Upgrading from ISY994 to EISY | Will 2414U PLM work?

[Turtle]

I have a happily working ISY994i, connected to an Insteon 2412S PowerLine Modem via a standard Ethernet cable (to Port A on the ISY994). The ISY is managing my Insteon networked devices. I also have (2) Insteon 2443 AP's, on each phase of house AC service, to provide 900MHz wireless for 2420M motion sensors.  I also have a PowerLinc V2 USB 2414U PLM, with both USB and Serial cables.

I'm planning to upgrade to an EISY (assuming I can acquire the device).

Questions:

1) Will the EISY recognize and work with the 2414U PLM if I connect it to a USB port on the EISY?  Or do I need to go with the serial cable option and continue using the 2412S PLM?

2) Does the new UD Mobile IOS app support shutting devices off manually?  I currently browse to the Web interface on ISY994 to turn on exterior lights manually when needed.  It would be nice to bypass the manual authentication of the web interface, and just click "ON" via an App.

3) Do I need to update the ISY994i firmware to a particular version to prepare my Insteon devices, or can I restore from a recent backup based off the current v4.7.5 firmware? 

Thanks in advance!

 

[Michel Kohanim]

@Turtle

1. Yes, but you will need to restore the PLM to reconfigure all your devices already linked to 2412S. From migration perspective, it's easier if you use the same PLM.

2. Yes.

3. You should be Ok with 4.7.5, but it's best to upgrade to 4.9.

[Turtle]

Thank you Michel!

[Brian H]

NO.

The 2414U or 2414S  are not a PLM. The 2412U 2412S 2413S and 2413U. Are the PLM models.

They are the original PLC Power Line Controller. That we could compose programs and download into them to run alone. Using the SALAD assembler we got in the original Developers Group. Use a completely different set of commands and will not work where a PLM is needed.

Also if you are using a 2412S make sure only three wires are in the cable are being used. The 2412S has unregulated +12VDC on one of the pins. Normally are around 18VDC to about 19.5VDC

Edited Monday at 11:27 PM by Brian H
Add information Fix a Typo

[Turtle]

1 hour ago, Brian H said:

NO.

The 2414U or 2414S  are not a PLM. The 2412U 2412S 2413S and 2413U. Are the PLM models.

They are the original PLC Power Line Controller. That we could compose programs and download into them to run alone. Using the SALAD assembler we got in the original Developers Group. Use a completely different set of commands and will not work where a PLM is needed.

Also if you are using a 2412S make sure only three wires are in the cable are being used. The 2412S has unregulated +12VDC on one of the pins. Normally are around 18VDC to about 19.5VDC

Good to know, thanks Brian!

I'm presuming that if I buy the serial cable kit from UD, they terminated only the correct and necessary wires in the cable to support communication with the EISY.

[Brian H]

The serial adapter kit for the EISY and a serial port PLM. Should be wired correctly to use a serial PLM on an EISY.

[paulbates]

There are product differences between the 2412 and 2413 PLMs:

• 2412s are powerline only, not dual band/rf. If you have dual band devices, they should  bridge that on the Insteon network
• I don't believe battery sensor devices, which are wireless only are supported by the 2412, at least directly
• Scene communications are improved with i2cs protocol support of the 2413 PLMs. If you have, or are planning to add new Insteon devices, they likely will perform better with the 2413s
• I don't know for sure if Insteon's newest i3 products will work with the the 2412.. likely backwards compatible, but I don't know for certain

If you're going to keep your Insteon network the way it is and don't have problems with it, likely the 2412 will be fine. But, if you're planning to expand, or have communication issues, you'll want to think about the 2413.

[Turtle]

1 hour ago, paulbates said:

There are product differences between the 2412 and 2413 PLMs:

• 2412s are powerline only, not dual band/rf. If you have dual band devices, they should  bridge that on the Insteon network
• I don't believe battery sensor devices, which are wireless only are supported by the 2412, at least directly
• Scene communications are improved with i2cs protocol support of the 2413 PLMs. If you have, or are planning to add new Insteon devices, they likely will perform better with the 2413s
• I don't know for sure if Insteon's newest i3 products will work with the the 2412.. likely backwards compatible, but I don't know for certain

If you're going to keep your Insteon network the way it is and don't have problems with it, likely the 2412 will be fine. But, if you're planning to expand, or have communication issues, you'll want to think about the 2413.

Thanks for the feedback Paul.  Most of my current devices are single band (powerline), with the exception of Insteon 2420M motion sensors.  I use Insteon 2443P access points on each phase of house AC service, to mange the motion sensors, and my current RF coverage/range seems quite good (900 MHz can overcome a lot of obstacles). 

I'm looking to add dual-band devices to help overcome what I suspect is AC transformer interference to a couple of devices on the powerline communication .  It's a pain in the *** to trouble shoot AC interference in my house given all the electronics. The Insteon noise filters are fine for stationary devices, but not cheap nor practical to managing future interference elsewhere in the house. Adding more dual-band devices seems like most pragmatic way to overcome intermittent interference (hoping the cordless phones don't cause me headaches).  

I have not noticed an issue with programmed scene behavior in my current setup.  

I'm definitely gun-shy to add any i3 or similar Insteon products as the product description indicates a focus on proprietary management. I'm married to UD management of my Insteon devices due to my Elk security system integration. 

I'll probably stick with the 2412S for now, migrate to EISY, then upgrade to the 2413U PLM down the road.

 

[paulbates]

1 hour ago, Turtle said:

It's a pain in the *** to trouble shoot AC interference in my house given all the electronics.

It's a pain in everyone's house

1 hour ago, Turtle said:

I'm definitely gun-shy to add any i3 or similar Insteon products as the product description indicates a focus on proprietary management.

UDI requires you to have the eisy (and I think polisy) to use the i3 devices. When I moved to my new-to-me home, I started with an eisy and used only i3 paddles and outlets, mixed with other Insteon devices imbedded and sensors, iolincs. I've read about an issue with the i3 keypad not being able to assign the key that powers its red wire, but other than that had good experience.

[Brian H]

If your power line only deices. Suddenly start getting poor. The Access Points maybe starting to fail. If they are any Revision2 models. They are using the early revision of the 2413 base PLM main board. With the same capacitor issues.  We have seen in the older 2413S PLM. The revision 1 Access Points are on the older base controller with the separate RF daughter board and seem to work better over the long run.

[Turtle]

4 hours ago, Brian H said:

If your power line only deices. Suddenly start getting poor. The Access Points maybe starting to fail. If they are any Revision2 models. They are using the early revision of the 2413 base PLM main board. With the same capacitor issues.  We have seen in the older 2413S PLM. The revision 1 Access Points are on the older base controller with the separate RF daughter board and seem to work better over the long run.

That's interesting.  I'll take a look on one of my AP's to see if there's a Rev sticker, and leave them unplugged for a bit and see if I notice any changes.

[Techman]

@Turtle

Any plug-in dual band module will act as an access point, i.e. LampLinc or On/Off Module. The advantage is that you get both an access point and a module that will also control a load.

[Turtle]

5 hours ago, Turtle said:

That's interesting.  I'll take a look on one of my AP's to see if there's a Rev sticker, and leave them unplugged for a bit and see if I notice any changes.

Looks like my AP's are version 1?

[Brian H]

Looks like they are a V1 version and 1.6 is the exact version.