Very slow (to none) Insteon device responses. ISY or PLM?

[CFolden]

I need some help with how to debug what's going on with my ISY/Insteon responsiveness (please :-).

The ISY994i (running V5.3.0) itself seems okay, I think -- meaning that I can log into the Admin Console and/or web console just fine and it seems as fast/responsive as normal.  I also have the ELK Security module (and portal integration) and when I hit one of those ELK commands/programs, those things work instantly/normally.

When I open the Admin Console (AC), I've been getting a bunch of "Failed Communicating With" boxes lately (many of them white/blank with OK button; some with the name of the device); however if I were to click on any of those devices and change the state (on/off) some of the time -- not always (and more and more less often lately) -- it will work, but may take like 30 seconds or so before it finally actually changes state.  This started happening a few months ago and seems to be getting worse - I don't think I made any changes.  When I open the AC, it seems to give me the 'System Busy' box and queries each device (this is really slow too)

Things I've tried:

* I've read on one of the forum entries that maybe there was a looping program causing the delay, so I disabled ALL programs and the problem still seems to remain

*From the AC I've tried to restore from a previous back up I took and didn't seem to help

* From the AC I've tried File->Restore Modem (PLM) and it didn't seem to help

* From the AC, I've tried File->Restore Devices before and after a 'restore modem' and didn't seem to help

* I've read about a failing PLM where in the AC Tools->Diagnostics->Show PLM Links table would be blank, but mine seems to have 186 rows that slowly show up there (albeit, I'm not exactly sure what I'm looking at there except a bunch of device addresses I think).  Some past comments indicate this would be blank if PLM was having issues.
I actually have a spare/new PLM and tried following the steps here, but the new PLM doesn't seem to report the state of ANY devie https://forum.universal-devices.com/topic/420-how-to-replacerestoreremove-plm/ .  At this point I plug the old one back in and do a 'Restore Modem' to get me back to a somewhat working state.

* I've looked at the ISY Links tables and the Device Links table and those give me some addresses/rows after I choose a device, but give me an error about 'failed reading/writing device link' before it eventually gives me those rows.  Again I'm not really sure what this is telling me.

 

So I'm not sure if it's the ISY for some reason, maybe the ethernet cable (I didn't try replacing that yet, but ISY says the PLM is connected), or maybe the PLM is going bad (but both?  and one brand new!) .. any suggestions on how to proceed with debugging it??

 

Thanks in advance for the replies!

[Techman]

Is your UI the same version as your ISY firmware?

Post a copy of your error log

Post a screenshot of some of your error messages from your admin console

Have you tried clearing your Jave cache, including applications and then downloading the ISY Launcher?

 

 

 

[MrBill]

Does your system have wireless devices?  do you see a green icon with 1011 to the left of any of the wireless devices?

[CFolden]

My system has a few wireless devices (everything around the house is mostly just many switches, sensors, and leak detectors).  In the Admin Console, there are few with green 1101 icons, some with grey 1101 icons, and many with red exclamations.

The UI and firmware are the same and for the most part I don't use the web interface; Lately I've mostly been using the new Universal Devices iPhone app.  It's the same slow to respond whether I'm using the iPhone app, the web interface, the isy portal, or the admin console (AC).  Every time I log into the AC I get a bunch of 'Failed communicating with" boxes (one for each device it seems).

I've attached the error log pulled this morning (lots of entries for my.isy.io portal).  Yesterday (1/10 around 545p) is when I retried adding the new PLM

ISY Error Log.v5.3.0__Tue 2022.01.11 09.00.30 AM.txt

Edited January 11, 2022 by CFolden

[Techman]

You're getting a lot of Queue Full messages

Take a look at this thread:  

 

 

[larryllix]

You need to disable the "write battery devices immediately" icon at the top of the admin console.  Then you need to put each devices with a 1011 beside it, into linking mode, and right click on the device icon and select "Write changes to device"

If you have any autoUpdate programs the attempt to write updates  to a battery device after it sees a trigger signal from it, disable and/or delete them. These have crippled my polisy system and previously crippled my ISY994i system. UDI has tried to improve this idea but I don't think it is perfect yet and may never be with Insteon devices.

Once your protocol caches fill up almost all processes in ISY can bog down. I had some devices taking over 60 seconds to respond with my requests and my Alexa boxes constantly reported" Something went wrong". ISY cannot handshake when it's buffers are plugged right up with attempts to write battery devices that won't accept them after a self-activated trigger. Some Insteon devices will and some won't.

