Whole House One-Way Communication Issue

[shifmeister]

Hello all,

 

I am having some peculiar issues with my ISY setup that, up until recently, has been performing beyond expectations.  My ISY and Insteon setup has been running with about 50 or so devices, mostly lighting controls.

 

However, starting about the second week of December I have had some odd communication issues in which all my devices have stopped reporting status to the ISY.

 

Here is a quick summary:

• When manually activating any switch or KPL button, linked scenes behave properly, but the ISY does not update the device status.  There is zero activity in the Event Viewer Level 3.
• Switching devices or scenes through the admin console works perfectly fine.  Device status is updated correctly.  Event Viewer seems to be showing that everyone is talking fine, but I can't decipher it all.  Switching through Mobilinc or Home Assistant produces same results.
• Query and Beep work as expected.
• This started for all Insteon devices at the same time.

 

I first thought it was a PLM issue.  I had the failed power supply that I repaired in July of this year.  So, I bought a brand new one and after doing the replacement through the admin console, the problem still remains.

 

I may have been moving some electronics around at this time, but nothing new of note was bought and plugged in.  This is the first comms issue I have had in almost 4 years.

 

Any insight would be very appreciated.  Thanks.

[paulbates]

The evidence does suggest PLM problems:

• Links between lighting devices work
• Direct commands from the ISY are recieved and returned
• The ISY does not pick up network activity

The last bullet means that the ISY does not have links in its table matching the devices on the Insteon network, so it doesn't respond. This is typically a sign of a PLM on its way to dying. 

 

You can try in the admin console; File - Restore PLM. If it works, it will probably be temporary

 

Paul

[stusviews]

What else is on the same circuit as the PLM?

[kingzen]

This has happened to me too. I have been struggling with this for a couple of months. I too thought initially it was a PLM problem, but have tried three since (original PLM that was less than 12 months old, a warranty swap and a new one purchased from Amazon) and the same behavior occurs. After I restore PLM modem through the console, everything works fine for between a few days and a few weeks, then suddenly the ISY stops receiving traffic and the PLM links table appears empty. A PLM restore fixes things again.

 

The fact that it has happened on three different PLMs (all V2.2) makes it hard to believe it's the PLM. The only other major change I made was to purchase and install the Z-Wave module a couple of months ago.

[Teken]

This has happened to me too. I have been struggling with this for a couple of months. I too thought initially it was a PLM problem, but have tried three since (original PLM that was less than 12 months old, a warranty swap and a new one purchased from Amazon) and the same behavior occurs. After I restore PLM modem through the console, everything works fine for between a few days and a few weeks, then suddenly the ISY stops receiving traffic and the PLM links table appears empty. A PLM restore fixes things again.

 

The fact that it has happened on three different PLMs (all V2.2) makes it hard to believe it's the PLM. The only other major change I made was to purchase and install the Z-Wave module a couple of months ago.

 

Can you offer what the white sticker indicates as the production date of the three PLM's on the back. Along with what the ISY notes as the firmware in place?

[kingzen]

The ISY reports the PLM is v9E. One PLM is V2.2 1629. The other is V2.2 1622. I returned the third one so can't tell what it's date code was.

[paulbates]

My PLM is installed right a my electrical panel, near a furnace that had PSC motor. When I first installed Insteon, that old PSC motor would "destroy" PLMs after a week or so of operation and I went through a couple before I figured it out.. sounds very similar to what you just described. I had to put a noise filter on the motor and that fixed...(until the furnace was replaced)

 

What noise sources (big motors, appliances, etc) are near the PLM>

 

Paul

 

The ISY reports the PLM is v9E. One PLM is V2.2 1629. The other is V2.2 1622. I returned the third one so can't tell what it's date code was.

 

[Michel Kohanim]

Hi shifmeister,

 

As everyone else suggested, I do think the issue is PLM related. Please take a look at:

http://wiki.universal-devices.com/index.php?title=INSTEON_No_Status_Feedback_From_Devices

 

With kind regards,

Michel

[kingzen]

Interesting thought about noisy devices blanking the PLM. I haven't installed anything recently around the time the problem started occurring except the previously mentioned Z-Wave module, and I have filters liberally deployed on items like UPSs. Nevertheless I might try move the PLM and ISY to a different part of the house and see if that resolves it.

 

I agree with Michael that it seems to be a PLM issue, but I'm not sure replacing the PLM again will solve the problem given I've tried three different V2.2 PLMs.

 

BTW I also tried to restore a backup from a month or so ago (going back further would mean re-creating quite a lot) but that didn't solve it.

[Teken]

The ISY reports the PLM is v9E. One PLM is V2.2 1629. The other is V2.2 1622. I returned the third one so can't tell what it's date code was.

 

Much thanks for the follow up for the production dates / firmware in place etc. I only ask because this helps the forum members and I track possible issues.

[stusviews]

I'll ask again, what else is on the same circuit as the PLM?

[kingzen]

Lamps, PCs, TVs, small electronics. UPS on a different socket on the same circuit is behind a Filterlinc. No large motors / refrigerator / washer, etc. 

[stusviews]

PCs and TVs are sometimes a problem. Small electronics nearly always interfere with Insteon signals. Lamps with LED or CFL bulbs can also interfere. Unplug everything as a test. Turning things off is inadequate, they must be unplugged or disconnected.

