Speed of ISY and Insteon network/how long should the RTT be?

[j0dan]

How long should it take for a command from a light switch to go from a light switch, to the ISY, and back again to a lamp?

 

Example.

1. Press light switch on wall. Light turns on.

2. Paddle press received by ISY.

3. ISY sends a command to turn on another light in the room.

 

This seems to take 1-3 seconds to complete. Is that normal?

 

It's mostly a problem when I want lights to come on at different brightnesses depending on the time of day.

 

For example in the bedroom, the lights should only come on to 40% just before bedtime and 100% during the rest of the day. I set the local on level to 40% and then have a scene that is adjusted using a program. The ISY activates that scene when the switch is turned on.

 

So 2 questions.

1. Is there something wrong with my network causing it to take this long?

2. Is there a better way to have different brightnesses based on time of day?

[LeeG]

Better way to do it. There is an Adjust Scene Program statement that changes the On Level Or Ramp Rate for a Responder of a Scene. Run a Program at the appropriate times that change the Responder On Level. The light switch on the wall is the Controller of a Scene, whatever device(s) are the Responders of the Scene. No Program is involved in actually turning the Responder On/Off. That eliminates any latency going through a Program.

[Michel Kohanim]

Hello j0dan,

 

LeeG's recommendation is 100% correct and right on.

 

As far as performance, if all your devices are responding (there are no communications errors), this round trip should not take more than a second max. Other things that might contribute to the latency:

1. The switch you are turning on is actually turning on a scene which produces large traffic

2. You have other programs that might be running based on the same condition and they might be running before this program

 

With kind regards,

Michel

[j0dan]

Better way to do it. There is an Adjust Scene Program statement that changes the On Level Or Ramp Rate for a Responder of a Scene. Run a Program at the appropriate times that change the Responder On Level. The light switch on the wall is the Controller of a Scene, whatever device(s) are the Responders of the Scene. No Program is involved in actually turning the Responder On/Off. That eliminates any latency going through a Program.

Thanks!

I had previously tried that but didn't know that each Controller had it's own scene settings that could be adjusted by a program. Got it figured out and it works great.

 

I've also added delays in programs to lower network traffic during busy programs like the "Arrive Home" program. I sometimes had to wait 5-10 seconds for the entrance lights to come on.

 

I can't seem to get it working on my single ICON dimmer though. Are there any incompatibilities there? I tried manually resetting the device and doing a restore from the ISY.

[LeeG]

Are you setting the Local On Level / Ramp Rate values or Scene Responder values. If the Local values it is likely necessary to power cycle the ICON Dimmer for the changes to take effect. Scene Responder values do not require a power cycle. If I am off base please expand on the difficulties.

[j0dan]

Are you setting the Local On Level / Ramp Rate values or Scene Responder values. If the Local values it is likely necessary to power cycle the ICON Dimmer for the changes to take effect. Scene Responder values do not require a power cycle. If I am off base please expand on the difficulties.

 

I set both the settings for the scene, and for the controller for good measure.

 

After a power cycle it worked. :\

 

Is this an ICON limitation? My Insteon switch seems to handle it fine.

[LeeG]

I think the newer ICON devices and SwitchLincs are handled with an Extended Set/Get command that does not require a power cycle. Older devices do not support that command making it necessary to Poke configuration changes directly into the device memory. The device firmware is not aware of the configuration changes done that way. The next time the device initializes from a power cycle the new values are picked up. The new Extended Set/Get command is being implemented incrementally in various devices. Don't know which devices have that support and which do not. It comes down to if the device does not react to the changes, try a power cycle.

[j0dan]

That looks like my problem.

 

Wish I knew that before they were purchased. I can't find any info online as to what versions have it yet.

 

Thanks for the help.

[LeeG]

If one of the users knows for sure they will jump in and post the information. Smarthome/Smartlabs does not publish that type of information.

 

The link http://www.madreporite.com/insteon/Inst ... e_list.htm gets you to a list of devices with the hardware and firmware levels. This information is passed back by users to the owner of the site who has been accumulating this information. It may provide information on what level you have versus what others have received. It does not have a functional list by hardware/firmware level.

[LeeG]

j0dan

 

This looks like the ISY has not implemented the Extended Set/Get for the ICON Dimmer. I have 2876DB ICON Dimmer at firmware level v.39. When I issue the same Extended Set/Get command against the ICON Dimmer the ISY is currently using for the SwitchLinc the Local On Level takes immediate effect without a power cycle.

 

Don't give up on the ICON line. I feel sure the ISY will pick up this support in the future.

 

Lee

[j0dan]

This looks like the ISY has not implemented the Extended Set/Get for the ICON Dimmer. I have 2876DB ICON Dimmer at firmware level v.39. When I issue the same Extended Set/Get command against the ICON Dimmer the ISY is currently using for the SwitchLinc the Local On Level takes immediate effect without a power cycle.

 

Hi Lee. How are you manually sending that extended command?

[LeeG]

I used Powerhome 2 for this test. Traced the SwitchLinc command with the Event Viewer and replicated the command against the ICON Dimmer. The PH2 macro facility makes it a simple matter to issue just about any Insteon command you want. PH2 requires much more Insteon knowledge and attention to detail to access that flexibility. Very different paradigm than the ISY but a really fun toy.

[j0dan]

Very cool!

 

Here's hoping the ISY guys add it soon. So far I love the ICON switches and will only buy those from now on if they work as expected.

[LeeG]

I have a house full of ICON Dimmers and Relays since 2005/2006. I like their appearance and they have served me well.

 

Right now UDI is all hands on the new ELK stuff. Once that is released and stabilized I hope to see lots of new things appear.

[Michel Kohanim]

Hi LeeG,

 

As always, thanks so very much!

 

Would you be kind enough to let me know the product subcat of your ICON dimmer? Is it 0x1E (30)? And, if so, do you above which version extended set/get commands are supported?

 

With kind regards,

Michel

[LeeG]

Michel

 

The ICON Dimmer is DevCat=01, SubCat=1E. Firmware=39. Unfortunately I do not have access to any of the SmartLabs confidential information.

 

Lee

[Michel Kohanim]

Hi LeeG,

 

Thanks so very much. Are you using Link Management | Advanced Options | Automatic?

 

Currently, the only devices that use Extended Commands are those that do response to i2 commands during calibration (if you are using Automatic). For some reason, your device is not responding to i2 data transfer commands and thus ISY sets it back ti i1. Please note that i2 data transfer commands are different than Set/Get but currently that's how ISY tries to figure out if a device supports i2 commands.

 

With kind regards,

Michel

[LeeG]

Hi Michel

 

Thanks for that information. Link Management option is Automatic. I don't use the other options. It was actually a surprise when the Extended Set/Get worked as I thought the ISY made some determination about that for other devices. I'll delete that ICON device and add it back to see what responses the ICON is generating. Perhaps they implemented the Extended Set/Get without implementing the Extended data transfer or Extended ALDB command. I'll post an update later today.

 

Lee