Smart home has lost its loyalty to its Customers

[C Martin]

I have been a supporter of Smart Home since they were in their fist facility in Orange County.

I like many other have been receiving emails with promo codes. Beware.... when these Prop Codes say words like Smart Home Products, that does not include Insteon Items.

If Insteon items are Not Smart Home Products, then what are they?

I don't appreciate this Bait and Switch tactic and I am insulted by such trickery.

Please, Smart Home, have a little respect for your customers and stop this deceiving practice.

I have now learned that I can not trust you on the face value of your offers, like I don't have enough to worry about in this crazy stupid world of selfishness and greed.

I just emptied by shopping cart because of this situation, although it won't do much good. If I want insteon devices I will be shopping with Smart Home again.

Please, Just stop the Games! Learn to appreciate your customers.

Other users beware!

[Xathros]

Thats why I buy via Amazon now. I'm done with Smarthome direct sales.

 

-Xathros

[ELA]

I have also found those deceiving emails insulting. All I have ever bought from Smarthome was Insteon products.

I usually wait for a free shipping advertizement before I purchase from them. Then they bait me with free shipping on everything except Insteon?

 

Thank you Xathros for the wake up call.

What if any is the downside of purchasing from Amazon? I believe we get free 2 day shipping from Amazon

[Xathros]

No downside that i have found yet. Smarthome actually does the fulfilment on those orders so the only real difference is the shipping cost savings.

[Brian H]

I have gotten a few of them myself.

I have learned to read the whole thing including the fine print.

This seems to be happening more frequently.

If it was not for the UDI products. I doubt Insteon would be my present Automation Protocol.

I have seen to many changes in Smartlabs and Smarthomes whole attitude since I started using Insteon in late 2005.

[C Martin]

Hey Smart Home....

any comments?

I think that you guys should re-think your business practices.

[LeeG]

No worries. At the rate SmartLabs is reducing the retail device product line it gives one pause as to whether SmartLabs is getting out of the retail business. Anyone observe other companies go through the same process, reduce expenses, drop all but the most profitable products. All good business decisions, or the prelude to dropping the line altogether.

 

If Smarthome had to solve all the non ISY issues that get solved on this forum they would need many more people in support.

[Teken]

All I know is that who ever is in charge of procurement needs to be fired. The amount of crap they are carrying is mind boggling! I don't know what their focus is, because some of the stuff is like from the dollar store.

 

But, jacked right up 99999% higher . . .

 

Than you have the actual electronic items and they too are being sold for 2-3 times the costs from other on line vendors.

 

It has to be a combination of morons and nut cases buying some of these over priced hack items. If it wasn't for the value and performance of the Insteon devices I would have never spent a dime with them.

 

Over all they have provided me great service and support. They just really need to get back to providing real value and stop the endless used car salesmen switch and bait routine.

 

Teken . . .

[biredale]

Agreed, provide honest and straightforward customer sales and service. I got burnt once and am now twice shy. If you are in Canada you can always order from Aartech.

 

Brian

[apostolakisl]

My experience with them is all over the place. It really can depend on who answers the phone. Sometimes they are totally accommodating and agree to things I never thought they would agree to, and other times they don't budge and just say "no". Fortunately it has been a couple years since I have had any failures so I can't comment to much to the current day.

 

The same with their prices. Some of their non-insteon prices are actually as good as there is to be found. Other times they are silly overpriced. For example, their price on the Leviton surge suppressor I just bought. No one was beating it that I could find.

 

And then I love the "hot deals" they advertise. I have seen things that cost a couple hundred dollars being put on sale as a "hot deal" and the price is reduced by a whole 50 cents.

 

I think the trouble is the company is understaffed and lacks a procedures and policies manual. They also seem to be using vendors in China for their manufacturing who are probably just the lowest bid, instead of figuring out who actually will use parts that don't fail. Although it seems that this aspect may have been corrected in the last couple years.

