johnnyt

I have over 160 device nodes 200 variables and 750 programs. I expect to exceed 850 programs if/when I add a thermostat that I can control via ISY and reach 1000 if/when I add other things I'm thinking of adding but holding off on for now. I find ISY h/w lacks horsepower/throughput for that many programs. GUI is really slow to load so I leave it running but there's a memory leak - slow one for me plus I have 8GB RAM - so not too big a deal but you'll read/hear that the GUI was not designed to be left running. I had and still do have performance problems (a subjective thing, I suppose) but took a load off by getting rid of IOLincs I had to query (which caused extreme slowdowns) and replacing them with a device with relays that I can activate using the network module. Although it can't be queried, it is very reliable, which I can't say the same for my IOLincs (partly but not totally related to intermittent comms issues) - an insteon/environmental issue not an ISY issue, of course. While the sw is obviously built to ensure what is supposed to happen does happen, there were WAF impacting delays at times and things like emails that are supposed to send state don't end up sending the correct state when busy because the email is queued/sent many seconds later after the state has changed, or it ends up sending unrelated data. The program logging could also use notable improvement but probably only once faster h/w is available. It's sometimes difficult to know for sure out of the box when a program with a condition has actually run true because it evaluates/shows false in the GUI after it has run true. Also all programs that look at a particular thing as part of the condition get evaluated when the thing changes. To know if something actually executed you have to get a program to send an email or set a variable. The former is subject to the performance problem I mentioned. In either case it adds notable programming (and GUI loading) overhead. A relatively high number of my programs/variables and commands/actions are for logging and troubleshooting. Don't get me wrong. I really like my ISY. Much better overall than homeseer, which I used for over 7 years before getting an ISY 4+ yrs ago. The question here is just about limitations so I'm listing the biggest ones as I see them. Some of the other ones I might have listed around math capabilities, variables and two way network functionality are, I think, high on the list of improvements expected in the next round of firmware so I stuck to stuff I'm not expecting to see fixed in the near term. See also http://forum.universal-devices.com/topic/14715-where-to-go-from-here/?p=123845

Yes, event viewer is fine for active troubleshooting when the problem is easy to reproduce and with guys like LeeG around to help read/understand the messages but it's not so good when you're on your own or faced with something that's hard to catch/reproduce or intermittent. Personally, I've had a lot in the latter group, many of which remain unsolved mysteries to this day - like the problem that prompted this thread - but if that's not enough people's experience, I understand. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Thanks, that explains it as well as maybe other situations that left me confused in the past. Any chance the log could show what happens on the insteon network, not just what's changed? Would help with troubleshooting. Thanks for considering it.

