Still trying to understand Zwave Switch functionalty with ISY

[trevorst]

I have several Zwave switches installed now, a couple of Gocontrol WD500z-1 that do not provide status from manual operation and a GE switch that does provide status when used manualy.

 

However the GE can only use the status function to contol other devlices, the control function (On/Offf) do not work even though the ISY is getting the updates. Is this normal for Zwave switches functionality with ISY.??

 

Both brands of switch work fine from ISY Initiated commands.

 

Also I am aware of the patent issue with some switch brands such as the Go Control ones I have, and as I stated the GE switch does give feedback when manualy operated.

[stusviews]

A Z-wave device is not an Insteon scene controller. Use a program.

[trevorst]

I am aware that Zwave can not control or be added to scenes, my question pertains to using Zwave device in a program and the fact that I can not use the Contol parameter when manualy using the switch in an "if" statement , only the Status works with a Zwave switch.

 

Thanks for replying though.

[MWareman]

This lack of status is normal for zwave devices made more than a few months ago and where the manufacturer hadn't licensed the patent from Lutron.

 

More recent (and older licensed devices) send instant status, and can be programmed accordingly.

 

I can trigger a program with ''If ZW009 Dimmer is switched on' just fine with a post-patent device (the Homeseer dimmer).

 

The limitation observed by the OP is a dimmer device limitation - not an ISY limitation.

[trevorst]

Sorry if I sound frustrated in this post, but I clearly state that I am aware of the patent issue with switches... Two of my switches have that issue and I don't expect them to respond... The issue is that my GE switch DOES send status to the ISY when switching the switch on manualy. However I can onlu use the status percentage options in an "if" statement, a Control On/Off parameter can not be used.

My question is: Is this a normal expectation from a Zwave switch that DOES send out status on manual operation, in short will any Zwave switch allow the use of the Control option in Zwave or is Status the only thing that will work in a program "if" statement.

 

Just trying to understand what can/can't be done with Zwave before I start serious deployment.

[MWareman]

I should caveat my post. My Homeseer zwave switch (the only zwave dimmer I currently have) is connected to my test ISY (v5.0.4). It's possible that Status is available there, but not on 4.x. due to the new node framework.

 

Michael.

[oberkc]

My question is: Is this a normal expectation from a Zwave switch that DOES send out status on manual operation, in short will any Zwave switch allow the use of the Control option in Zwave or is Status the only thing that will work in a program "if" statement.

 

My experience with z-wave switches is limited to exactly ONE.  With that switch, I can use only "status" as a program condition.  "Control" conditions seem not to work.  I do not know if the normal expectation, nor who gets to define "normal". 

 

I must have gotten lucky with my switch.  ISY knows when the switch changes status, including when controlled manually.  I guess it is one that reports back. 

 

My limited z-wave experience so far (ISY ver 4.3.26, I think, definitely not moved to v5) is that Z-wave devices can be added to scenes as responders, and this tends to work, but not scene controllers.  For this, a program is required.

[mwester]

I have one that doesn't do instant status, if that makes a difference.  For that one, with 5.0.4, I've observed that ON/OFF cannot be used in conditions; I have to use the percentages instead.  I just chalked this up to an issue with the alpha software and gave it no further thought.

[MWareman]

My Homeseer dimmer (does support instant status) can be used with 'control' on or off in a program, and it triggers just fine (on 5.0.4).

 

I think the lack of instant status matters when using 'control' against a zwave dimmer.

[mwester]

My Homeseer dimmer (does support instant status) can be used with 'control' on or off in a program, and it triggers just fine (on 5.0.4).

 

I think the lack of instant status matters when using 'control' against a zwave dimmer.

Perhaps -- but in my case, I'm using status.  And have found that one cannot compare the status of a z-wave dimmer to "ON" or "OFF", instead one must compare to percentages.  I think that's what the original poster observed, and questioned -- not whether or not a z-wave device does "instant status" and thus does control.