[shifmeister]

Kingzen, it sounds like we are having similar issues.

 

Michel, I hadn't found that wiki page as part of my research.  According to the ISY, the PLM only has 79 links, well below the 900 limit.

 

My old PLM was V1.B 1325 and its new replacement is V2.2 1635 with a v9.E firmware.

 

 

My ISY might be on the same circuit as my TV, but is has been there for years.  It is at the other end of the room as a central spot for Zwave coverage.  I have no filters installed anywhere as I haven't had any interference issues yet.  Why fix something that's not broken?

 

I can try to move the ISY around and stuff that is on the same circuit as it and see what I find.  It's just odd that this happened at a time when nothing new electrical was added to the house.  I suppose it could be a CFL bulb or motor failing and starting to pump out some RF nasties.

 

 

Ran anther Update PLM and am getting the error: "Could not open config file to read /CONF/1C8014.REC"  Is this perhaps signs of an SD card issue?

[stusviews]

shifmeister,

 

Electronics age, as they do they sometimes put noise on the powerline. LED and especially CFL bulbs can age more quickly. Same advice, unplug and/or disconnect everything on that same circuit as the PLM. You can also try powering the PLM from a different circuit using an (long) extension cord.

[shifmeister]

Ok. So, I think I may be back up and running.  Spent a good while last night on debugging.

 

Plugging the PLM and ISY into another circuit wan't helpful.  Neither was disconnecting some suspect CFLs nearby.

 

I ended up doing a backup of the ISY, then restoring the same backup.  Then, did a Restore PLY and Restore Devices command.  ISY is plugged back into where it started and now everything seems to be communicating again.

 

At this point, I am not sure if my old PLM failed or not.  I will continue running on the new one and keep the old as an emergency backup.

 

 

On the backup and restores, I was still getting the "Could not open config file to read /CONF/1C8014.REC" error.  Any ideas on this?

 

Thanks for all the help.

 

On the backup and restores, I was still getting the "Could not open config file to read /CONF/1C8014.REC" error.  Any ideas on this?

 

[shifmeister]

So, I may have a clue about my read error regarding /CONF/1C8014.REC.  It seems it pops up when I try to Restore Device to a certain dimmer switch, which coincidentally has the address 1C 80 14.

 

Michel, any known cause for something like this, or way to repair it?

[kingzen]

I am still having the problem of the PLM links table blanking. I have moved the PLM to a different circuit and it re-occured after a day or two. The PLM still shows connected under PLM info/status but the links table is blank. A restore PLM sets things right again... I'll switch to the spare PLM (also V2.2) and see if it happens again, although the exact same thing has happened with this spare PLM in the past too.

[Michel Kohanim]

Hi shifmeister,

 

Most probably a corrupt file. You might want to restore your backup or remove that device and link it back.

 

Hi kingzen,

 

If you keep losing PLM links, then the PLM is dying and must be replaced.

 

With kind regards,

Michel

[kingzen]

I'm still at a loss. I understand that the hypothesis is that if the PLM keeps losing links, it must be dying and be replaced. I just ordered a brand new PLM (my 4th recent one, all V2.2 hardware) from Amazon, installed it yesterday (with the ISY powered down), did a factory reset of the PLM and restored it. Less than 24 hours later, on the brand new PLM, it has lost all the links in the table again. I've moved the PLM and ISY to three different locations and circuits in the house. Same fault. I've restored a backup from a month ago. Ditto.

 

The next thing I'll try (it's a long shot) is remove the z-wave module, because it could be a coincidence, but the PLM blanking appeared to start happening around the time I installed this.

 

Thanks for everyone's help. Will keep trying different things.

[kingzen]

Oh, and I've also changed the "serial" cable between the ISY and PLM.

[tracknut]

Curiously I have the very same problem as the OP - as if insteon communications works from the ISY/PLM outbound, but all devices do not communicate back to the ISY. I was googling and found this thread. Also starting within the last week.

 

Swapped out my PLM rev 2.0 with a spare of rev 2.2 today, and did the various PLM and Device restores, and things seem to be working (now just for a few hours). I think I will let it run for a couple days to make sure things work, then try to put the old PLM back in place to see if I really needed a new PLM, or maybe just the restoring of all the devices was what really solved the problem.

 

Thanks to those posting here, I probably would have spent a lot more time working this issue if I hadn't seen this thread.

[Michel Kohanim]

Hi kingzen,

 

Z-Wave has absolutely nothing to do with this. Please return your new PLM back to Amazon. Call SmartHome and "specifically" tell them that your PLM keeps dying.

 

With kind regards,

Michel

[tracknut]

To close out my part of this situation, having put in a new PLM and "restored" it to have it work for a few days, I have now put back in the old PLM. Did the "restore plm", and it has now been working for 2 days. Assuming no surprises then, it seems it was more of a software data corruption issue than a hardware failure of the plm. I don't know where all the various data stores are, so I won't speculate further about the problem.

[kingzen]

Still having troubles. Called SmartHome and they sent me a new PLM, this time a new version: V2.3 date code 4216. Firmware is still v9E. Factory reset and restored modem and it lost all links within 12 hours. Have also tried yet another circuit in the house. Have also tried formatting and restoring a backup to a new microSD (didn't expect that to solve it).

 

Will call SmartHome again tomorrow...