Did you press the query button? I've had IOLincs change mysteriously several times, in my case from latching to momentary and it didn't show up until I queried it. To this day no one has offered an explanation for it nor can I predict when it will happen. I like the term gremlincs. It hasn't happen that often relatively speaking (I was using 11 IOLincs at one point), it did affect more than 1 IOLinc, and the problem was intermittent, suggesting to me it wasn't failing hw. I long ago reduced my use of IOLincs for this and other reasons. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I was trying to troubleshoot what I'll call a localized "all on" event where all insteon devices in our master bedroom went ON when I noticed that turning the master bedroom ceiling light was not being recording in the log. Further down are the log entries for one of 3 identical tests I did with identical results, followed by the event viewer at level 3 during the same test period. What's supposed to happen (and has been happening fine for a couple of years) is that when I fast off The "Master Bedroom Ceiling Light" with address 16.9C.3C a program either turns a floor lamp ON if it is off (program 1) or OFF if it is on (program 2). The log records the scene calls made by the program but not the fast off event for Master Bedroom Ceiling Light that preceded it even though the latter is picked up in the event viewer. The device is an ICON Dimmer v.39 (2876DB) in case that makes a difference. Program 1 - When floor lamp if OFF and Ceiling light is turned Fast Off If Control 'Bedrooms / Master Bedroom Ceiling Light' is switched Fast Off And Status 'Bedrooms / LaurenKPL.1-Floor Lamp(Xlink)' is Off And Status 'Bedrooms / Master WIC2 On-Off Module' is Off And Status 'Bedrooms / Master WIC 1' is Off Then Set Scene 'Bedrooms / Floor Lamp Medium for Prgs' On Else - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action') Program 2 - when floor lamp is ON if ceiling light is turn fast off If Control 'Bedrooms / Master Bedroom Ceiling Light' is switched Fast Off And ( Status 'Bedrooms / LaurenKPL.1-Floor Lamp(Xlink)' is not Off Or Status 'Bedrooms / Master WIC2 On-Off Module' is not Off Or Status 'Bedrooms / Master WIC 1' is not Off ) Then Wait 1 second Set Scene 'Bedrooms / Dim Lighting for Prgs' Fast Off Else - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action') Unless I'm missing something, the Off for "Master Bedroom Ceiling Light" should have been recorded immediately above the Scene calls below. Scene:1-MISC (Non Lighting) / Bathroom Fan - Main / Bathroom Fan (ON) for Prgs On 255 Sun 2014/11/30 07:48:52 PM Program Log 1-MISC (Non Lighting) / Bathroom Fan - Main / MainBath.D - Fan Status 100% Sun 2014/11/30 07:48:52 PM System Log 1-MISC (Non Lighting) / Bathroom Fan - Main / Bathroom Fan Relay Status 100% Sun 2014/11/30 07:48:52 PM System Log Scene:Bedrooms / Floor Lamp Medium for Prgs On Sun 2014/11/30 07:50:58 PM Program Log Bedrooms / LaurenKPL.1-Floor Lamp(Xlink) Status 40% Sun 2014/11/30 07:50:58 PM System Log Bedrooms / LaurenKPL.B-Floor Lamp(Xlink) Status 100% Sun 2014/11/30 07:50:58 PM System Log Bedrooms / JeanKPL.1-FloorLamp(capped) Status 100% Sun 2014/11/30 07:50:58 PM System Log Scene:Bedrooms / Dim Lighting for Prgs Fast Off Sun 2014/11/30 07:51:03 PM Program Log Bedrooms / LaurenKPL.1-Floor Lamp(Xlink) Status 0% Sun 2014/11/30 07:51:03 PM System Log Bedrooms / LaurenKPL.B-Floor Lamp(Xlink) Status 0% Sun 2014/11/30 07:51:03 PM System Log Bedrooms / JeanKPL.1-FloorLamp(capped) Status 0% Sun 2014/11/30 07:51:03 PM System Log Z-Dusk and Low Bat Sensors / Main Bath Dusk-Dawn Status 100% Sun 2014/11/30 07:51:52 PM System Log Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:43 PM : [ Time] 19:50:54 11(0) Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:47 PM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 16.9C.3C 00.00.01 CF 14 00 LTOFF-F(00) Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:47 PM : [std-Group ] 16.9C.3C-->Group=1, Max Hops=3, Hops Left=3 Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:47 PM : [D2D EVENT ] Event [16 9C 3C 1] [DFOF] [0] uom=0 prec=-1 Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:47 PM : [ 16 9C 3C 1] DFOF 0 Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:47 PM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 16.9C.3C 2F.B5.FB 45 14 01 LTOFF-F(01) Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:47 PM : [std-Cleanup ] 16.9C.3C-->ISY/PLM Group=1, Max Hops=1, Hops Left=1 Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:47 PM : [iNST-DUP ] Previous message ignored. Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:47 PM : [D2D-CMP 00C5] CTL [16 9C 3C 1] DFOF op=1 Event(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) is Condition(val=0 uom=0 prec=-) --> true Sun 11/3/2014 07:50:47 PM : [D2D-CMP 00C4] CTL [16 9C 3C 1] DFOF op=1 Event(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) is Condition(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) --> true Sun 11/3/2014 07:50:47 PM : [iNST-TX-I1 ] 02 62 00 00 48 CF 11 00 Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:48 PM : [iNST-ACK ] 02 62 00.00.48 CF 11 00 06 LTONRR (00) Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:48 PM : [D2D EVENT ] Event [16 77 E5 1] [sT] [102] uom=0 prec=-1 Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:48 PM : [ 16 77 E5 1] ST 102 Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:48 PM : [D2D-CMP 02A1] STS [16 77 E5 1] ST op=2 Event(val=102 uom=0 prec=-1) < Condition(val=63 uom=0 prec=-) --> false Sun 11/302014 07:50:48 PM : [D2D-CMP 0274] STS [16 77 E5 1] ST op=2 Event(val=102 uom=0 prec=-1) < Condition(val=63 uom=0 prec=-1) --> false Sun 11/302014 07:50:48 PM : [D2D-CMP 0275] STS [16 77 E5 1] ST op=2 Event(val=102 uom=0 prec=-1) < Condition(val=63 uom=0 prec=-1) --> false Sun 11/302014 07:50:48 PM : [D2D-CMP 0273] STS [16 77 E5 1] ST op=2 Event(val=102 uom=0 prec=-1) < Condition(val=63 uom=0 prec=-1) --> false Sun 11/302014 07:50:48 PM : [D2D-CMP 00C5] STS [16 77 E5 1] ST op=6 Event(val=102 