[oronomus]

I have bought a ton of Insteon products from Smarthome. Over the years, I have tried to always wait for the holiday discounts (10% to 25%, historically). The last year or two, Insteon items have been exempted from any of their sale promotions. That's been OK with me since I am pretty much finished at my main home, although I would like to start upgrading a second home to Insteon at some point. However, I refuse to do it at Insteon's current list prices. Its just costs too much to achieve automation for many dozens of lights and other electrical items when "access to that control" averages $45.00 or more per Insteon device. Also, its takes a ton of time to work through Insteon communications issues. You have to consider that cost in addition to the $45.00.

 

I have had very good customer support when I have asked SmartHome to replace a few failed Insteon devices. Agree that it does matter who answers the phone.

[nstein]

I have bought a ton of Insteon products from Smarthome. Over the years, I have tried to always wait for the holiday discounts (10% to 25%, historically). The last year or two, Insteon items have been exempted from any of their sale promotions. That's been OK with me since I am pretty much finished at my main home, although I would like to start upgrading a second home to Insteon at some point. However, I refuse to do it at Insteon's current list prices. Its just costs too much to achieve automation for many dozens of lights and other electrical items when "access to that control" averages $45.00 or more per Insteon device.

 

That pretty much sums it up for me, add in the increased price of dual band dimmers, and discontinuing of regular dimmers. I hope nothing dies, I can't afford more than a device or two.

 

I figure with there discounting of affordable products and lack of sales I can use, they must not want my business anymore.

 

-Nick

[Brian H]

Got another one this morning.

Loyal Customer Discount. $10 on an order over $100 but Insteon Devices are again on the excluded list.

[apostolakisl]

I am looking forward to zwave working with ISY. Assuming this works seamlessly, we will more than double our access to system components and potentially become fully independent of smarthome.

[ISYhbsh01]

See here my personal experience with ZWave. If it has since changed for the better I would like to hear about it.

 

http://forum.universal-devices.com/viewtopic.php?p=70276#p70276

 

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2

[ELA]

If Smarthome had to solve all the non ISY issues that get solved on this forum they would need many more people in support.

 

Has it always been that way or has the "Smarthome forum" more recently begun sending anyone who even mentions an ISY over to this forum? Without even attempting to isolate what the true issue might be? Of course I can see doing that if the question is about the ISY directly but of late it seems like all that is required is to mention the ISY.

Of course they will ultimately get the best possible support here from people like LeeG & Brian H. but why not make a first attempt to help?

[Brian H]

Seems to be more frequent theses days.

I give them the ISY Forums Link if it is an obvious ISY issue.

[Goose66]

When are the Insteon patents up? I know this is when X10 devices really took off and the prices came down. As soon as anyone can make compatible devices w/o having to pay license/royalties to Smart Labs, expect to see broadening of the product line and a real reduction in the costs of devices.

[Brian H]

Not too sure if there are many early adopters here.

In the infancy of Insteon there was a BIG list of prospective manufacturers for Insteon Devices.

We where going to have Insteon in all kinds of stuff. Like stoves and washing machines.

I believe Cooper Industries or maybe Leviton {sorry fuzzy memory here and I didn't archive the.pdf file} was scheduled to also make Insteon Devices.

That list went quietly out of site and we now only have Smartlabs to do what they please.

[fitzpatri8]

Has it always been that way or has the "Smarthome forum" more recently begun sending anyone who even mentions an ISY over to this forum? Without even attempting to isolate what the true issue might be? Of course I can see doing that if the question is about the ISY directly but of late it seems like all that is required is to mention the ISY.

Of course they will ultimately get the best possible support here from people like LeeG & Brian H. but why not make a first attempt to help?

I'm one of the users on Smarthome's user-to-user forums, and I'm also a volunteer moderator there. I've been referring ISY users to the ISY forum for years (no change) because I think it is the best way to help them use their ISY's to the fullest.

 

Consider:

 

* ISYs optimize communications and use version-specific device features. To accomplish that, the ISY's firmware must be manually updated to recognize and support new or updated Insteon gear;

 

* ISYs perform full link table and feature management internally, vs. manual tap-tap linking without. If you blindly follow instructions in the Insteon product manuals to manually change settings on devices, you inadvertantly interfere with the ISY's ability to track and control scenes and settings or properly trigger or evaluate ISY programs;

 

* ISYs offer features that can quickly isolate and identify a problem outside of the ISY. The ISY's Scene Test, Link Comparison and multiple Logging tools are powerful troubleshooters, but like many advanced tools they require some level of expertise to use and correctly interpret results.

