johnnyt

A quick update up to this point. Got my new "500 series" ISY/IR PRO with Zwave and bought/installed needed modules: climate, X10, network. For the latter I went through the cheaper ISY portal subscription option and will ask UDI to transfer my older ISY's network module license after I've taken it out of prod since I don't need the portal Was able to take it back to 4.7.3 firmware without PLM no problem (FWIW, Zwave menu still showed up in 4.7.3 AC) then restored my 4.7.3 "prod" backup to it. Did the upgrade to 5.0.13D without PLM Unfortunately I have over 460 programs - about half - that need fixing. Mostly, it seems, because of need to move to new Nodelink. This could take some time. Am really hoping I'll be able to leverage the "replace all" functionality.

okay but if I don't have zwave and just need to load 4.7.3 (using "No PLM" version) to then do an upgrade to 5.x (also no PLM), will 4.7.3 work on the 500 series? or will 4.7.3 cause crash because of the zwave chip?

I don’t yet have any zwave at this point but planning to start adding some after I’ve upgraded and stabilized things. I’m confused. Can I do factory reset and load 4.7.3 on new 500 series? I would rather to do this and upgrade on the bench / stabilize things before taking my current “300” out. What am I missing? Thanks. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Darn. Did not see that coming and it didn't come in time for me to stop delivery of my new "500 Series". What are my options now? How does one upgrade with one of these? Are they just met to be for new installs? Also, what does this mean for someone that goes from older "400 series" running 4.x to 5.x? What is the stuff one is going to be missing when they do that?

@Michel Kohanim, Thanks. Can you confirm I will be able to "downgrade" a new ZW to 4.x?

yes, I will add factory reset ahead of my step 2

Thanks, Paul. I think you've largely validated the plan I posted, although I now realize I have to figure out how to deal with network and climate modules as I only need those temporarily (during upgrade and "burn in" phase). I don't really have a need for 2 ISY's after this, never mind 2 network modules and 2 climate modules... Let me know if I'm missing something. I don't have the portal setup

About to buy a new ISY to start the process I outlined previously and would like to get one with Zwave right off the bat for future zwave use and have a few questions. Is there any difference between buying an ISY with Zwave "out of the box" vs. getting one without it and adding zwave to it later? (other than, of course, cost) Will there be any problem loading a 4.x backup from a unit without zwave? Will I need to disable or physically remove zwave to avoid problems with my upgrade plan, then add it back in later?

I don't think I'll be able to do an upgrade, migration to NodeLink, and fix everything that breaks in an afternoon. So to do this in the time chunks I'll have, as well as be able to maintain the high level of WAF I've managed to achieve, my plan is as follows: buy a second ISY that will go "on the bench" without a PLM load the latest 4.x firmware that can run without a PLM on new ISY restore a prod ISY backup to it (will this work or do I have to load a "no PLM" version on my prod system first and restore backup of that?) upgrade to "no PLM" version of 5.x install NodeLink somewhere and make the needed links between the devices and the new ISY Perform the following break-fix work: fix the programs that didn't migrate well adjust my 100+ scenes add NodeLink variables add needed network resources for NodeLink convert the many programs that used the older xxxLink vars and network resources to now use NodeLink versions Move new ISY to prod, do PLM restore, and see how things work Once established that I don't need to roll back, install a version of 5.x that needs a PLM Grab a beverage and pat myself on the back Am I missing or misunderstanding anything? (I toyed with the idea of grabbing a beverage before I start but figure I better wait until after.)

Thanks for the replies. Good to know it's easy to find what programs are affected, and that NodeLInk may help performance. What I don't quite have is a sense for whether I'm looking at a few or a lot of programs that need to be changed and what that means. So a couple of follow up questions, if I may: 1. statistically, overall, what's a ball park percentage of programs that end up needing intervention? 2. is there a type of program, or something(s) in particular, that doesn't do so well coming over to 5.0 from 4.x? 3. What is the impact when a program doesn't come over properly? is it just a question of re-saving it or something else? What are some of the things that cause problems? Thanks again.