uom=0 prec=-1) != Condition(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) --> true Sun 11/3/2014 07:50:48 PM : [D2D-CMP 00C4] STS [16 77 E5 1] ST op=1 Event(val=102 uom=0 prec=-1) is Condition(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) --> false Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:48 PM : [D2D-CMP 00B0] STS [16 77 E5 1] ST op=3 Event(val=102 uom=0 prec=-1) > Condition(val=249 uom=0 prec=-) --> false Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:48 PM : [D2D-CMP 009D] STS [16 77 E5 1] ST op=6 Event(val=102 uom=0 prec=-1) != Condition(val=0 uom=0 prec=-) --> true Sun 11/3/2014 07:50:48 PM : [D2D-CMP 009D] STS [16 77 E5 1] ST op=6 Event(val=102 uom=0 prec=-1) != Condition(val=255 uom=0 prec=-1) --> true Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:48 PM : [D2D-CMP 008E] STS [16 77 E5 1] ST op=1 Event(val=102 uom=0 prec=-1) is Condition(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) --> false Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:48 PM : [D2D-CMP 00A1] STS [16 77 E5 1] ST op=2 Event(val=102 uom=0 prec=-1) < Condition(val=63 uom=0 prec=-1) --> false Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:48 PM : [D2D EVENT ] Event [16 77 E5 2] [sT] [255] uom=0 prec=-1 Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:48 PM : [ 16 77 E5 2] ST 255 Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:48 PM : [D2D EVENT ] Event [16 74 DF 1] [sT] [255] uom=0 prec=-1 Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:48 PM : [ 16 74 DF 1] ST 255 Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:51 PM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 16.9C.3C 00.00.01 CF 14 00 LTOFF-F(00) Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:51 PM : [std-Group ] 16.9C.3C-->Group=1, Max Hops=3, Hops Left=3 Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:51 PM : [D2D EVENT ] Event [16 9C 3C 1] [DFOF] [0] uom=0 prec=-1 Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:51 PM : [ 16 9C 3C 1] DFOF 0 Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:51 PM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 16.9C.3C 2F.B5.FB 45 14 01 LTOFF-F(01) Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:51 PM : [std-Cleanup ] 16.9C.3C-->ISY/PLM Group=1, Max Hops=1, Hops Left=1 Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:51 PM : [iNST-DUP ] Previous message ignored. Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:51 PM : [D2D-CMP 00C5] CTL [16 9C 3C 1] DFOF op=1 Event(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) is Condition(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) --> true Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:51 PM : [D2D-CMP 00C4] CTL [16 9C 3C 1] DFOF op=1 Event(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) is Condition(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) --> true Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:53 PM : [iNST-TX-I1 ] 02 62 00 00 3D CF 14 00 Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:53 PM : [iNST-ACK ] 02 62 00.00.3D CF 14 00 06 LTOFF-F(00) Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:53 PM : [D2D EVENT ] Event [16 77 E5 1] [sT] [0] uom=0 prec=-1 Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:53 PM : [ 16 77 E5 1] ST 0 Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:53 PM : [D2D-CMP 02A1] STS [16 77 E5 1] ST op=2 Event(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) < Condition(val=63 uom=0 prec=-1) --> true Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:53 PM : [D2D-CMP 0274] STS [16 77 E5 1] ST op=2 Event(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) < Condition(val=63 uom=0 prec=-1) --> true Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:53 PM : [D2D-CMP 0275] STS [16 77 E5 1] ST op=2 Event(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) < Condition(val=63 uom=0 prec=-1) --> true Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:53 PM : [D2D-CMP 0273] STS [16 77 E5 1] ST op=2 Event(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) < Condition(val=63 uom=0 prec=-1) --> true Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:53 PM : [D2D-CMP 00C5] STS [16 77 E5 1] ST op=6 Event(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) != Condition(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) --> false Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:53 PM : [D2D-CMP 00C4] STS [16 77 E5 1] ST op=1 Event(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) is Condition(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) --> true Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:53 PM : [D2D-CMP 00B0] STS [16 77 E5 1] ST op=3 Event(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) > Condition(val=249 uom=0 prec=-1) --> false Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:53 PM : [D2D-CMP 009D] STS [16 77 E5 1] ST op=6 Event(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) != Condition(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) --> false Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:53 PM : [D2D-CMP 009D] STS [16 77 E5 1] ST op=6 Event(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) != Condition(val=255 uom=0 prec=-1) --> true Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:53 PM : [D2D-CMP 008E] STS [16 77 E5 1] ST op=1 Event(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) is Condition(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) --> true Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:53 PM : [D2D-CMP 00A1] STS [16 77 E5 1] ST op=2 Event(val=0 uom=0 prec=-1) < Condition(val=63 uom=0 prec=-1) --> true Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:53 PM : [D2D EVENT ] Event [16 77 E5 2] [sT] [0] uom=0 prec=-1 Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:53 PM : [ 16 77 E5 2] ST 0 Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:53 PM : [D2D EVENT ] Event [16 74 DF 1] [sT] [0] uom=0 prec=-1 Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:53 PM : [ 16 74 DF 1] ST 0 Sun 11/30/2014 07:50:54 PM : [ Time] 19:51:05 11(0)