 

* ISYs compute and cache the assumed status of devices based on control messages and understood controller links (unless you explicitly instruct programs to query device status), whereas Smarthome hardware and software always interrogates devices for real-time status. (The ISY's approach is more responsive and flexible; the Smarthome approach is slower but compatible with manual user changes and more accurate in the event signal issues prevent a device from responding to a scene broadcast.)

 

* ISYs offer a ton of features not found in Smarthome software--counters, more sophisticated scheduling, more sophisticated conditionals, a REST interface, actions based on Weatherbug or FlexAlert inputs from the web, etc.

 

IMHO, ALL ISY users should be a member of this forum, since it is the place to find in-depth ISY info and current ISY release news. It also contains a wealth of hints, tips, sample programs and instructions on all of the features exclusive to the ISY. It makes more sense to send people to where the information already exists vs. trying to reinvent the wheel somewhere else, in the same way it makes more sense to take French art students to see the Mona Lisa vs. just passing a polaroid picture of it around in class.

[apostolakisl]

Has it always been that way or has the "Smarthome forum" more recently begun sending anyone who even mentions an ISY over to this forum? Without even attempting to isolate what the true issue might be? Of course I can see doing that if the question is about the ISY directly but of late it seems like all that is required is to mention the ISY.

Of course they will ultimately get the best possible support here from people like LeeG & Brian H. but why not make a first attempt to help?

I'm one of the users on Smarthome's user-to-user forums, and I'm also a volunteer moderator there. I've been referring ISY users to the ISY forum for years (no change) because I think it is the best way to help them use their ISY's to the fullest.

 

Consider:

 

* ISYs optimize communications and use version-specific device features. To accomplish that, the ISY's firmware must be manually updated to recognize and support new or updated Insteon gear;

 

* ISYs perform full link table and feature management internally, vs. manual tap-tap linking without. If you blindly follow instructions in the Insteon product manuals to manually change settings on devices, you inadvertantly interfere with the ISY's ability to track and control scenes and settings or properly trigger or evaluate ISY programs;

 

* ISYs offer features that can quickly isolate and identify a problem outside of the ISY. The ISY's Scene Test, Link Comparison and multiple Logging tools are powerful troubleshooters, but like many advanced tools they require some level of expertise to use and correctly interpret results.

 

* ISYs compute and cache the assumed status of devices based on control messages and understood controller links (unless you explicitly instruct programs to query device status), whereas Smarthome hardware and software always interrogates devices for real-time status. (The ISY's approach is more responsive and flexible; the Smarthome approach is slower but compatible with manual user changes and more accurate in the event signal issues prevent a device from responding to a scene broadcast.)

 

* ISYs offer a ton of features not found in Smarthome software--counters, more sophisticated scheduling, more sophisticated conditionals, a REST interface, actions based on Weatherbug or FlexAlert inputs from the web, etc.

 

IMHO, ALL ISY users should be a member of this forum, since it is the place to find in-depth ISY info and current ISY release news. It also contains a wealth of hints, tips, sample programs and instructions on all of the features exclusive to the ISY. It makes more sense to send people to where the information already exists vs. trying to reinvent the wheel somewhere else, in the same way it makes more sense to take French art students to see the Mona Lisa vs. just passing a polaroid picture of it around in class.

 

What you say is true. But SH is kind of leaching off of UD when it comes to customer support. A great deal of what is discussed here is at its core Insteon, not ISY. ISY ends up being the "messenger" for diagnosing and correcting Insteon problems. It does seem a little unfair that UD ends up using their time and resources to trouble shoot issues that are not inherent ISY issues.

[fitzpatri8]

What you say is true. But SH is kind of leaching off of UD when it comes to customer support. A great deal of what is discussed here is at its core Insteon, not ISY. ISY ends up being the "messenger" for diagnosing and correcting Insteon problems. It does seem a little unfair that UD ends up using their time and resources to trouble shoot issues that are not inherent ISY issues.

