Insteon Motion Sensors Gone

[Deuce]

Hi All.

I have about a dozen Insteon motion sensors about the outdoors of my home.  These trigger various scenes and programs.  A couple weeks ago, the ISY stopped responding to all of them.  Checking logs, there are no recorded motion sensor events.  It's as thought the ISY has tuned these all out.  Has this happened to anyone and what are the troubleshooting steps?

Many thanks.

[Techman]

On ‎9‎/‎28‎/‎2018 at 9:16 PM, Deuce said:

Hi All.

I have about a dozen Insteon motion sensors about the outdoors of my home.  These trigger various scenes and programs.  A couple weeks ago, the ISY stopped responding to all of them.  Checking logs, there are no recorded motion sensor events.  It's as thought the ISY has tuned these all out.  Has this happened to anyone and what are the troubleshooting steps?

Many thanks.

What are your ISY firmware and UI versions?

What version of the MS do you have.  How old are the batteries?

I would bring one of the sensors indoors close to the PLM and put it in the linking mode then try to query it. Post your results.

 

Edited October 1, 2018 by Techman

[Deuce]

Techman,

The Firmware / UI version is:  Insteon_UD994 v.4.6.2 (2017-06-21-13:52:47)

The MS is 2842-222.  The batteries are new as that was my first response.  As per your suggestion, I brought a MS inside, placed it in linking mode and tried to query it.  No response.  I also powered down both the ISY and the PLM for 5 minutes, powered back up the PLM and then the ISY, as I saw suggested in a similar post, to no avail.  There are no entries occurring in the event viewer as I attempt to query.

 

 

 

[mwester]

So are the other non-motion-sensor devices working well?  What's the date code (4-digit number) on your PLM?

[Deuce]

The PLM shows “connected” when I check status, however, when I do a PLM Links Table, nothing happens. Did the PLM die the death?

[mwester]

Dunno... So are the other non-motion-sensor devices working well?  What's the date code (4-digit number) on your PLM?

 

[Deuce]

12 minutes ago, mwester said:

So are the other non-motion-sensor devices working well?  What's the date code (4-digit number) on your PLM?

Yes, everything else is working fine. The sticker on the PLM says:

48.ED.48 

Model: 24135

Revision 2.4.2817

[mwester]

If everything else is working, it's doubtful that the PLM has failed (yet).  The date code says it was manufactured in the 28th week of 2017 -- so it's got a bit more to go in it's anticipated 24 month lifespan.  One might theorize that the PLM's RF circuitry failed, but even so if one of your other working devices is dual-band, then the Insteon protocol should have that working device relay to/from the wireless-only motion-sensors -- so, while it's possible that the PLM is the issue, replacing it is not the first place I'd look to solve the issue.

Try restoring the PLM to put the link table back -- see if that makes a difference.  It's possible that an electrical surge or such corrupted the in-memory link table in the PLM; reloading that from the master copy that the ISY has will resolve that.

Another possibility: given that the motion sensors are RF devices, operating in the same frequency band as cordless phones, baby monitors, wireless intercoms, etc, I'd take a look about to see if there's anything nearby (where nearby might be a neighbor's place -- awkward, but RF doesn't respect fences or property lines!).

Of course, that said, a spare PLM isn't a bad thing to have on-hand.  I've got three of them, plus a USB version -- they're troublesome buggers and SmartHome doesn't seem to be doing the right things to fix the problems with them. 

Edited September 30, 2018 by mwester

[Deuce]

I agree with your thoughts on the PLM, however, if I have the MS with the ISY, then the RF would be direct with the ISY and the PLM would be irrelevant, no?  

[lilyoyo1]

1 hour ago, Deuce said:

I agree with your thoughts on the PLM, however, if I have the MS with the ISY, then the RF would be direct with the ISY and the PLM would be irrelevant, no?  

That is incorrect. All insteon communication goes through the plm. The ISY only processes the information

Edited September 30, 2018 by lilyoyo1

[Broyd]

FYI: The ISY only receives Z-Wave RF and Zigbee RF directly,  and IR. All other powerline and RF communication is through the PLM.

Have you tried removing one of your motion sensors from the ISY and then readding it to see if the ISY can find it?

Edited September 30, 2018 by Broyd

[ELA]

How many dual band devices do you have?   Any other RF-only devices like triggerlincs and do they work?

A stuck transmitter on any RF equipped  device can screw up a large portion of the RF portion of the network.

I know this because I located an On/Off module with a stuck transmitter using an RF signal strength monitor.

Resetting that stuck device fixed the issue.     Symptoms previous  were similar lack of RF-only device operation.

Just one other possibility.   I was spoiled having a monitor,  much more difficult to troubleshoot without.

[Deuce]

I have about a dozen in#teon switches, and a few outlets. No other RF devices outside of the motion sensors. But YES, when I deleted the motion sensor and then linked it in a test program, it does work. So the obvious question becomes, do I have to fetch all of the MS’s from the trees, shed, and corners of my house, delete and re-link them, or is there some trick, now that we know that the ISY is receiving RF signals through the PLM?

[dbuss]

@Deuce, The motion sensor that you reprogrammed, is it now outdoors near the others that are not working? If not, you may want to locate it an area similar distance and environment as the others to see if it still works from that area. If it was interference, then why would the MS not work, without reprogramming it, when you brought it closer to the ISY? I would bring one more MS closer to the ISY and see if you get the same results as the other one.

[Deuce]

Yep, placed it way down the road and tested - works like it did. At least I know that I can get back to full function, albeit, a bunch of rigmarole. I’m hoping someone has a trick, especially since we don’t know what caused things to stop working, and if it happens again, wouldn’t want to have to repeat all the steps to delete the device and then re-link  

 

Thanks

[dbuss]

@Deuce , It's good to hear the reprogrammed MS is working from the area it needs to work from. The other MS's will need to be put in linking mode to reprogram them.