If I'm not mistaken it should be noted that in this configuration an ON command is sent every 10 secs when there's activity in front of the MS. This could keep your insteon network pretty busy if you live in a busy household. In my case I use 2 motion sensors to monitor rec room occupancy and there are certainly times when the kids are down there that both would be sending an ON command every 10 secs for extended periods of time. Add to that the traffic generated by other motion sensors firing off in other rooms. I could see reliability suffering, which is why I live with the delay of letting ISY turn the lights on but if I've missed something, please let me know.

I personally do not recommend the product. It has several bugs that can add notably to your cost through either lengthy troubleshooting or by having to research forums to find them. Also, the company is not doing anything to fix or improve the product. You'll find a summary of my experience and a suggested alternative at the following post. Also, if you're not deterred, earlier in the thread is one of the key bugs (scenes don't work as intended) to save you some time on that one. http://forum.universal-devices.com/topic/12401-ezio8sa-mysteriously-turning-devices-on/?p=116570

I use ISY to close dampers to my basement during ac calls and to close a damper to a room that doesn't need heat during a heat call. I use IOLincs plus a device that's not longer sold by Smarthome (forget what they called it) to sense when the stat is calling for heat or ac because my stat is not hooked into ISY. I did have one that homeseer controlled but the comms died over a year ago and I haven't pulled the trigger on a new one because I can't decide (leaning to venstar and venlink but still waiting). Don't forget to think of making things fail safe. You don't want to start your ac with fan on high and all (or too many) dampers closed because something didn't work as planned. I used normally open dampers and a killawatt power meter to make sure I wasn't causing my furnace motor to work too hard to push the air under the worse case - I put a 120v plug on my furnace line so I can run it off a UPS, and it's the kind of furnace fan (variable speed DC motor) that maintains the CFM so I can see the wattage go up when the static pressure goes up. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I have the switch Xathros mentions too to make sure all my devices power up in sequence, not just ISY. ISP modem, router, VoIP router, ISY, etc. AND have the thing on a UPS. It can also autoping to restart ISY if it hangs (only kicked in once in the 2 yrs I've had the switch) and to restart a VPN router I had that would not keep the VPN up more than a few days. Although I replaced the router, it was a handy workaround until I could find something I wanted (ended up splurging for a sonicwall tz105). I put some icons on my/my wife's desktops that will restart our VoIP router and another for the whole network (in sequence) using curl to send http commands to switch. I also use curl in my windows server's startup and shutdown scripts to power on/off an external hard drive connected to it. Super cool product. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

looking back in my saved event viewer log I see there was a device that showed "hops left = 2". It's a double band v.41 KPL. The ones with hops left =3 are v.36 KPL's I've attached the event viewer file showing some of my travels over the last hour around a few KPL's - not all at level 3 but I did make sure to turn it to level 3 when I was doing device table reads. All but two (of 7) KPLs needed a restore because of the PLM change. Yes, I did do a "Restore Modem" yesterday but clearly some links didn't get updated properly (the records showed the previous PLM's address) ISY-Events-Log.v4.2.16__Fri 2014.10.17 03.05.26 PM.txt