 

Not at all. The Smarthome forum is strictly a user-to-user site, an open conversation for folks looking to get answers or solve problems on their own. It's also the only place I've found to get info on the troubleshooting tools built into HouseLinc. Smarthome doesn't participate in their user-to-user forum--tech support does all their work via toll-free call or instant message conversation.

 

That said, I alone am responsible for what I post there. Just as you are responsible for what you write.

 

Personally, I would think that Universal Devices would want their customers to know about this forum and participate here. New ISY owners can use this site for self-help by taking a self-guided tour through years of posts explaining ISY features and tricks; enthusiastic, more experienced ISY users can answer basic questions, clarify how ISY tools and procedures work, confirm they have compatible hardware and the most appropriate ISY firmware, and point people to relevant docs or past posts. In the worse-case scenario, Universal Devices' staff can step in.

 

When I post on any forum, my objective is really quite simple--help folks identify challenges or opportunities and resolve them the right way, with the least amount of fuss.

[ELA]

hello fitzpatri8,

Thanks for your response to my post. It was very well written and made many great points.

 

In a further response you stated: "

When I post on any forum, my objective is really quite simple--help folks identify challenges or opportunities and resolve them the right way, with the least amount of fuss."

As I have said a few times previously I feel you do a wonderful job of helping so many individuals resolve their issues. Especially when it must get a bit tiring sometimes when you often have to answer the same old basic questions over and over. I respect your dedication to helping so many.

 

Recently there was a person that was referred here but I never saw them post here. Maybe under another name? I just hoped they were not turned off by having been referred away.

 

I do really want to emphasize and acknowledge your good work. Hopefully we can all strive to help those in need with a minimum of fuss.

[fitzpatri8]

As I have said a few times previously I feel you do a wonderful job of helping so many individuals resolve their issues.

 

I appreciate that, but the credit goes to all the Smarthome forum contributors. I know I have a semi-permanent mark from all the self-inflicted forehead slaps, all those 'why didn't I think of that' moments when someone else solves a problem in a way that hadn't even occurred to me.

 

Especially when it must get a bit tiring sometimes when you often have to answer the same old basic questions over and over. I respect your dedication to helping so many.

 

That's the best thing about a user-to user forum--no one has to answer a question, people do it because they want to share their success. Repetitive questions are pretty easy for all the advanced users--I know I've been known to quote a previous response or point to another thread many times to help a newbie find an answer.

 

Since the Smarthome forum is a user-to-user site, a moderator here would be right to complain that I'm hijacking this thread. I hate when people do that, so I'm going to shut up now!

[apostolakisl]

What you say is true. But SH is kind of leaching off of UD when it comes to customer support. A great deal of what is discussed here is at its core Insteon, not ISY. ISY ends up being the "messenger" for diagnosing and correcting Insteon problems. It does seem a little unfair that UD ends up using their time and resources to trouble shoot issues that are not inherent ISY issues.

 

Not at all. The Smarthome forum is strictly a user-to-user site, an open conversation for folks looking to get answers or solve problems on their own. It's also the only place I've found to get info on the troubleshooting tools built into HouseLinc. Smarthome doesn't participate in their user-to-user forum--tech support does all their work via toll-free call or instant message conversation.

 

That said, I alone am responsible for what I post there. Just as you are responsible for what you write.

 

Personally, I would think that Universal Devices would want their customers to know about this forum and participate here. New ISY owners can use this site for self-help by taking a self-guided tour through years of posts explaining ISY features and tricks; enthusiastic, more experienced ISY users can answer basic questions, clarify how ISY tools and procedures work, confirm they have compatible hardware and the most appropriate ISY firmware, and point people to relevant docs or past posts. In the worse-case scenario, Universal Devices' staff can step in.

 

When I post on any forum, my objective is really quite simple--help folks identify challenges or opportunities and resolve them the right way, with the least amount of fuss.

 

Sorry, I really wasn't speaking to that forum in particular. I was speaking to the fact that so many of the things that happen in this forum are not ISY related. The UD staff (as well as many random folks like us) spend a lot of time solving these problems when this task really should fall to SH. SH is getting a big time freebie.

 

It is also quite apparent that the folks on this forum know a lot more about Insteon than most of the reps who answer the phone at SH.