KeyPadLinc LED Status

[vcholman]

Hello All,

 

I know this subject will be old and users tired of reading about this subject. However I'm new to this ISY world and my head is spinning trying to understand how to correctly setup my KeyPadLincs.

 

I've searched high and low on these forums and Google searched, I can't seem to find a simple and straight answer.

 

Here is what I want to do....

 

Using a 8 button KeyPadLinc, I want to be able to assign each button to control a Insteon wall switch. I would llike the LED inside the KeyPadLinc to light up when the wall switch is on, I also want the KeyPadLinc status LED to light-up if the associated switch is turned on by another controller.

 

Here's were my confussion starts.

 

 

Can this be accomplished using SCENES or do I needd to use Variables in s programs?

 

Does Universal Devices have examples for all the various functions that users would like to use?

 

I would appreicate any suggestions or samples how to accomplish this what should be a simple tasks.

 

Thank you,

 

V

[oberkc]

Yes, use scenes. Create a scene to include switch and button, both as controllers.

 

Only example from udi of which I am aware is the user manuals and wiki.

 

For this to work via another controller (?) you would control the scene rather than individual devices. It may be a good idea for you to elaborate on your intentions re "another controller".

[stusviews]

Seems to me that "another controller" refers to another Insteon device.

[vcholman]

Correct..."Another Controller".

 

Example...

 

8 Button Keypad Linc: Button "B" set as a controller to activate a dimmer switch.

LED wll light when button B is pressed locally.

 

But if I activate the dimmer switch from another controller or MobiLinc Pro, I want to see the KeyPadLinc LED light up for Button B.

 

I would prefer to perform this using scenes.

 

Any suggestions or examples are appreicated.

 

Thanks,

[kzboray]

A scene is the way to do this. Add both the KP Linc 8 and the KP Dimmer to a scene, but make sure that you have marked them both as controllers not responders (the default) for that scene.

[oberkc]

Put all devices that you want to use to activate each other into a scene, all as controllers.  To use your example, put KPL button B and the dimmer switch into a scene, both as controllers.  If you want to activate the dimmer switch from yet another insteon device, and have the KPL respond as well, include it into the same scene, as a controller, making three devices now that comprise the scene. 

 

From mobilinc, turn on/off the scene, rather than any individual device. 

[vcholman]

To Oberkc,

 

Not sure if I should take your suggestion verbatim. Is it possible the last part of your suggestion to have the KPL responde from another controlling device should be a responder in the scene?

 

Is this what you are suggesting...

 

Table Lamp (Scene)

 

KPL-C (Table Lamp): Controller

Table Lamp Dimmer: Controller

KPL-C (Table Lamp LED): Responder

 

 

Last night this is what I came-up with, it works; but I'm sure it's more complicated than it needs to be.

One scene is for controlling the table lamp. The other scene the dimmer is a controller to send status to the KPL.

 

 

Table Lamp (Scene)

KPL-C (Table Lamp): Controller

Table Lamp Dimmer: Responder

 

 

Table Lamp (LED Scene)

KPL-C (Table Lamp): Responder

Table Lamp Dimmer: Controller

 

Which method is more efficient or perferred?

 

Thank you,,

 

Vance

[oberkc]

Not sure if I should take your suggestion verbatim. Is it possible the last part of your suggestion to have the KPL responde from another controlling device should be a responder in the scene?

My suggestion was intended to be precise.  I did not intend to suggest (and am having trouble finding that I did) that you should add anything to a scene as a responder.

 

I will also admit that I remain a little uncertain that we are accurately communication with the term "other controller".

 

Table Lamp (Scene)

 

KPL-C (Table Lamp): Controller

Table Lamp Dimmer: Controller

KPL-C (Table Lamp LED): Responder

 Are "KPL-C (Table Lamp)" and "KPL-C (Table Lamp LED)" different devices?  No, this was not my intended suggestion.

 

Last night this is what I came-up with, it works; but I'm sure it's more complicated than it needs to be.

One scene is for controlling the table lamp. The other scene the dimmer is a controller to send status to the KPL.

 

 

Table Lamp (Scene)

KPL-C (Table Lamp): Controller

Table Lamp Dimmer: Responder

 

 

Table Lamp (LED Scene)

KPL-C (Table Lamp): Responder

Table Lamp Dimmer: Controller

For nearly all intents, using two scenes here is not needed.  Use one scene:

 

KPL-C (Table Lamp): Controller

Table Lamp Dimmer: Controller

 

In case you did not know, scene controllers are, by definition, also scene responders.