yes, this is the special PLM that is supposed to prevent the all on issue. I just installed it yesterday so that explains the hops left =3. This post is about a v.36 KPL but it's not the only one showing both issues. The db range message has been an on-going issue when I check device links for other v.36 single band KPL's too. I haven't seen it on my DB KPL's (one v.41 and one v.43). Not sure if it's because they are dual band or for other reasons. Some of the KPL's are in comms challenged areas of the house (2nd floor whereas ISY is in basement) and while the comms is good enough for everyday use, it's tough for "show device links table" purposes and often needs one or more redos before I get to the end of the link table. The DB range error messages are usually if not always part of the equation when those are read. After doing a few more device link table reads, including of a KPL that has always struggled, the "hops left" are always 3 so I'm suspicious that no longer means anything with the newer special firmware. Unfortunate as this is only going to make finding problems harder given the lack of other tools to do that.

Am on firmware 4.2.16 and for the first time ever seeing "hops left = 3". Is this new in .16? I thought the best one could hope for was "hops left = 2" Despite the better than best comms am getting lots of "unexpected response". There's a ~10 sec delay after each unexpected response resulting in a pretty slow "show device links" process, etc. See first screenshot. At some points I sometimes get a flood of "unexpected response". See second screenshot. When I've seen it happen it does eventually recover/move on but adds further delay. The process also fails sometimes, requiring a restart and turning a bit of maintenance or quick troubleshoot into a full morning/afternoon/evening event. What do these two things mean? How can the delays be reduced?

50-50, it is strange DIN doesn't return more. I used dinrelay to find a post by Xathros, who put me onto it and has posted his network resources that you can import. Am not near my own ISY and am using Tapatalk so not easy to point you to it or post what I did now but let me know if you don't find it and I'll try to be more helpful when Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

The ECS Liva is fanless and the CPU can burst/turbo up to 2GHz. I had pictured using remote desktop to configure it (not the TV) but, good point, the WAF will take a hit if I do that while she's watching a movie. I didn't consider that the h/w decoding may not make a difference. Quick sync covers H.264, MPEG2, and VC-1 video. Is it a case of not hitting the right video formats or is it a case of not even doing the ones advertised properly?

Thanks io_guy, larryflix, With respect to XBMC, I'm kind of starting to lean to an ECS Liva running win 8.1, particularly the version with the N2807 CPU (instead of N2806) with Intel Quick Sync (hardware video decoding/decoding). I got one (N2806-based) to replace my in-laws PC and it runs beautifully for their purposes (email, web browsing, word, other light duty) and they're loving it. I also read some positive reviews of it as an XBMC box. ISY-wise I suspect it would be able to run ISYLogger and DSCLink, my two PC-based services today, even when XBMC is running. Although I'm not sure what else people are using RPi's for, it might have to be a trial and error process to know anyway if all the services can co-exist on the same ECS Liva. For sure it doesn't sound like one RPi can do it all so I'm thinking I may try it all on an ECS Liva and, only if needed, offload some stuff to an RPi. Of course there's the cost debate but at the end of the day I don't want to be penny-wise on the hardware and pound foolish on my time to use the English expression (I'm more windows savvy than linux savvy) Any other thoughts / suggestions welcome.

Am looking at buying a RPi for a couple of reasons, mostly ISY related but not exclusively, and I have a few questions for folks with more experience. ISY-wise it would be for a bunch of io_guy's stuff and perhaps other things (I forget right now what others are using an RPi for). As of today for me, though, it's DSCLink and ISYlogger. Tomorrow possibly Venlink, OWLink and maybe a few others (which reminds me I have to get off my e-duff and send him a paypal me$$age soon for all his good work) My other immediate planned use is as an XBMC media server. My questions are: 1) what are other things people use an RPi for? 2) what OS are people using and why? 3) I found info on three RPi distros for XMBC: Raspbmc, OpenELEC and XBian. Anyone know if one or more of these would allow me to do the ISY related stuff on the same RPi? 4) Will using XBMC hamper or be hampered by the ISY stuff running on it? (Not the end of the world if I have to buy more than one but if I didn't have to I'd sooner not) 5) Anyone stick a USB tuner on one? If so, repeat question 4...

