Insteon 6 Button as ALL OFF in ISY Programming

[KHouse]

Thanks for all the recent help folks getting my first 6 button switch connected (in that mess of a 3-way wiring I had to figure out).

In any case, now hopefully someone will be able to help with the programming/scene.  Searching only pulls up some possibly good responses on the Smarthome forum, but those links are dead so hoping someone here with knowledge can help.

I've got my 6 button Insteon switch ON button connected to (2) lights in the basement.  However, I would like the OFF button on that 6 button switch to control more than just those (2) lights that is linked to the ON button.  That is, in our laundry room and hallway down there, I've got Insteon switches too.  I don't want the ON function to operate them from the 6 button switch, but do want the OFF button from the 6 button switch to turn all basement lights off (if they're on).

Is there a way to program or control the 6 button switch OFF button to control the off function of all of the lights, but have the ON function control just 2 of them?

Again appreciate very much any help.

[oberkc]

Technically, both ON and OFF buttons are linked (part of a scene) to your two basement lights.  If you want only the OFF button to turn other off, a program would work.

I would put all the other (besides the two that are linked) lights you want to turn off into a new scene.  Then, create a program:

if

six button switch is switched off

then

turn off new scene

[KHouse]

35 minutes ago, oberkc said:

Technically, both ON and OFF buttons are linked (part of a scene) to your two basement lights.  If you want only the OFF button to turn other off, a program would work.

I would put all the other (besides the two that are linked) lights you want to turn off into a new scene.  Then, create a program:

if

six button switch is switched off

then

turn off new scene

Thank you.  That's how I figured it might work / hoped it would work since it seemed there wasn't a way to link them to just the OFF button at the switches themselves.

[KHouse]

41 minutes ago, oberkc said:

Technically, both ON and OFF buttons are linked (part of a scene) to your two basement lights.  If you want only the OFF button to turn other off, a program would work.

I would put all the other (besides the two that are linked) lights you want to turn off into a new scene.  Then, create a program:

if

six button switch is switched off

then

turn off new scene

Quick follow-up question to this though...

If your program states "if - six button switch is OFF", "then- turn off new scene"...you'd never be able to turn on any of the lights individually unless those 2 basements lights were ON (thus the 6 button switch was on).

Basically what I'm looking to do is have the OFF button be a catch all to turn all of the lights off when the OFF button is pressed.  But...if I want to turn the laundry room light on (while the rest of the basement is OFF), then that wouldn't be possible because it would register the 6 button switch as OFF and just turn the laundry room back off right away?  Would that be correct or am I thinking about that wrong?

[KHouse]

Just tested something, and trying to think through the logic.

I've got:

if

six button switch is switched off

then

turn off Basement Laundry Room Lights

 

 

If the basement lights are off, and I go down there and turn on the laundry lights, they will stay on.  If I come upstairs and hit the OFF button on the 6 button switch, they stay ON (they do not turn off).  However, if I press ON and then OFF on the 6 button switch, then the basement lights come on then turn off, and just as well the laundry room lights turn off also (as they should).

So I'm trying to figure out how to get that exact scenario to work, with the exception of having to press ON and then OFF on the 6 button switch to turn all OFF.  Hope that makes sense!

 

[kzboray]

Jumping here and I may not fully understand, but couldn't you use "fast_OFF" which is a double tap as a separate program to turn off all the lights. Otherwise it works normally on the Landry light?

[oberkc]

7 hours ago, KHouse said:

If your program states "if - six button switch is OFF", "then- turn off new scene"...you'd never be able to turn on any of the lights individually unless those 2 basements lights were ON (thus the 6 button switch was on).

I am not convinced that this is true.  On my six-button keypads, if the main button is OFF, and I press the OFF button, it will send another OFF signal.  (This is also true on toggle and rocker switches.). Given this, you would not have to turn ON the main button before turning it off.

[lilyoyo1]

I'm with OberKc on this. The off command is always sent when hitting off so the status of your lights should not matter. 

[KHouse]

3 hours ago, oberkc said:

I am not convinced that this is true.  On my six-button keypads, if the main button is OFF, and I press the OFF button, it will send another OFF signal.  (This is also true on toggle and rocker switches.). Given this, you would not have to turn ON the main button before turning it off.

 

39 minutes ago, lilyoyo1 said:

I'm with OberKc on this. The off command is always sent when hitting off so the status of your lights should not matter. 

I thought so as well, and that's why I wrote that little test program to test it.

I just tested it again.  Only the laundry light is turned on.  When you hit the OFF button on the 6 button switch, the little green light flashes, but nothing happens.  As if it didn't send a signal to turn off all of the lights.  If I hit ON and then OFF...the laundry room light does turn off.

The program is exactly as described above.

Could someone direct me how to program the double tap as a multi-link for all of the switches in the basement?  Maybe that will work programming it that way vs. doing it through the ISY??

[kzboray]

Sometimes a picture is better than words.

[oberkc]

1 hour ago, KHouse said:

 

The program is exactly as described above.

Please make sure that this is the case.  My program was more logic oriented and syntax was approximate, at best.  Make sure that your condition is a “control” rather than “status”.  If you want us to check your program, feel free to post it here.

[lilyoyo1]

1 hour ago, KHouse said:

 

I thought so as well, and that's why I wrote that little test program to test it.

I just tested it again.  Only the laundry light is turned on.  When you hit the OFF button on the 6 button switch, the little green light flashes, but nothing happens.  As if it didn't send a signal to turn off all of the lights.  If I hit ON and then OFF...the laundry room light does turn off.

The program is exactly as described above.

Could someone direct me how to program the double tap as a multi-link for all of the switches in the basement?  Maybe that will work programming it that way vs. doing it through the ISY??

 

Post your test program and if part of a scene post that as well. There is zero reason why a light needs to be switched on for it to turn off.

 

[KHouse]

Thanks everyone.  I'll post up once I get home tonight.

[KHouse]

11 hours ago, kzboray said:

Sometimes a picture is better than words.

Thanks for taking the time to post this.

10 hours ago, oberkc said:

Please make sure that this is the case.  My program was more logic oriented and syntax was approximate, at best.  Make sure that your condition is a “control” rather than “status”.  If you want us to check your program, feel free to post it here.

Simple mistake on my part.  It was set to "status" and not "control".  Correcting the fixed it, everything works as expected now.

 

10 hours ago, lilyoyo1 said:

 

Post your test program and if part of a scene post that as well. There is zero reason why a light needs to be switched on for it to turn off.

 

Thanks.  I was going to post it now but realized from the above comment that it was a status/control issue.

 

Thanks everyone!

[oberkc]

8 hours ago, KHouse said:

Simple mistake on my part.  It was set to "status" and not "control".  Correcting the fixed it, everything works as expected now.

Good that is is working.  Now...the question becomes whether you want the keypad button to be an indicator that at least one of you basement/laundry room lights are on?  Are you satisfied that a laundry room or hallway light can be on, but the keypad button stays off?

 

[lilyoyo1]

1 hour ago, oberkc said:

Good that is is working.  Now...the question becomes whether you want the keypad button to be an indicator that at least one of you basement/laundry room lights are on?  Are you satisfied that a laundry room or hallway light can be on, but the keypad button stays off?

 

Welcome to the rabbit hole. Down we go! ?

[mango]

7 hours ago, oberkc said:

Good that is is working.  Now...the question becomes whether you want the keypad button to be an indicator that at least one of you basement/laundry room lights are on?  Are you satisfied that a laundry room or hallway light can be on, but the keypad button stays off?

 

This intrigues me, yet probably very possible with the ISY.

[kzboray]

Two scenes, All Basement, Laundry + Hallway

Program one:
If
Laundry ctrl on
or
Hallway ctrl ON
Or 
6-button light switch ctrl ON

Then 

Laundry + Hallway scene on

Program two:
If
6-button ctrl OFF

Then
All Basement Lights OFF

 

[KHouse]

11 hours ago, oberkc said:

Good that is is working.  Now...the question becomes whether you want the keypad button to be an indicator that at least one of you basement/laundry room lights are on?  Are you satisfied that a laundry room or hallway light can be on, but the keypad button stays off?

 

Good question......

 

10 hours ago, lilyoyo1 said:

Welcome to the rabbit hole. Down we go! ?

?

 

2 hours ago, kzboray said:

Two scenes, All Basement, Laundry + Hallway

Program one:
If
Laundry ctrl on
or
Hallway ctrl ON
Or 
6-button light switch ctrl ON

Then 

Laundry + Hallway scene on

Program two:
If
6-button ctrl OFF

Then
All Basement Lights OFF

 

I'll have to play around with this...thanks!

[oberkc]

4 hours ago, KHouse said:

I'll have to play around with this...thanks!

I don't think it would be that hard....

if

laundry room light is not off

or

hallway light is not off

then

turn on keypad main button

14 hours ago, lilyoyo1 said:

Welcome to the rabbit hole. Down we go!

this is not even close to being a hole yet, compared to some of the stuff you guys do

[lilyoyo1]

1 hour ago, oberkc said:

I don't think it would be that hard....

if

laundry room light is not off

or

hallway light is not off

then

turn on keypad main button

this is not even close to being a hole yet, compared to some of the stuff you guys do

I'm not sure that would work since the main light will turn on with the backlight (unless he's ok with that

[oberkc]

10 hours ago, lilyoyo1 said:

I'm not sure that would work since the main light will turn on with the backlight (unless he's ok with that

 

10 hours ago, lilyoyo1 said:

I'm not sure that would work since the main light will turn on with the backlight (unless he's ok with that

You may be right. I forgot that this is the button to which the load is connected.

[KHouse]

14 hours ago, oberkc said:

I don't think it would be that hard....

if

laundry room light is not off

or

hallway light is not off

then

turn on keypad main button

this is not even close to being a hole yet, compared to some of the stuff you guys do

The logic makes sense.  How do you program that so that the 6 button switch ON button lights up (if any of the lights are on).  First time with a 6 button so not sure how to make the backlight come on in.  Thanks again!

[KHouse]

13 hours ago, lilyoyo1 said:

I'm not sure that would work since the main light will turn on with the backlight (unless he's ok with that

What do you mean by this?

The main basement lights are connected to the ON/OFF buttons on the 6 button switch, so if you press ON, the main basement lights are on and the ON button is backlit.

If you press off (now that my programming is done)...all/any of the basement lights that are on will turn off...so it's an ALL OFF essentially.

I guess the question is, how to make the ON button light turn on (backlit) when any of the lights are on?

[kzboray]

Make a scene with just the 6-button light switch in it.

If

Light 1 ctrl is on

or

ight 2 ctrl is on

or etc for all the  switches you have

then

scene 6-button on