 

In

[stusviews]

In case you did not know, scene controllers are, by definition, also scene responders.

 

Clarification: An ISY scene controller is both a scene controller and a scene responder. Other Insteon managers differentiate between devices that are controllers-only, responders-only or both.

[oberkc]

Clarification: An ISY scene controller is both a scene controller and a scene responder. Other Insteon managers differentiate between devices that are controllers-only, responders-only or both.

 

Yes, in the context of the ISY-994 controller.  Yes, we are talking about an ISY-994 scene.  Yes, we are in an ISY-994 forum.  Otherwise, disregard.

[stusviews]

Only the ISY has that restriction. New ISY users usually won't know that, most especially if they read any Insteon QSG or Owner's manual. The OP has only a few posts. Veteran ISY users can disregard

[vcholman]

_{To Oberkc,}

 

_{I should apologize for not clarifying m intentions.}

 

_{When I referred to "KPL-C (Table Lamp LED) as an responder, this was added so the LED inside the KeyPadLinc button position C would light up if it's function was turned on by another Insteon device.}

 

_{Are you saying that switches or KeyPadLincs that are acting as an Controller, also receive (responder) signals to update their LED status?}

 

 

_{Let me try to explain again what I am trying to accomplish.}

 

_{I have a KeyPadLlinc, Button "C" is reserved to control a Dimmer switch. This dimmer switch will activate my Table Lamp}

 

_{When I press button C, the built-in LED lights up and it sends it's signal to the dimmer switch. Result the table lamp turns on.}

_{Now lets say the table lamp is turned on locally by pressing the dimmer switch. I want the LED inside the KeyPadLinc to light up for button C. So at a glance, we will know this lamp is turned on.}

 

_{You said only ONE scene is necessary to accomplish this.}

 

_{Would this be the correct way to setup the SCENE}

 

_{SCENE (Named Table Lamp)}

 

_{KeyPadLinc Button C > added to the scene as an CONTROLLER}

 

_{Dimmer Switch > added to the scene as an RESPONDER}

 

 

_{Earlier you said I would have three entries in a scene, two of them as Controllers and one as an Responder}

 

_{Is this how the scene should look...}

 

_{SCENE (Named Table Lamp)}

 

_{KeyPadLinc Button C > Set as an Controller}

 

_{Dimmer Switch > Set as an Controller}

 

_{KeyPadLinc Button C > Set as an Responder}

 

_{Thanks in advance,}

 

_Vance

[stusviews]

Neither is correct. Both the button and switch should be controllers (as oberkc posted, #6). Each device will then be both a controller and a responder. Turn on/off the button and the switch will respond, turn on/off the switch and the button will respond, turn on/off the scene (e.g., from a program or the Admin Console) and both will respond

[oberkc]

_{Are you saying that switches or KeyPadLincs that are acting as an Controller, also receive (responder) signals to update their LED status?}

I am saying that if a controller is part of a (ISY) scene, it is also a responder.  If two devices, both controllers, are part of a (ISY) scene, toggling one controller will cause the other to respond, and vice versa.  Each is responder to the other, by definition.

 

 

 

 

_{When I press button C, the built-in LED lights up and it sends it's signal to the dimmer switch. Result the table lamp turns on.}

_{Now lets say the table lamp is turned on locally by pressing the dimmer switch. I want the LED inside the KeyPadLinc to light up for button C. So at a glance, we will know this lamp is turned on.}

 

_{You said only ONE scene is necessary to accomplish this.}

 

_{Would this be the correct way to setup the SCENE}

 

_{SCENE (Named Table Lamp)}

 

_{KeyPadLinc Button C > added to the scene as an CONTROLLER}

 

_{Dimmer Switch > added to the scene as an RESPONDER}

No, that is not correct.  Both devices should be in the scene, both as controllers.

 

_{Earlier you said I would have three entries in a scene, two of them as Controllers and one as an Responder}

 

I don't believe I ever said that.  Sorry.  I stand ready to be corrected.

 

The point where I could be confused is your original statement about "another controller" (is this a third insteon device?)  Also, at one point you had a scene with three devices, to which I asked "Are "KPL-C (Table Lamp)" and "KPL-C (Table Lamp LED)" different devices?".  I still wait a response to that question.

 

For now, if you have only two devices, keypad and dimmer switch, PUT BOTH INTO ONE SCENE, BOTH AS CONTROLLERS.  Let us begin with this, please.

[vcholman]

In response to the previous thread...

 

KPL-C (Table Lamp) and KPL-C (Table Lamp LED) are both the same device. I was stating that KPL-C would send the signal to turn on a dimmer switch and the dimmer would need to send it's ON status to KPL-C so the button would light up.

 

Recently I added a KPL button and it's associated switch to a scene, both as Controllers. The KPL button turned on when the dimmer switch was turned on.

 

I guess it's easier than I thought. This is the scene I tried tonight and it worked...

 

SCENE

 

KPL-C > Controller

Dimmer Switch > Controller

 

What do you guys think?

[stusviews]

I think that that's exactly what was suggested several times

[oberkc]

What do you guys think?

 

Post 2 - Create a scene to include switch and button, both as controllers.

Post 5 - make sure that you have marked them both as controllers

Post 6 - Put all devices that you want to use to activate each other into a scene, all as controllers

Post 8 -

                       KPL-C (Table Lamp): Controller

                       Table Lamp Dimmer: Controller

Post 13 - Both the button and switch should be controllers

Post 14 - Both devices should be in the scene, both as controllers

 

I guess we all agree.

[vcholman]

Thanks for all your information and assistance in helping me understand how to use scenes with Insteon's KeyPadLincs.

 

So far everything is working as expected.

 

I have another concern. The status of my garage doors is not always accurate. Sometimes I need to open, then close the door for the status to update.

Below is how I have my garage scene configured. Would someone offer any suggestions how to correct or improve how my scene works.

 

RED: Controller

Blue: Responder

 

[sCENE]

KPL-Button G

Garage Relay

Garage Sensor

 

Thanks in advance

[stusviews]

That's the correct scene to have a KPL button control the garage door and indicate the position of the garage door. But, status not being always accurate is independent of the scene itself and is usually an indication of a communication difficulty.

 

Do you have any dual-band devices on the same circuit as the I/O Linc? Do you have any electronics in the garage on the same circuit as the I/O Linc?

 

Also, provide the I/O Linc settings and the mode of button G (e.g, toggle, non-toggle).

[oberkc]

RED: Controller

Blue: Responder

 

[sCENE]

KPL-Button G

Garage Relay

Garage Sensor

 

 

A few thoughts that jump out at me without much thought:

 

1.  Your scene - I wonder if having the sensor as controller for the relay (as part of the scene) is causing problems.  I break these into separate scenes: one scene with sensor as controller and keypad as responder...a second scene with keypad as controller and relay as responder.

 

2.  Comm issues.

 

3.  Keypad button toggle mode (is it in toggle mode, or other?).  What mode (A, B, C, ?) is your togglelinc in?

[paulbates]

Here is a visual example of what oberkc described

 

Backdoor.Garage is the keypad key. 

 

Garage lights turn on other lights when the door is up. That can be ignored.

 

Paul

 

 

[stusviews]

The scene shows that the button is a controller for the relay and that the sensor is a controller for the button. All my I/O Linc that control openers (gates, garage doors) use that identical scene (except that I have multiple controllers).

[vcholman]

Not other dual  band devices in the garage or electronics that might cause communication problems. At my main panel, I did install a Signalinc V2 Hardwired booster.

 

My I/O Linc Relay is configured as follows...

 

Momentary A

Trigger Reverse

 

The magnetic sensor for my garage door is normally open. When the door is closed, the sensor is closed.

 

I will try placing the sensor in a separate scene to see how the system performs.

 

Thanks,

[vcholman]

 

Here is a copy of my garage scene. I have 2 garages, one labeled EAST and one WEST

 

 

[stusviews]

In post #18 you showed one scene for a garage door, now you show two. Here's the scene I've been using for years on both of our garages and both of our gates:

 

 

Only one scene is needed. The button LED is lit when the garaged door is open and unlit when it's closed. I use Momentary B and I set the button to non-Toggle On. In the event the button is out of sync, a single tap will control the garage door and re-sync the button's LED.

 

Trigger reverse will cause difficulties in the long run. The nightly query will eventually reverse the trigger reverse. The solution is to use a different magnetic contact switch. This is the most recommended magnetic contact switch.

 

The I/O Linc is powerline only and that may be the cause of your communication problem. A quick solution is to plug a LampLinc, On/Off Module or Range Extender into the i/O Linc pass-through outlet. If there's only one garage circuit, then a better solution may be to replace the garage light switch with a dual-band SwitchLinc.

 

BTW, the hard-wired phase coupler only that bridges the opposite legs of the split, single-phase electric supply. IMO, it's the best coupling device, but it bridges the opposite legs only--it is not in any way a signal booster.