Instead of IOLincs would suggest http://www.digital-loggers.com/din.html. Search my username and IOLincs to hopefully find (and be able to avoid) the problems I had with IOLincs. I think just due to too many but I also needed to query them to ensure reliability in my hvac. Too many times my IOLincs query resulted in "safeguards" I had to code activating. The querying also killed ISY performance and lead to other problems. Am on Tapatalk and don't have the links easily accessible. Try also a search of "DIN" to find more on the din relay... Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I think you might have to do "if status on" as it's unlikely the action of going on will happen at exactly 3 or 6 pm to cause the then statement to run... Of course, with "if status on" you'll get notified everyday at 3 and 6 until you clear it. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Good idea. I was avoiding garage door automation using IOLincs because of concerns around reliability of insteon, at least in my house, and some weird still unexplained behaviour I had encountered using them with my hvac. The recent postings about all on commands had me feeling pretty good about that call even though that particular issue hasn't affected me (yet, anyway... knock on wood) and I do hope it gets resolved. How are you "sensing" the door open when the (unconnected to ISY) remote or keypad is used, or are you? Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I once had a dimmer kpl beep and refuse to work when plugged into control CFL bulbs (non dimable). I had to put in a relay. If floods are incandescent, you won't have a problem. One thing I noticed about picking one kind of kpl over another is that you can't do a "replace with" from dimmer to relay or vice versa (unless something has changed recently). With respect to BFG wire, I think if you have metal junction box the grounding can occur via the screws you use to secure kpl to box and you could do away with it. Am not an electrician though so not sure. If anyone is/knows, I would also be curious to know if you could cut a few strands off the ground wire or if they really need to be that big. I have to assume they do otherwise Smarthome would have saved a few bucks and put smaller ones in I would think. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I've been using my WU key with (free) homeseer plugin for 5+ years and am still using it despite having purchased climate module because the forecast data is more accurate. I still need to run HS anyway for some math that I can't do with ISY but I do hope one day to retire it and do everything with ISY. Am also planning a PWS soon and would love to have it update ISY variables directly without relying on cloud service. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

this prompted me to update the thread I said I would update... http://forum.universal-devices.com/topic/12401-ezio8sa-mysteriously-turning-devices-on/?p=116570

I realized recently that I hadn't updated this thread with how things ended. I ended up shipping back the two EZIO8A I had (they had sent me a single band version to see if that fixed my problems and forced me to pay for it.) It took a couple of months to get my money back for the original (dual band) unit because it exceeded the 15 day refund window, although they claimed they had sent me a paypal refund sooner than that. I'll take their word for it that they tried but there was no history of it in my paypal account and it certainly took no time to fix the problem when I followed up. Anyway, I moved all the HVAC relays I wanted the EZIO8SA to control to a Digital Loggers DIN Relay http://www.digital-loggers.com/din.html (thanks to Xathros for the suggestion), which has been rock solid reliable. The only problem (perhaps) with the DIN relay is that I can't query it, however I don't need to (unlike the insteon based IOLinc solution I had before trying the EZIO8SA). Interestingly, because ISY doesn't directly track the DIN relay relays directly (I use variables to do it), I can override some HVAC settings using the DIN relay's built in web server or the iOS app for it without writing all kinds of conditions in my ISY programs to allow manual override of my automation. That's been a nice bonus that has also helped me more easily test/fine tune when I want certain HVAC events to occur and not (e.g. particularly for furnace fan on/off, dampers open/close, etc. to re-balance air temp in parts of the house) Main lessons learned: - Smartenit is NOT fixing bugs or making improvements to their insteon devices (they're focus is zigbee). I got this directly from Justin at tech support. - The documentation beyond the one pager that comes with the EZIO-series of devices sucks - Despite telling me improvements to documentation would be made and asking me for suggestion (which I wasted my time providing) no improvements were made, despite the many known bugs that aren't being fixed While I did get a refund minus Cdn-to-US exchange rate loses both ways (including for the test unit I was sent), I wasted close to 100 hours troubleshooting problems (mostly the one in this thread) that ended up being known issues. I'll let folks decide whether any of this is important to them or not but will say I don't plan to buy anything from Smartenit in the future.

I personally don't recommend the EZIO8SA. Search for it and my username for the details - am using Tapatalk and don't have them handy. (I really should update the thread on how things ended up... Got my money back for the parts but not for the ~100 hours of my time...) Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Don't underestimate your need for scenes. They are a very nice feature of insteon and needed to change keypad buttons programmatically. Also, don't underestimate the value of good support and a helpful user community. As a veteran of homeseer that still uses it for a few things (forecast data and math functions) - and many other IT products - I will say ISY support is second to none. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk