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Choose Indigo Pro or ISY994i ?

RichP

By RichP
in ISY994

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RichP Newbie

RichP

Posted
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Almost bought a SmartThings hub last week on a whim, but decided to do some homework and came across Indigo, openHAB, Home Assistant and the ISY994i (z-wave).

 

Quickly eliminated openHAB & Home Assistant as I don't have the time/patience to configure those two.

 

Installed the demo of Indigo on my Imac and pretty quickly got my DSC Alarm, Nest and Squeezebox configured and working.

 

I can't get any of my Android devices to pair with their Android app for some reason but hope that will get worked out soon. 

 

Before I made the final commitment and order a usb z-wave controller and some switches/motion sensors I got stuck with Garage Door controllers. Indigo doesn't support MYQ or any z-wave GDOs.

 

This led me to start looking at the ISY994i but alas I cannot demo that box without spending $209 on Amazon.

 

The slow pace of z-wave additions On Indigo also has me a little concerned. It's too bad because the app is very easy to setup and program.

Indigo is also lacking inbound IFTTT. 

 

Has anyone else decided between the 2 or moved to an ISY994i from Indigo?

 

My list of needs are:

 

  • DSC Alarm integration (want to be able to use DSC alarm zones to trigger events)
  • Nest Integration (ability to poll temps and also set to auto-away when DSC is armed)
  • MYQ or Z-wave Garage Door Integration
  • Android app
 

I have a Mac that is on 24/7 so I don't mind running some helper apps on it for some of the integration like DSCLink.

 

Appreciate your help!

 

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builderb Experienced

builderb

Posted
Posted

I made the move from Indigo to the ISY a couple of years ago, so I might be able to offer some observations that will be of assistance:

 

I wouldn't consider the Nest plugin (which I still use, by the way) to be a native integration with Indigo. It's a plugin, written by a member of the community. There are many fine Indigo plug-ins available, but they are subject to the development whims of people who may or may not have an interest in maintaining them long-term. Originally I was using a different Nest plugin, but Nest made some change to their API and it broke, and the original developer never published an updated version. Eventually another community member wrote Yet Another Nest Thermostat Plugin in it's place.

 

Another consideration is that the next version of Indigo will be a subscription service. I still get their promotional material, and a recent email spelled out their pricing plan for version 7, which should be coming sometime this year. You will now be buying the license on a yearly basis, after which you will no longer receive "major and minor updates" without renewing your annual subscription. 

 

There is a lot to like about Indigo, however. The user interface is what I wish the ISY was like. Because you're on OS X, you can use Indigo to run AppleScripts to do all kinds of crazy stuff with relative ease. All the stuff that you use a Raspberry Pi for with the ISY happens on the same machine as your automation software. The plugins are super easy for a novice to install and run. In fact, the whole thing is easy to use. It can handle digest authentication. And under normal circumstances, there is more computing horsepower available to the software than an automation system could possibly need. Running it on a Mini, as I do, means it's power consumption is incredibly low, for what it can do.

 

Ultimately a couple things swayed me to move to the ISY. First, the always-on nature of the device. If power is supplied to the wall wart, the ISY is on. If the power went out on the Mac, it took a button press to turn it on, which meant that things could be out until someone arrived home, despite the power coming back on. Another thing was that as the home automation system became a critical piece of infrastructure around the home, the thought of the cost of equipment failure arose. With so much now dependent upon this central hub, if it fails, it needs to be replaced immediately, and a new Mini is a lot more than a new ISY. And finally, the ISY has more depth of control available. For instance, Indigo can do if-then, but not if-then-else, like the ISY. Indigo's ease of use and clarity of UI is, in part, achieved though streamlining and simplicity. It's a balancing act. The ISY is less friendly to the novice, but to power users there's no substitute. 

 

These days, I'm still running both. The ISY handles the bulk of my automation tasks, including managing the Insteon network. I'm still using Indigo for presence detection (the Smartphone Radar plugin is the most reliable presence detection system I've used yet, although not as flexible as I'd like) and for my Nest integration. That may change now that the new Nest node for Polyglot is out. And I don't see myself continuing to use Indigo once the version I'm running now ceases to be supported. 

 

I can't speak to the alarm panel portion, since I don't have one of those yet, but I'd just say that if you want native integration, the ISY / Elk pair is about as close as you're going to get in this market segment. The alarm plugins to Indigo are just that, plugins. They are not officially supported by Indigo any more than the original Nest plugin was. Not saying it won't work fine, just noting the difference, since that was one of your criteria. And I have to admit to some trepidation at the thought of giving control over an alarm system to a plugin that may (or may not) have been written be someone without much in the way of security chops.  

 

Anyway, hope that helps. Indigo is a fine piece of software, but personally, I like the ISY a bit better.

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RichP Newbie

RichP

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Hi Michel,

 

Do these helper apps for Nest & DSC absolutely have to be run on a RPi? Seems like they could be run on my iMac or in a VM on my iMac.

The cost of a RPi isn't really prohibitive, but just don't feel like adding another box to the mix if I don't have too.

 

I don't need native integration, just integrations that works.

 

Thanks!

 

Rich

 

 

 

Hi RichP,

Thanks so very much for your interest. As much as we would love you to have an ISY, if you wish to have native integration with Nest and DSC, then ISY would not be the right choice for you since both need an RPi in the middle. Sorry.

With kind regards,
Michel

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RichP Newbie

RichP

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Builder B,

 

Thanks for the well written informative reply!

 

I am Ok with non-native solutions for the ISY for Nest & DSC. I may do something like this and run them in a VirtualBox if they must be on an RPi: http://dbakevlar.com/2015/08/emulating-a-raspberry-pi-on-virtualbox/ or I'll just pick an RPi and run that and that ISY on a dedicated battery backup.

 

Also this seems like a huge plus: "Indigo can do if-then, but not if-then-else, like the ISY". 

 

I worry about some of those older Indigo plugins not working when they upgrade to Version 7 as well.

 

Thanks Again!

 

 

I made the move from Indigo to the ISY a couple of years ago, so I might be able to offer some observations that will be of assistance:

 

I wouldn't consider the Nest plugin (which I still use, by the way) to be a native integration with Indigo. It's a plugin, written by a member of the community. There are many fine Indigo plug-ins available, but they are subject to the development whims of people who may or may not have an interest in maintaining them long-term. Originally I was using a different Nest plugin, but Nest made some change to their API and it broke, and the original developer never published an updated version. Eventually another community member wrote Yet Another Nest Thermostat Plugin in it's place.

 

Another consideration is that the next version of Indigo will be a subscription service. I still get their promotional material, and a recent email spelled out their pricing plan for version 7, which should be coming sometime this year. You will now be buying the license on a yearly basis, after which you will no longer receive "major and minor updates" without renewing your annual subscription. 

 

There is a lot to like about Indigo, however. The user interface is what I wish the ISY was like. Because you're on OS X, you can use Indigo to run AppleScripts to do all kinds of crazy stuff with relative ease. All the stuff that you use a Raspberry Pi for with the ISY happens on the same machine as your automation software. The plugins are super easy for a novice to install and run. In fact, the whole thing is easy to use. It can handle digest authentication. And under normal circumstances, there is more computing horsepower available to the software than an automation system could possibly need. Running it on a Mini, as I do, means it's power consumption is incredibly low, for what it can do.

 

Ultimately a couple things swayed me to move to the ISY. First, the always-on nature of the device. If power is supplied to the wall wart, the ISY is on. If the power went out on the Mac, it took a button press to turn it on, which meant that things could be out until someone arrived home, despite the power coming back on. Another thing was that as the home automation system became a critical piece of infrastructure around the home, the thought of the cost of equipment failure arose. With so much now dependent upon this central hub, if it fails, it needs to be replaced immediately, and a new Mini is a lot more than a new ISY. And finally, the ISY has more depth of control available. For instance, Indigo can do if-then, but not if-then-else, like the ISY. Indigo's ease of use and clarity of UI is, in part, achieved though streamlining and simplicity. It's a balancing act. The ISY is less friendly to the novice, but to power users there's no substitute. 

 

These days, I'm still running both. The ISY handles the bulk of my automation tasks, including managing the Insteon network. I'm still using Indigo for presence detection (the Smartphone Radar plugin is the most reliable presence detection system I've used yet, although not as flexible as I'd like) and for my Nest integration. That may change now that the new Nest node for Polyglot is out. And I don't see myself continuing to use Indigo once the version I'm running now ceases to be supported. 

 

I can't speak to the alarm panel portion, since I don't have one of those yet, but I'd just say that if you want native integration, the ISY / Elk pair is about as close as you're going to get in this market segment. The alarm plugins to Indigo are just that, plugins. They are not officially supported by Indigo any more than the original Nest plugin was. Not saying it won't work fine, just noting the difference, since that was one of your criteria. And I have to admit to some trepidation at the thought of giving control over an alarm system to a plugin that may (or may not) have been written be someone without much in the way of security chops.  

 

Anyway, hope that helps. Indigo is a fine piece of software, but personally, I like the ISY a bit better.

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builderb Experienced

builderb

Posted
Posted

Are sellers really asking more for the RPi 3 considering its supposed to be $35.00 for either one?!?

Depends where you buy it. But the Pi Foundation cut the price of the 2 when the 3 was released, which is what I was referring to. The Pi 3 board should be about $35, with the Pi 2 available at about $25, although most places add ~$5 in shipping costs. Plus the standard disclaimer that you'll also need a microSD card, and power supply if you do not have spares laying around. A case is also highly recommended. All told, it's a $60 computer.

 

Plus you'll need a mouse, keyboard, hdmi cable, and hdmi monitor during setup.

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RichP Newbie

RichP

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BTW, I gave getting openHAB2 running on my Imac a good effort because it does support everything I need (DSC, NEST, MYQ, Android,Squeezebox, Native IFTTT) but it's waaaaaaaay too much work for me and/or I'm not that skilled. 

 

I'm sure if I stuck with it another 100 hours I would get it all working (or not!)

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