Smarthome won't replaced failed 2.4 PLM under warranty

[sorka]

I'm at the end of my wits with Smarthome. Every PLM I've had since they came out has failed. Smarthome has always replaced them if still under warranty which means that the first failure more than two years after a purchase I have to pay out right and then start the warranty clock all over. 

The last one I bought was in March of last year. That one failed in January. It was a 2.4 and they replaced it with a 2.4(although they told me they were replacing it with a 2.5. 

The replacement failed a few weeks ago. 

 

The symptom is the typical lost-all-links issue where the PLM's memory gets wiped and you stop receiving unsolicited events from devices. You can still control devices from the ISY but the ISY won't respond to sensor opening or lights switch status change events. Doing a count on the number of PLM links shows zero.

I then do a restore on the PLM and the links are back and everything works for a few days and then the links get wiped out again. The problem often starts several weeks before it gets bad and a restore works for a few weeks. Then it it accelerates and only lasts a few days.

 

Smarthome said that 2.4 doesn't have this issue like 2.3 and earlier revisions and that they've already replaced the unit. My case has been referred for additional evaluation. I was initially told I'd be notified in 24 hours of their decision. That was nearly a week ago and 3 emails later asking what's taking them so long have been met with silence.

I'm ready to go full z-wave replacement at this point. It was one thing to have a PLM fail every 6 months to a year and for me to have to call just once to get an advance replacement but now they are wasting a huge amount of my time. 

 

[mwester]

There's a thread here on repairing the PLMs, in case that might help.  I have a spare PLM on-hand at all times, and a set of replacement capacitors (because it's actually easier to re-solder a set of caps than it is to fix all the links if I change out the PLM).  It's infuriating that Smarthome won't acknowledge the problem still exists -- it implies that they don't understand the problem (which is dreadful, since they designed the blasted thing), or that they don't care (which is perhaps even worse -- apathy is harder to fix than ignorance).  But to be fair, there are some on this forum who insist that the issue isn't the PLM, but that we (those who experience these all-to-frequent failures) have "bad power" or we have temperature or humidity issues that are causing premature failure of these units.

[Techman]

Is your PLM plugged directly into an outlet?

Is the PLM in a well ventilated area, i.e. not in an enclosure.

Do you have any other electronics plugged in close proximity to the PLM?

It's unusual to have the issues you're having with the newer PLM models

Do you experience a lot of powerline fluctuations in your area?

 

[Brian H]

I am surprised the V2.4 failed so quickly.

It has a new design Serial Port Daughter board with a better protected serial chip and a protective network on the two serial lines to the outside world.

Though I agree. They still can't grasp the fact their choice of capacitors is a poor one. For maybe a few cents more on the BOM. They could have used low ESR capacitors and not the band aid use a higher voltage and capacity cap to attempt to fix the issues.

[sorka]

1 hour ago, Techman said:

Is your PLM plugged directly into an outlet?

Is the PLM in a well ventilated area, i.e. not in an enclosure.

Do you have any other electronics plugged in close proximity to the PLM?

It's unusual to have the issues you're having with the newer PLM models

Do you experience a lot of powerline fluctuations in your area?

 

 

It's plugged directly into an outlet in a well ventilated non enclosed area. The location of the PLM and the ISY have changed locations in the house several times since PLMs replaced PLCs. The failure rate is unchanged on the current PLM vs older PLMs and other locations. I've never had the previous PLC fail in the roughly 6 or 7 years prior to having PLMs.  

In the 1000+ electronics I've had in this house, I've had very few fail and I've never had any device fail repeatedly like the PLM has.

 

Are 2.4 failure rates really almost non existent? 

[larryllix]

 
It's plugged directly into an outlet in a well ventilated non enclosed area. The location of the PLM and the ISY have changed locations in the house several times since PLMs replaced PLCs. The failure rate is unchanged on the current PLM vs older PLMs and other locations. I've never had the previous PLC fail in the roughly 6 or 7 years prior to having PLMs.  
In the 1000+ electronics I've had in this house, I've had very few fail and I've never had any device fail repeatedly like the PLM has.
 
Are 2.4 failure rates really almost non existent? 

That may be due to your PLM sucking up all the noise to protect the rest of your house.

Seriously though. It takes a crappy quality PLM and a noisey environment to make a bad combination. I think we know the first element is true but some have the second element also.

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[lilyoyo1]

I'm always wary of a high failure rate with a particular device. I tend to look at the environment when I see something like that happen. I can say the amount of people claiming failures (of new plms) have dropped significantly though they aren't at the 2-3 year mark yet. 

[sorka]

I heard from Smarthome today. One of the engineers called me directly to confirm my address so he could send me a 2.5. Different than the normal advanced replacement thing where they have you send me back the old PLM. He asked me to destroy the 2.4 unit instead of sending it back.

He said that the capacitors in the 2.5 unit have been upgraded over the 2.4. I guess it goes without saying that I'll open it up to do a quick side by side with the 2.4. 

[sorka]

Is Insteon the only home automation lighting solution where there is no middle man when it comes to scenes? 

[Brian H]

Thank you for verifying that V2.5 actually exists.

I will look forward to what capacitors you find in it.

[sorka]

Just now, Brian H said:

Thank you for verifying that V2.5 actually exists.

I will look forward to what capacitors you find in it.

Let's call it verified once I actually get it. They told me in January when it last failed that they were replacing it with a 2.5. But it's probably a pretty good bet this time that it is what they say. As soon as I get it I'll take a side by side phones of the board.

[mwester]

2 hours ago, sorka said:

Is Insteon the only home automation lighting solution where there is no middle man when it comes to scenes? 

Scene-capable z-wave devices can do this as well.

 

 

(Cue argument about how z-wave doesn't do it as well as insteon, and insteon feels better than z-wave, and single-source doesn't matter, etc, etc...   Let's not do that this time ok?)