Carrier AC Thermostat replacement

[EnvisionIT]

Bought the new Insteon Heat Pump Thermostat 2732-242

 

I have a Carrier AC/Heat Pump (no furnace) system.   I have 2 units in a multi zone system, i.e. one air handler has 2 zones, and the other air handler is a 3 zone system, so I have 5 thermostats in the house.

 

I opened one of the thermostats on the 3 zone system, and the wires are as follows:

 

Red       - RH  (plus there is a jumper wire that goes from RH to D1)

Green    - G

Orange  - Y/Y2

Brown    - C

Blue       - O/W2/B

Yellow    - Y1/W2

White     - OAT

Black     - SRTN

 

On the 2732 I see the following:

 

24VCOM

24RH

O/B

AUX

G

Y1

Y2

 

 

I assume the following connections:

 

Red (RB)            - 24VCOM

Blue (O/W2/B)    - O/B

Green (G)           - G

Yellow (Y1/W2)   - Y1

Orange (Y/Y2)    - Y2

 

Not sure what to place in AUX or what do to with all the other wires on the original Carrier Thermostat.

 

The current model of Carrier Thermostat I have is:

 

http://www.carrier.com/residential/en/us/products/thermostats/tp-prh01-b/

 

Will the Insteon thermostat work in a multi zone environment like I have?

Anyone have any thoughts on the connections?

 

Thanks.

[larryllix]

Are these thermostats connected to a central zone control panel?

 

Do the slave stats communicate with the master zone?

[EnvisionIT]

Yes each one of the systems has a zone controller box.  White box with led's on it next to the air handlers.

 

I'm not sure I have slave stats.  All of the 5 stats in the house look identical and can each turn on / off the A/C.  Each has their own programming, on / off times and temp.

[EnvisionIT]

Also, I do not have the Infinity series,  I have the Performance series Carrier Units.

[stusviews]

Connecting wire randomly (assuming) may cause damage to your system. At this point, the Insteon thermostat is probably unlit. Unfortunately, I've been unable to locate an installation manual for your thermostat, but some wiring is clear, some is not. It's possible that you many not be able to use the Insteon thermostat.

 

1. RB has a jumper to D1. D1 is a dry contact relay for a humidifier. Do you have one. Also, are you sure the terminal reads RB and not RH or RC? If so, then the red wire should connect to 24R.

2. The brown wire should connect to 24COM.

 

With nothing else connected the thermostat should be lit. If not, post back.

 

3. You indicated that yellow originally connected to Y1/W2. That doesn't make sense, Y is for cooling, W is for heat.

4. OAT and STRN are for an external temperature sensor. The Insteon thermostat does not accommodate an external sensor.

 

5. Do you have 1 or 2 heating stages? 1 or 2 cooling stages?

6. Do you have auxiliary heat?

[EnvisionIT]

Ok got a flashlight and double checked.

 

1. Red Wire is connected to RH not RB

2. Yellow wire is connected to Y1/W2

 

I do NOT have a humidifier on the system.

I do have Aux Heat, i.e. heat bars in the systems.

I believe I have 2 stage cooling, not positive, but remember discussing it with builder.

 

I found the following guide for commercial installations, i'm in a house but it shows the exact thermostat I have and the correct naming of the terminals

 

http://www.utcccs-cdn.com/hvac/docs/1009/Public/0F/TP-PRHB-01SI.pdf

 

 

On the right side i have the following labels:

 

RC

RH           Red

W/W1

G             Green

Y/Y2        Orange

C             Brown

O/W2/B   Blue

Y1/W2     Yellow

 

Left side

OAT         White

RRS

SRTN       Black

HUM

D1            Red Connected from RH

D2

V+

VG

[stusviews]

What is the result after connecting only red to 24R and brown to 24COM?

[EnvisionIT]

Connecting Red and Brown lights up the stat.

 

I went ahead and connected the remaining wires, set the unit to 75deg cold cycle.

 

Came back in 30 min and temp in the room is 85deg, hot, it was 78 or so to start.  So it not working as expected.

 

Current Configuration:

 

Red = 24R

Brown = 24COM

Green = G

Yellow = Y1

Orange = Y2

Blue = O/B

 

I'm gonna disconnect the stat at this time since it is def not working as expected.

 

I did find another link to an installer manual for the carrier stat, but I do not see anything specifically wrong with the wires as I have them connected.

 

http://www.utcccs-cdn.com/hvac/docs/1009/Public/01/TP-PRH-10SI.pdf

 

I added a picture of the original stat configuration on the original post

[stusviews]

Your wiring shows that you have a "user interface." Do you know what that is?

[EnvisionIT]

Only thing I can think of is the Aprilaire 5000 filter.  It is wired to activate when the airhandler is on.

[stusviews]

Disconnect both the orange and yellow wires. Connect the orange wire to Y1, set the thermostat to cool. What's the result?

[larryllix]

The Y1/W2 needs to be sorted out.

 

Keep following Stu. He'll get you sorted out.

[apostolakisl]

When you say you have a "white" controller at the air handler, do you mean a Rodgers-White brand, or do you mean that is a box that is the color white?

 

Rodgers-White zone controllers I have had follow the standard universal wiring scheme and accept any thermostat that also follows that standard.

 

If the colors are confusing you, check the wires at the controller to know what wire is performing what function.

 

There isn't really any fancy magic with a zone controller.  It just accepts the instruction from the thermostat the same as the furnace would directly, except it also opens/closes the appropriate damper.  The only other thing is that if one zone calls for heat and another calls for cool, it will put the one on hold until the other is finished.

[larryllix]

My zone controller talks to the mixer and the other stats. Some sort of analogue data is passed for amount of heat for each zone needed, as well as time, time of day information from the central schedule, what profile to follow, and whether heating, cooling, auto, etc..

[apostolakisl]

My zone controller talks to the mixer and the other stats. Some sort of analogue data is passed for amount of heat for each zone needed, as well as time, time of day information from the central schedule, what profile to follow, and whetehr heating, coolong, auto, etc..

I have used two brands.

 

Rodgers White

Honeywell

 

Both used stock thermostats with standard thermostat wiring.  They just call for cool or heat and the zone controller does the rest.  EDIT: or fan of course too.  There is no "I need cool really bad or I need just a little cool"

[stusviews]

I have used two brands.

 

Rodgers White

Honeywell

 

Both used stock thermostats with standard thermostat wiring.  They just call for cool or heat and the zone controller does the rest.  EDIT: or fan of course too.  There is no "I need cool really bad or I need just a little cool"

 

My Honeywell voice thermostat responds to, "I need cool really bad or I need just a little cool"

[larryllix]

Yeah, it's a little different need for heating large thermal mass radiators. You can't run a "bang-bang" thermostat technique or you can expect to overshoot your setpoint by 5-10 degrees for about 24 hours.

 

EDIT: mind you the analogue portion can be done between the zone handler and the mixer too on some systems. This one makes some claims about benefits of each zone reporting graduated needs but never discloses what it actually does.

 

@Stu: When I ask for a little cool I just get my favourite music.

[apostolakisl]

This is what I have at my office.

 

https://forwardthinking.honeywell.com/new/50-9420.pdf

 

I have two of these controlling two heat pumps with 3 zones on each (one zone not used).

 

It does allow for multi stages of heat and cool, but my heat pumps are single stage.  Though do have aux heat.

[larryllix]

Trouble with these complex systems, and my home has five zones using these stats, is that when you have a problem, the "pros" come in, have no idea what to do, do not understand the system, and just offer to rip it out and put in a system they understand and can work with.

 

http://tekmarcontrols.com/images/_literature/546_d_06.pdf

 

I am a logic control system guy and love this stuff but....

Two of my stats have about 500 settings in each one that most people have never heard of and can't begin to know how to set them.

 

With that in mind, I was trying to replace my main stat with something more simple for the WAF, and remote control and HA but simpler is just that, no features that you become dependent on.

 

Each winter and summer I change my stats to a custom setback schedule to suit the profile of the season for best HVAC. Removing a simple feature like shared schedules means I not only have to go around and change every schedule in five stats, I have to reprogramme them twice per year and document the schedule I determined from last year.

 

How about schedule profiles? I have not only vacations and home profiles, I have several home profiles.

 

I keep remote bedrooms on much lower temperature settings, when guests are not present. With that profile, the bedroom zones are on vacation settings, while "main" zones are running normal schedules. With a flick of a setting, "Guest" profile is entered, and suddenly remote bedrooms are in sync with the main part of the house, following their custom temperature settings for morning, day, evening, and sleep times.

 

Without stats that talk to each other most of this isn't possible. I could give this up and get five smart thermostats and dedicate an ISY or some other logic control box to the job. It would be much cheaper than the $1200 thermostat I am using.

 

Do I have the energy to do it? Not any more or the foolishness to attempt it.