,

 

If the PLM is supplied with UPS power and queued events start to back up, would the ISY still be able to send an email message based on a data from a RaspberryPi or other device? If not, another solution may be nessesary. I want to be notified if the backup sump pump is operating, or if the pit is filling up potentially flooding the basement. I have looked at webcontrol and think I like that solution better than the PI, not having any experiance with either. I am looking for a solution with a short learning curve. I'll look at Beagle Bone as I have not heard of that before. I have looked at cell phone based sump alert systems, but they require a monthly or yearly fee.

 

The PLM has nothing to do with network data (such as a webcontrol/raspberrypi/etc input or email/network resource command output) into and out of ISY.  Putting a UPS on the PLM is a bad idea since it elliminates all power line data in/out of the PLM forcing at least one hop each way to be rf.  Also, it accomplishes very little since pretty much none of your other Insteon devices will work in a power failure (except for battery operated stuff).

[Flex]

I figured as such, but if the PLM fails I believe the ISY goes into safe mode. So if the ISY goes to safe mode, will it still send an email or text message? I have looked at the Webcontrol board again and will likely buy one while Smarthome still has their 22% off sale. I would still like to enclose it in some way. With sump level switches hard wired to the Webcontrol board I may just rely on the Webcontrol to do the notifications via text or email. Other contact inputs could then be communicated to the ISY to perform other tasks. I wouldn't want the PLM on a UPS anyway as that would open up at least a few UPS questions, let alone dealing with the removal of a key ISY to Insteon communications route, I was looking primarily to keep the ISY from going to safe mode thus possibly affecting the ISY's ability to send a message.

 

 

[Teken]

I figured as such, but if the PLM fails I believe the ISY goes into safe mode. So if the ISY goes to safe mode, will it still send an email or text message? I have looked at the Webcontrol board again and will likely buy one while Smarthome still has their 22% off sale. I would still like to enclose it in some way. With sump level switches hard wired to the Webcontrol board I may just rely on the Webcontrol to do the notifications via text or email. Other contact inputs could then be communicated to the ISY to perform other tasks. I wouldn't want the PLM on a UPS anyway as that would open up at least a few UPS questions, let alone dealing with the removal of a key ISY to Insteon communications route, I was looking primarily to keep the ISY from going to safe mode thus possibly affecting the ISY's ability to send a message.

 

I would ask you to observe the ISY / PLM.

 

Unplug the PLM and see if the ISY stays in a good working state and can send email. Next, mimic a sustained power outage by removing the power cord from the UPS, while leaving the PLM unplugged.

 

This will also provide you a real world runtime you can expect with the load on hand.

 

What are the results?

 

Now, plug the PLM back in, with the UPS fully depleted, and plug the ISY back to utility power at the (exact same time) what are the results?

 

You may be very surprised as to how it all reacts and operates after a power outage.

[apostolakisl]

I figured as such, but if the PLM fails I believe the ISY goes into safe mode. So if the ISY goes to safe mode, will it still send an email or text message? I have looked at the Webcontrol board again and will likely buy one while Smarthome still has their 22% off sale. I would still like to enclose it in some way. With sump level switches hard wired to the Webcontrol board I may just rely on the Webcontrol to do the notifications via text or email. Other contact inputs could then be communicated to the ISY to perform other tasks. I wouldn't want the PLM on a UPS anyway as that would open up at least a few UPS questions, let alone dealing with the removal of a key ISY to Insteon communications route, I was looking primarily to keep the ISY from going to safe mode thus possibly affecting the ISY's ability to send a message.

 

You know, I am not 100% sure if safe mode stops programs that don't involve Insteon comm from executing.  I suggest you give it a try, my suspicion is that it will work.  Go ahead and write your programs that use a variable to trigger an email.  Then unplug your plm.  Then use REST commands to set the variable manually via the network.  The ISY won't know the difference between a manual REST command and the webcontrol board doing it.

 

As far as webcontrol enclosures, I have seen some sellers on ebay sell them with the custom enclosure.  There is an enclosure out there designed for it.

 

EDIT:  here is the enclosure.  http://www.ebay.com/itm/WebControl-Metal-Chassis-/260319272733?pt=Home_Automation_Kits&hash=item3c9c3cdf1d

 

EDIT again: You will also need the plug and ribbon cable for the input.  It is listed in the user manual which you can download.  I found them at a local store altex electronics.  Not sure who else would have them in stock, maybe Fry's or Radio Shack?  doubt Radio Shack, but maybe.

[ravedog]

Apostolaski: tried sending you a private message and it stopped me. Could you send me a message if that's ok?

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Flex]

Apostolaski: I went to ebay to look at the enclosure, but I still need the plug and ribbon cable, which I looked up on the web, That said, it still leaves the issue as to how best to connect the ribbon cable to the switch which is 50 feet away from where the Webcontrol board would be located. Do you or anyone else know of any ready made cable that would plug into the board and terminate into a screw terminal type block. It looks I will have to roll my own enclosure as I would like to the connections enclosed in the same enclosure as the Webcontrol board. I'll have to check to see if Phoenix contact would have anything. Once the cable is obtained it will be modified to connect to a DIN mounted terminal block or similar, unless a ready made solution is found.

 

Which Webcontrol board do most people use, the PLC firmware or the BRE version?

[apostolakisl]

PLC firmware.

 

The ribbon cable can be directly spliced to a cat5 or some other wire, you can use a screw down blocks, or you can punch it into a female cat5.  What I have done is punch the ribbon cable into a female cat5 plug and then use standard cat5 patch cable to connect other stuff.  That gets you 8 conductors which will be several more than I would expect you would need.

 

You can cut an extra hole in that enclosure to mount the cat5.  Or whatever.