[trevorst]

Perhaps -- but in my case, I'm using status.  And have found that one cannot compare the status of a z-wave dimmer to "ON" or "OFF", instead one must compare to percentages.  I think that's what the original poster observed, and questioned -- not whether or not a z-wave device does "instant status" and thus does control.

Thank you for understanding and clarifying my question.. That is exactly what I observed.

[trevorst]

So I am still trying to understand the capabilities of these switches with ISY. I picked up one of the Homeseer switches that MWareman stated worked with "Control", and switching on from the Admin screen I agree it does.

But switching it on at the wall does not, you have to use status for it to work in an if statement.

So I now have three different brand of swithches, two of which provide instant status, but neither will trigger an "if" statement with the "control" function when manualy turned on at the wall.

[oberkc]

But switching it on at the wall does not, you have to use status for it to work in an if statement

 

 

That is consistent with my experience, also.

[MWareman]

My Homeseer switch, when switched manually at the device, triggers a program on 'Control'. However, this is on my test 5.0.4 ISY - so it may not be functional on earlier versions....

[trevorst]

My Homeseer switch, when switched manually at the device, triggers a program on 'Control'. However, this is on my test 5.0.4 ISY - so it may not be functional on earlier versions....

Thanks MWareman..

Sounds like that could be the case. I was hoping one of the ISY team would jump in and confirm.

[Chris Jahn]

The control/status events available from Z-Wave switches depend upon the command classes they support and possibly custom configuration parameters.  Generally speaking though, if the ISY can detect a button press from a switch you should see both a status event (ST) and a control event ('DON'/'DOF', etc.) from that switch.  Different ISY versions have varying support of this (sorry I don't have the details).

 

e.g.  Simple programs that turn an Insteon light On/Off using a Z-Wave switch

 

Off - [ID 0016][Parent 0018]

If
        'ZW 047 On-Off Power Switch' is switched Off
 
Then
        Set 'Insteon / 07.CF.46.1' Off
 
Else
   - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action')
 



-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
On - [ID 0015][Parent 0018]

If
        'ZW 047 On-Off Power Switch' is switched On
 
Then
        Set 'Insteon / 07.CF.46.1' On
 
Else
   - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action')

 

[rafarataneneces]

This lack of status is normal for zwave devices made more than a few months ago and where the manufacturer hadn't licensed the patent from Lutron.

 

More recent (and older licensed devices) send instant status, and can be programmed accordingly.

 

I can trigger a program with ''If ZW009 Dimmer is switched on' just fine with a post-patent device (the Homeseer dimmer).

 

The limitation observed by the OP is a dimmer device limitation - not an ISY limitation.

 

The more I learn about Z-Wave, the more I am convinced to stick with Insteon, but use Z-Wave fantastic products, not as responders, but as part of Programs.

 

Example,

1) use Insteon Hidden Door Sensor to open the lights of the Dressing Room.

2) Use Fibaro Z-Wave Motion Sensor in order to run a program that monitors temperature on the master room.

 

RULES

1) Buy Insteon if I want to use that device as part of a scene. If I want to use it as a controller

2) Buy Z-Wave if I need a reading for a program

 

I would also say, I could buy Z-Wave Lock Controllers since I don't use that as part of a scene

[trevorst]

The more I learn about Z-Wave, the more I am convinced to stick with Insteon, but use Z-Wave fantastic products, not as responders, but as part of Programs.

 

Example,

1) use Insteon Hidden Door Sensor to open the lights of the Dressing Room.

2) Use Fibaro Z-Wave Motion Sensor in order to run a program that monitors temperature on the master room.

 

RULES

1) Buy Insteon if I want to use that device as part of a scene. If I want to use it as a controller

2) Buy Z-Wave if I need a reading for a program

 

I would also say, I could buy Z-Wave Lock Controllers since I don't use that as part of a scene

I think I am starting to agree with you... Seems Z Wave is a non standard standard.. Where every mfg does what ever they please.

[stusviews]

Z-Wave manufacturers can do as they please as long as what they do adheres to the established and agreed upon standards. One company added a feature and patented and licensed it. That patent has recently expired.