Edited January 11, 2022 by larryllix

[CFolden]

Thanks for the reply TechMan .. I have seen that article before and was one of the reasons that lead me to disable all of my programs in the past - to see if there was some sort of programming loop causing the delay (I don't use Mobilinc).  Even with ALL of my programs disabled it still seemed to be unresponsive.  One thing I had not tried is disabling the ELK module to see that that has any affect.  Just disabled it and doesn't seem to make any difference.

Thanks for the suggestions too, LarryLLix!  I don't see an icon to disable the the "write battery devices immediately", but tried to write click on one of those and select 'write updates to device' and it just goes through the 'System Busy' box and tries to query each device again (this takes forever)

 

So now I'm getting a little impatient and just did the unthinkable -- 'File->Delete Modem', then I went through and deleted all devices and programs (of course I made a backup of everything first in case I decide I want to go back).  As much as I don't want to, I figure I'd try to rebuild the system and re-add the 40+ devices and then import the programs; examining the responsiveness along the way.  When I went to add/link the first device (an on/off switch) it seemed to find the device, but then said it failed to add: "cannot determine insteon engine".  I decided to go a step further and reset the PLM back to factory settings (hold set button while plugging in .. and then plug in ISY) and now when I go to link the same device the event viewer shows: "Start Insteon Device Linking Mode" but it doesn't seem to find the device at all when I click the set/link button on the switch.  Finally when I click Finish I see a [LNK-END] 02 65 06 :: Unexpected, ignored (65) and then a few rows down I see the device that I was trying to add with a msg "[LNK-STAT ] 02 53 M(01) gid=02 50.BC.A8 1894 73 : : Unexpected, ignored (53)"  (it's getting messier .. might need to start a new thread ?) .. sigh ...

[larryllix]

You must put battery operated Insteon devices into linking mode first or you will just add more data to your caches and likely make your situation worse.

You may need to factory reset your ISY now and then use a good backup file to restore your system in order to recover your PLM.

[CFolden]

Thanks again for the reply.  Here's the latest (working better .. I think 'noise' was the issue):

Figuring I was going to rebuild my system anyway (and I had a backup), I took your advice, larryllix, and did a factory restore on the ISY.  From there I tried to add/link one device (an on/off switch) and it still didn't add.  Tried a different device and had the same.  I tried this a few times and while I don't remember the exact order, as I was doing different things, I did encounter the same as before: "cannot determine insteon engine" as well as finally when I click Finish on the linking box, in the event log I see a [LNK-END] 02 65 06 :: Unexpected, ignored (65) and then a few rows down I see the device that I was trying to add with a msg "[LNK-STAT ] 02 53 M(01) gid=02 50.BC.A8 1894 73 : : Unexpected, ignored (53)".  Many of the other posts indicated that these errors might be communication errors due to signal 'noise'.  Only like two weeks ago, I happened to add a small UPS battery backup and it happened to be connected to the same outlet as the PLM -- maybe, I thought, but my issues started before that.  Prior to adding the UPS I had a power strip connected to the same outlet as the PLM (now the power strip goes to the UPS).  I don't remember exactly when the power strip was added, but seems it was way before I started having issues (maybe something new along the way that I plugged into it?).  Nevertheless, I disconnected the UPS from that outlet and put it in another (different circuit); the PLM is now in that outlet all by itself (the only other thing on that entire circuit, I happen to know, is a refrigerator) and now I'm able to link devices again and they are responsive!  At this point I delete the few devices I just added/linked, 'delete modem' (again), and then restore from backup.  My devices were working better but not all were responding after the 'restore modem', so  I performed a 'restore devices'.  Still not all were responding so I started linking in AC and went to those individual devices and set them to link, finished linking in AC, and now all is working as it used to -- fast, normal, and responsive again.  Hopefully it stays this way!

Thanks for the suggestions along the way!!

[larryllix]

@CFoldenIf you can find one item that fails a lot that can make your finding the problem a lot easier.

I lasted about 5 years without even a filterLinc needed but when I installed my second garage door opener things just dropped to about 20%. Then it was easy to find the problem by unplugging the new GDO. When that worked I tried the older GDO with only an AC motor in it (no batteries or DC stuff). Then I went out and bought two filterLincs and plugged in both GDOs into them. Plugged in the two ioLincs into the same filterLincs in the non-filtered outputs and voila! The system works better than new now.

Now I realise the infrequent Insteon problems were not my two Outback inverters running but rather the Chamberlain GDO units, even when not running.