PLM apparently zeroed out?

[Derek Atkins]

Hi.  I found this thread from a few years ago which seems to be similar to my problem: 

As of 3 days ago my ISY isn't receiving any updates from MOST of my Insteon devices.  I've got somewhere between 150-200 devices in my house.  If I go to Tools -> Diagnostics -> Event Viewer I pretty much only see my zwave info and very few insteon messages coming across.  I can go flip a switch and I don't see an event come through.  If I go to the Main (devices) page in the ISY I *can* turn devices on and off, but flipping switches doesn't change the ISY's readings.

Tools -> Diagnostics -> PLM Info/Status reports v9E / Connected
however -> Show PLM Links Table gives me an empty window
If I go to either Show Device Links Table or Show ISY Links Table I need to "choose a device" and from there I DO see bunches of links.

Did my PLM go toast?  Can I just restore it?   If I do I get a big warning about putting all my battery devices into linking mode; I've got like a dozen different door , hidden-door, and water sensors all throughout the house; no way I can get to all of them and put them all into linking mode within 5 minutes.

As per the other thread, I will look for noise.  The last successful events where Thursday evening, so I am trying to think what might have changed as of Friday?  But would noise explain why the PLM Links Table is empty?

Any other suggestions?

[Techman]

19 minutes ago, Derek Atkins said:

Hi.  I found this thread from a few years ago which seems to be similar to my problem: 

As of 3 days ago my ISY isn't receiving any updates from MOST of my Insteon devices.  I've got somewhere between 150-200 devices in my house.  If I go to Tools -> Diagnostics -> Event Viewer I pretty much only see my zwave info and very few insteon messages coming across.  I can go flip a switch and I don't see an event come through.  If I go to the Main (devices) page in the ISY I *can* turn devices on and off, but flipping switches doesn't change the ISY's readings.

Tools -> Diagnostics -> PLM Info/Status reports v9E / Connected
however -> Show PLM Links Table gives me an empty window
If I go to either Show Device Links Table or Show ISY Links Table I need to "choose a device" and from there I DO see bunches of links.

Did my PLM go toast?  Can I just restore it?   If I do I get a big warning about putting all my battery devices into linking mode; I've got like a dozen different door , hidden-door, and water sensors all throughout the house; no way I can get to all of them and put them all into linking mode within 5 minutes.

As per the other thread, I will look for noise.  The last successful events where Thursday evening, so I am trying to think what might have changed as of Friday?  But would noise explain why the PLM Links Table is empty?

Any other suggestions?

It appears that your PLM has failed. How old is it. What is the version and date code printed on the PLM?. If the PLM link count is zero then the problem is with the PLM not a communication issue. You might want to make sure you have power going to the PLM and that your calbe between the PLM and the ISY is OK

F.Y.I. you can only have one battery operated device in the linking mode at any one time otherwise they will become cross linked. It's a real pain, especially when your're replacing the PLM .  Your Zwave devices are independent of the PLM and won't be affected.

[Derek Atkins]

12 minutes ago, Techman said:

It appears that your PLM has failed. How old is it. What is the version and date code printed on the PLM?. If the PLM link count is zero then the problem is with the PLM not a communication issue. You might want to make sure you have power going to the PLM and that your calbe between the PLM and the ISY is OK

F.Y.I. you can only have one battery operated device in the linking mode at any one time otherwise they will become cross linked. It's a real pain, especially when your're replacing the PLM .  Your Zwave devices are independent of the PLM and won't be affected.

I purchased it Nov 23, 2018 as part of the ISY pack, directly from SmartHome.  There is power because the LED is on.  I am pretty sure the cable is okay because I can originate commands from the ISY and turn devices on/off.. And I *DO* see some periodic ISY notifications come in (basically, one of my thermostats seems to still report in properly).  PLM Sticker says Model 2413S Revision 2.4 0318.

I was aware zwave was separate; I was just reporting that to show that the ISY and event log are actually working.

I find it odd that the PLM can still actually act as a modem but lost it's link table so it's reporting anything to the ISY.  I suppose I should contact SmartHome?

[Techman]

3 minutes ago, Derek Atkins said:

I purchased it Nov 23, 2018 as part of the ISY pack, directly from SmartHome.  There is power because the LED is on.  I am pretty sure the cable is okay because I can originate commands from the ISY and turn devices on/off.. And I *DO* see some periodic ISY notifications come in (basically, one of my thermostats seems to still report in properly).  PLM Sticker says Model 2413S Revision 2.4 0318.

I was aware zwave was separate; I was just reporting that to show that the ISY and event log are actually working.

I find it odd that the PLM can still actually act as a modem but lost it's link table so it's reporting anything to the ISY.  I suppose I should contact SmartHome?

Being that your PLM is newer it might be OK. Try removing  power from both the PLM and the ISY. Wait about 30 seconds then power up the PLM, wait another 10 seconds then , then power up the ISY. There's a chance that may correct your problem. 

If the above doesn't work you can try a restore PLM, but you'll have to  deal with each insteon battery operated device one at a time.

[Derek Atkins]

6 minutes ago, Techman said:

Being that your PLM is newer it might be OK. Try removing  power from both the PLM and the ISY. Wait about 30 seconds then power up the PLM, wait another 10 seconds then , then power up the ISY. There's a chance that may correct your problem. 

If the above doesn't work you can try a restore PLM, but you'll have to  deal with each insteon battery operated device one at a time.

Okay, I will go try this shortly.

If I do have to try to restore the PLM, what is the procedure for dealing with the battery-operated devices?  Do I just need to re-link them as if I was adding them for the first time?  Or is there some other procedure to re-link them in?  Hopefully I don't need to factory-reset them first?

It's funny, because the 3am "Query" program has run for the past few nights without any errors!!!  And if I manually query a device I get the status back.  But it's still not getting raw notifications in.  So strange.

[Derek Atkins]

@Techman I did the power reset as suggested; had both PLM and ISY unplugged for a few minutes.  Plugged the PLM in.  Waited about 30s, then plugged in the ISY.  There is no change to the Event Log (not seeing any ISY traffic except for the lone thermostat reporting 60% humidity somewhere in the house).  I suppose I should run the Restore Modem command, but what will that do to any battery-device <-> wired device links out there?  I've never done a PLM reset with battery devices before.  I know with wired devices it "just works".  But the page-long warning spooled me this time! 

Thanks for your help/suggestions.

[Techman]

3 hours ago, Derek Atkins said:

@Techman I did the power reset as suggested; had both PLM and ISY unplugged for a few minutes.  Plugged the PLM in.  Waited about 30s, then plugged in the ISY.  There is no change to the Event Log (not seeing any ISY traffic except for the lone thermostat reporting 60% humidity somewhere in the house).  I suppose I should run the Restore Modem command, but what will that do to any battery-device <-> wired device links out there?  I've never done a PLM reset with battery devices before.  I know with wired devices it "just works".  But the page-long warning spooled me this time! 

Thanks for your help/suggestions.

Run a  "Diagnostics", "Show PLM Links Table".

If the count in low then the PLM lost its link tables. You can try a restore PLM and if that doesn't correct the problem then you should probably replace the PLM.

Each battery operated device will have to be manually put into the linking mode. Only one device should be in the linking mode at a time.

NEVER do a delete PLM

Take a look at the attached file "ISY Cookbook"

ISY_Cookbook.pdf

[Derek Atkins]

28 minutes ago, Techman said:

Run a  "Diagnostics", "Show PLM Links Table".

[snip]

Each battery operated device will have to be manually put into the linking mode. Only one device should be in the linking mode at a time.

As I said in the OP, Tools -> Diagnostics -> Show PLM Link Tables gives me an empty window.  Even if I hit "Start", it gives an empty table.

For battery operated devices I guess I just have to go re-link them as if I were adding them for the first time again.  I'll go do that, although some are certainly easier to reach than others.  I've got 1 water sensor that's really hard to reach..  I'll figure it out.

Thanks!

[Brian H]

If you have a PRO version. You can turn off automatic writes to battery operated devices. Then individually restore them individually. As needed.

You should not have to add them again like new devices. When you do a restore modem PLM. It writes all the known links back into the PLM. So all the links should be restored back into the PLM.

The Z-Wave devices don't use or need a PLM. So I would think they where still seen.

If the Link Table was empty and after a restore. Everything works but disappear in a short time. The PLM is failing.

FYI there is a 25% off Memorial Day sale being run by Smarthome right now.

 

[Derek Atkins]

16 minutes ago, Brian H said:

If you have a PRO version. You can turn off automatic writes to battery operated devices. Then individually restore them individually. As needed.

You should not have to add them again like new devices. When you do a restore modem PLM. It writes all the known links back into the PLM. So all the links should be restored back into the PLM.

The Z-Wave devices don't use or need a PLM. So I would think they where still seen.

If the Link Table was empty and after a restore. Everything works but disappear in a short time. The PLM is failing.

FYI there is a 25% off Memorial Day sale being run by Smarthome right now.

 

Good point.  Okay, I turned off automatic writes to battery (at least I THINK I did -- the icon status is a little non-obvious).  Then I started a PLM Restore a few minutes ago.   It's saying 18% complete right now (but of course the last item in the event log, which is what it shows, has nothing to do with what it's actually doing)....  And now it's complete!

I went back to Tools -> Diagnostics -> Show PLM Links Table and..... When I click start I actually get data!!

However I only see 94 entries in the table.  I am fairly sure I have many more devices than that.  Clicking "count" says 96.  I know for a fact that I have at least 107 hardwired devices, plus a dozen battery-powered devices... plus I think another dozen micro-on/off and/or micro-dimmer modules.  I'm probably around 130.  So... if it's only seeing 94-96 links... do I need a new PLM?

Note that it's under 2 years old.

[Brian H]

96 is too low for that many Insteon devices. The PLM maybe going bad.

Date Code  0318 is March 2018. That should just be over two years from date of manufacture but you probably have  owned it less than two years. I would see what Smarthome Customer Service can do for you.

V2.4 had some improvements in it and if your is bad. I am disappointed if it failed.

One thing I didn't get too clear. If you do a Restore Modem (PLM) and the system did not detect a replacement PLM at system boot up. The Links get rewritten to the PLM. If a replacement PLM is detected. Then its links are updated but all your modules also get rewritten with the new PLMs six digit ID to their link databases.

[lilyoyo1]

Do You have the pro version of the isy or  regular?

[Derek Atkins]

@Brian H Yeah, I figured 96 was too low   The fact it got zeroed out in the first place is (was?) probably a major issue.  I'll note that the PLM did receive messages from at least one battery powered device overnight, so that link got pushed back in without the device being in linking mode.  I suspect, tho, that if I replace the PLM I will have to go manually re-link all my battery devices.  It will re-write the new PLM ID to all the powered devices, but not the battery powered ones.  I will reach out to SmartHome today.

@lilyoyo1 Pro.  Help -> About says "ISY994i/IR PRO (1110) - OpenADR (21010) - Z-Wave (21100)"   It's running 5.0.16C

[Brian H]

Any Z-Wave devices you have will not have any links in the PLM.

With the PRO you can turn Off Automatic Writes to Battery Devices. It will re-write to the power line devices. Then you can write to each battery device separately. You should  not have to re-link them. Just wake one up and then write the changes to it.

Just make sure you power down both the PLM and the ISY994i. Then replace the PLM and power it up so it boots up completely. Then power up the ISY994i so it will detect the replacement PLM with its new six digit Insteon ID. When it starts. Then a Restore Modem (PLM) will do its thing.

[Derek Atkins]

5 minutes ago, Brian H said:

Any Z-Wave devices you have will not have any links in the PLM.

With the PRO you can turn Off Automatic Writes to Battery Devices. It will re-write to the power line devices. Then you can write to each battery device separately. You should  not have to re-link them. Just wake one up and then write the changes to it.

Yes, I am aware the zwave devices will not have links in the PLM.  I was not including those in my counts (I only have 4, and that's an issue unto itself).

HOWEVER, good to know that I don't have to re-link, but I still need to physically touch each battery device in order to write to it.  Still a pain for a few hard-to-reach devices.  I presume "wake up" requires me to push/hold the set button to get into linking/writing mode?  (I've got water sensor, open/close door sensors, and hidden door sensors).

[Brian H]

Wake up sounds like your description. Push the devices set button until it goes into the linking/writing mode.

The full users manuals would give you any differences if their are any.