I'm a long time user (and fan) of ISY that hasn't made the jump to 5.0 for lack of time to deal with alpha software, a need for stability, and no need for z-wave (yet). My ISY (running 4.7.3) has been rock solid over the years with very few unexplainable issues. Stability and reliability has clearly been a UDI priority, even in beta, at least pre 5.0 (I simply don't know for 5.0 beta) I'm at a crossroads though with 5.0 now in beta but stating in release notes (and elsewhere) that a lot of manual intervention may be needed. I have 178 devices (all insteon), 106 scenes, 923 programs, 275 variables and 77 network resources, and I'd like help assessing my options. 1. What are the chances there will be a 5.0 version that does not require a lot of manual intervention, or will a lot of manual intervention always be part of move from 4.x to 5.x? 2. How easy it is to know what needs manual intervention? Will I need to look through - or worse, monitor - all 900+ programs to know, or will there be some indication like "Not Saved" (due to changes) when I look in the console as to what programs have been affected? 3. My biggest problem with ISY is its performance. I have VenLink, DSCLink, ISYLogger, plus I had HomeSeer for a while (now out of the equation) and I constantly get reports of timeouts from ISY (even without HomeSeer polling or needing updates). See attached sample. I also find loading the console painfully slow, which I use/run all the time (until the memory leak forces me to restart it). My question is, will 5.0 speed things up or slow things down, as new s/w with added functionality often tends to do? Or is there new, more powerful hardware available or in the works? I realize this may be more a question for UDI, not forum users, but throwing it out there in case anyone has heard/read anything. (yes, I also realize performance problems is often a programmer issue but I've also seen horsepower help address less than optimal programming code time and time again.) As well, there can simply be lots happening at once requiring processing power even with highly optimized code. Any comments/feedback would be appreciated.

I wonder how homeseer is able to do it. I got a personal weather underground API key that I entered into the HS WeatherXML plug-in and its been working for well over 5 years, maybe 10 by now. It didn't cost me anything and, given that I didn't pay for the plug-in either, I figure it didn't cost either HS or the plug-in developer anything. Is that a grandfathered arrangement or is HS doing something illegal? I still have HS running (unfortunately) because I can't load the climate module forecast data into a variable to do calculations with it (at least not without lots of brute force programming), plus I can't get more than one day of forecast data, plus I can't do heat index calculations because ISY doesn't do floating point math. I would also really like to get a PWS and be able to load data directly to ISY, not through the kludgy, relatively high latency process currently offered through HAM (last I looked, anyway). Yes, I'm eagerly awaiting a less bleeding edge 5.x version... and faster hardware... but I digress.

My ISY is on a UPS and I have a mechanism to detect a power failure. I'd like to protect against ISY reboots, either because I forgot or didn't know.

I have several variables I don't "init" each time they change but rather at strategic times during the day, or only when an else condition runs (in case of timers). This is to keep the wear on my SD drive to a dull roar. (I have over 270 variables and over 750 programs) At start up the data is gone. Here's my (currently manual) shutdown program: 1-1Save All Counters - for reboot If - No Conditions - (To add one, press 'Schedule' or 'Condition') Then Run Program 'Persist Counters - Daytime Use Only' (Then Path) Run Program 'Persist Counters in use all day' (Then Path) Run Program 'Persist HVAC Sensor Use Counters' (Then Path) Send Notification to 'jt.ha' content 'HVAC Status' Else - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action') And the programs that gets called by the above or at other times. Persist Counters in use all day If Time is 2:00:04AM Or Time is 8:00:00AM Or Time is 2:00:04PM Or Time is 8:00:00PM Or $sPowerFailure > 0 Then $iSensorCount.Driveway Init To $iSensorCount.Driveway $iHVAC.FilterScore.BedroomWIC Init To $iHVAC.FilterScore.BedroomWIC $iHVAC.FilterScore.Furnace Init To $iHVAC.FilterScore.Furnace $iHVAC.FilterScore.ColdStoreDehumidifier Init To $iHVAC.FilterScore.ColdStoreDehumidifier $iHVAC.FilterScore.BasementDehumidifier Init To $iHVAC.FilterScore.BasementDehumidifier $iHVAC.Count.Dehumidify Init To $iHVAC.Count.Dehumidify $iCount.ColdStoreFan Init To $iCount.ColdStoreFan $iCount.Dehumidifier.ColdStore Init To $iCount.Dehumidifier.ColdStore $iHumMaxDifference.ForColdStore Init To $iHumMaxDifference.ForColdStore $iHumMaxDifference.ForHouse Init To $iHumMaxDifference.ForHouse $iCount.Dehumidifier.Bsmt Init To $iCount.Dehumidifier.Bsmt $iHVAC.Count.FanLow Init To $iHVAC.Count.FanLow $iHVAC.Count.FanHigh Init To $iHVAC.Count.FanHigh $iHVAC.Count.BedroomVentHigh Init To $iHVAC.Count.BedroomVentHigh $iHVAC.Count.BedroomVentLow Init To $iHVAC.Count.BedroomVentLow $iCalcOudoorTempMin Init To $iCalcOudoorTempMin $iCalcOutdoorTempMax Init To $iCalcOutdoorTempMax $iCount.SynchroLinc.SingleRun Init To $iCount.SynchroLinc.SingleRun $iCount.SynchroLinc.Total Init To $iCount.SynchroLinc.Total Else - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action') Persist HVAC Sensor Use Counters If $sPowerFailure > 0 Then $iHVAC.Count.HeatCall Init To $iHVAC.Count.HeatCall $iHVAC.Count.Dehumidify Init To $iHVAC.Count.Dehumidify $iHVAC.Count.ACCall Init To $iHVAC.Count.ACCall $iHVAC.Count.BasementDampersClosed Init To $iHVAC.Count.BasementDampersClosed $iHVAC.Count.CableRoomFansOn Init To $iHVAC.Count.CableRoomFansOn $iHVAC.Count.HumidifierOn Init To $iHVAC.Count.HumidifierOn $iHVAC.Count.AC.Rate1 Init To $iHVAC.Count.AC.Rate1 $iHVAC.Count.AC.Rate2 Init To $iHVAC.Count.AC.Rate2 $iHVAC.Count.AC.Rate3 Init To $iHVAC.Count.AC.Rate3 $iHVAC.Count.OfficeDamper Init To $iHVAC.Count.OfficeDamper $iHVAC.HeatCycle Init To $iHVAC.HeatCycle $iHVAC.ACCycle Init To $iHVAC.ACCycle $sHRV.Low.Minutes Init To $sHRV.Low.Minutes $sHRV.High.Minutes Init To $sHRV.High.Minutes Else - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action') Persist Counters - Daytime Use Only If Time is 1:30:00PM Or Time is 10:30:00PM Or $sPowerFailure > 0 Then $iSensorCount.LaundryRoom Init To $iSensorCount.LaundryRoom $iSensorCount.RecRoom Init To $iSensorCount.RecRoom $iSensorCount.BasementKitchen Init To $iSensorCount.BasementKitchen $iCount.RemoteLincWIC Init To $iCount.RemoteLincWIC $iSensorCount.MainBath Init To $iSensorCount.MainBath Else - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action')

I have some things I want done before a shutdown or reboot, including sending some emails and committing some variables to NVRAM. I didn't see a way to run a program automatically whenever ISY is about to shutdown. I normally run one manually when I know or plan a reboot but sometimes get caught in an ISY initiated reboot, e.g. I updated IP address settings recently and ISY needed to reboot but gave no warning ahead of time or chance to back out of the action. Is there a way?

Thanks for the explanation, apostolakisl. I've put in a 2 second delay before I run the program to send the email. I didn't bother creating a bogus holiday to test it as I'm confident it'll work now. I'll have to keep an eye out for that in other programs as it wasn't how I thought things worked and it could explain unexpected/unexplained behavior.

What if one runs the fan at 100%? Other than during the ramp up (set to 0.1 sec) is there still a problem with using a dimmer if it isn't giving signs of any problems? I know I did have problems trying to run CFL bulbs through a newer kpl dimmer once. It would beep and refuse to light up the load. But that's not the case here. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Is it okay to put two wall wart type insteon devices on top of each other? I've been avoiding it thinking the aggregate heat would shorten both their lives, and especially the already problematic PLM with cheap caps... Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Wow, I didn't know that. Have been running a Panasonic bathroom fan on a KPL dimmer for over 3 years. In part because it's what I had, in part because it's more fan then I need (150CFM) and in part because by running it at 80 % it's quieter (for a bedroom ensuite). Does it matter what brand of fan you have, eg high end vs builder's special? Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Interesting suggestion. I'll try that and report.back. It will be a revealing experiment as I had trusted the FIFO order of execution was maintained in processing variables. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

This is one of a handful of programs triggered to run a few seconds after midnight each day. I think the wiki link provide in original post might explain how it all works. The key here is that the variable does get changed as it should so everything on that front works. It's only the email sending program that doesn't work. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

last line of the (modified) "Holiday Reset" program. See red arrow pointing to it in last screenshot, highlighted in the attached screenshot here.

yes, I realize integer variable don't trigger but I'm explicitly calling that program from the other one. I just realized I attached two of the same screenshot instead of the one that makes the explicit call. oops. here it is. see last line.

I use the set of programs/variables apostolakisl contributed to the calendar cause (details at http://wiki.universal-devices.com/index.php?title=ISY-99i_Generic_Calendar_Using_Programs_and_Variables) to which I added a program called "Holiday Changed to 1" that's supposed to email me when the $iCal.Holiday variable is 1 but it doesn't run for some reason. Hasn't once emailed me and there have been several holidays since I added the program. If I do a "run then" the program/email works fine, but it doesn't run when it's called as the last step in the "Holiday Reset" program. See attached screenshots. I'm showing the "New Years Day" program that ran fine yesterday. I will also confirm that the variable $iCal.Holiday was seen to be 1 as expected yesterday. What am I missing? edit: deleted duplicate screenshot and added missing one

Grizzy, As promised earlier here are some links you might find interesting. This thread covers dual ISY's and a discussion on performance (viewed largely as a programmer problem it seems). It also points to archived threads on my setup and some of my past problems, including with IOLincs. http://forum.universal-devices.com/topic/11033-runnning-two-isys-in-one-house/?do=findComment&comment=89654 An IOLinc alternative I don't personally recommend http://forum.universal-devices.com/topic/14475-ezio8sa-or-similar-is-it-any-good/ http://digital-loggers.com/din.html