LeeG

Just delete the device. The Scenes and Programs are not deleted. Only the references to the device are removed.

ergodic I finally recreated your situation but do not know what I did different on that test than the dozens of tests run before it. I did not have trace running as it had worked so many times before I stopped running the trace. I'll get back to this after some sleep. I suggest doing the following. Use Link Management | New INSTEON Device specifying the Device Type of EZX10RF and Remove existing links to initially add the EZX10RF to ISY. This option is listed in the install popup instructions except it states to use this method if preserving existing links which you would not use that link record option. Then use the Add X10 Device to EZX10RF for each X10 code. This is the sequence I used during the 2.8.x testing where SHN device support was officially added. Once I figure out exactly what I did to recreate the problem I'll update this topic. Lee

After clicking OK the first time, after sending the X10 code to the EZX10RF, the lower left corner of the Admin Console shows a Yellow flag for approx 40 seconds displaying message Initialization System. After that the System Busy message displays for another 20 seconds approximately for a total of a little more than 60 seconds to complete the processing associated with the first OK click. This processing must complete and the Ready message come back with a green flag before the Set button on the EZX10RF can be pressed again. Otherwise the add process does not complete. Below is the first part of the Event Viewer trace with Device communications events selected. The initial SHN device add is time consuming as the ISY must determine the size of the PLM memory in the EZX10RF before it can proceed to update the link record. You will see Set MSB for 0F, 1F and 3F as part of the process to determine memory size of an SHN device PLM memory. Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:51 PM : [LNK-BGN ] 02 64 00 00 06 Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:52 PM : [LNK-STAT ] 02 53 S(00) gid=01 01.DB.DE 0000 00 Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:52 PM : Linked: Linked 01.DB.DE.01 type=03.0D.00 Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:52 PM : [01.DB.DE.1] Start : Adding device to ISY Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:53 PM : [01.DB.DE.1] Finish : Adding device to ISY was Successful Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:53 PM : [All ] Writing 0 bytes to devices Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:53 PM : ---- Initializing the linked devices ---- Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:53 PM : [01.DB.DE.1] Calculating EZxx Address Offset Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:53 PM : [01.DB.DE.1] EZxx start address at 0x0FFF Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:53 PM : [LNK-END ] 02 65 06 Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:53 PM : [standard Msg. Handler] Unexpected Ack imCmd=65 cmd1= 0xDE Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:53 PM : [iNST-ACK ] 02 62 01.DB.DE 0F 28 0F 06 SET-MSB(0F) Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:53 PM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 01.DB.DE 12.9F.E4 2B 28 0F SET-MSB(0F) Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:53 PM : [standard-Direct Ack][01.DB.DE-->ISY/PLM Group=0] Max Hops=3, Hops Left=2 Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:57 PM : [01.DB.DE.1] EZxx start address at 0x0FFF Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:58 PM : [iNST-ACK ] 02 62 01.DB.DE 0F 28 0F 06 SET-MSB(0F) Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:58 PM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 01.DB.DE 12.9F.E4 2B 28 0F SET-MSB(0F) Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:58 PM : [standard-Direct Ack][01.DB.DE-->ISY/PLM Group=0] Max Hops=3, Hops Left=2 Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:58 PM : [iNST-ACK ] 02 62 01.DB.DE 0F 2B FF 06 PEEK (FF) Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:58 PM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 01.DB.DE 12.9F.E4 2B 2B 00 PEEK (00) Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:58 PM : [standard-Direct Ack][01.DB.DE-->ISY/PLM Group=0] Max Hops=3, Hops Left=2 Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:58 PM : [01.DB.DE.1] EZxx start address at 0x0FFF Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:59 PM : [iNST-ACK ] 02 62 01.DB.DE 0F 28 1F 06 SET-MSB(1F) Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:59 PM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 01.DB.DE 12.9F.E4 2B 28 1F SET-MSB(1F) Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:59 PM : [standard-Direct Ack][01.DB.DE-->ISY/PLM Group=0] Max Hops=3, Hops Left=2 Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:59 PM : [iNST-ACK ] 02 62 01.DB.DE 0F 2B FF 06 PEEK (FF) Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:59 PM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 01.DB.DE 12.9F.E4 2B 2B 00 PEEK (00) Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:59 PM : [standard-Direct Ack][01.DB.DE-->ISY/PLM Group=0] Max Hops=3, Hops Left=2 Mon 04/25/2011 09:41:59 PM : [01.DB.DE.1] EZxx start address at 0x0FFF Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:00 PM : [iNST-ACK ] 02 62 01.DB.DE 0F 28 3F 06 SET-MSB(3F) Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:00 PM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 01.DB.DE 12.9F.E4 2B 28 3F SET-MSB(3F) Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:00 PM : [standard-Direct Ack][01.DB.DE-->ISY/PLM Group=0] Max Hops=3, Hops Left=2 Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:00 PM : [iNST-ACK ] 02 62 01.DB.DE 0F 2B FF 06 PEEK (FF) Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:00 PM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 01.DB.DE 12.9F.E4 2B 2B 85 PEEK (85) Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:00 PM : [standard-Direct Ack][01.DB.DE-->ISY/PLM Group=0] Max Hops=3, Hops Left=2 Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:00 PM : [01.DB.DE.1] EZxx start address at 0x0FFF Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:01 PM : [iNST-ACK ] 02 62 01.DB.DE 0F 28 0F 06 SET-MSB(0F) Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:01 PM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 14.56.66 00.00.02 CB 11 00 LTONRR (00) Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:01 PM : [standard-Group][14.56.66-->Group=2] Max Hops=3, Hops Left=2 Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:01 PM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 14.56.66 12.9F.E4 41 11 02 LTONRR (02) Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:01 PM : [standard-Cleanup][14.56.66-->ISY/PLM Group=2] Max Hops=1, Hops Left=0 Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:01 PM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 01.DB.DE 12.9F.E4 2B 28 0F SET-MSB(0F) Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:01 PM : [standard-Direct Ack][01.DB.DE-->ISY/PLM Group=0] Max Hops=3, Hops Left=2 Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:01 PM : [iNST-ACK ] 02 62 01.DB.DE 0F 2B FF 06 PEEK (FF) Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:02 PM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 01.DB.DE 12.9F.E4 2B 2B 00 PEEK (00) Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:02 PM : [standard-Direct Ack][01.DB.DE-->ISY/PLM Group=0] Max Hops=3, Hops Left=2 Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:02 PM : [iNST-ACK ] 02 62 01.DB.DE 0F 29 01 06 POKE (01) Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:02 PM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 01.DB.DE 12.9F.E4 2B 29 01 POKE (01) Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:02 PM : [standard-Direct Ack][01.DB.DE-->ISY/PLM Group=0] Max Hops=3, Hops Left=2 Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:02 PM : [01.DB.DE.1] EZxx start address at 0x0FFF Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:02 PM : [iNST-ACK ] 02 62 01.DB.DE 0F 28 1F 06 SET-MSB(1F) Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:03 PM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 01.DB.DE 12.9F.E4 2B 28 1F SET-MSB(1F) Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:03 PM : [standard-Direct Ack][01.DB.DE-->ISY/PLM Group=0] Max Hops=3, Hops Left=2 Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:03 PM : [iNST-ACK ] 02 62 01.DB.DE 0F 2B FF 06 PEEK (FF) Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:03 PM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 01.DB.DE 12.9F.E4 2B 2B 00 PEEK (00) Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:03 PM : [standard-Direct Ack][01.DB.DE-->ISY/PLM Group=0] Max Hops=3, Hops Left=2 Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:03 PM : [iNST-ACK ] 02 62 01.DB.DE 0F 29 02 06 POKE (02) Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:04 PM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 14.56.66 00.00.02 CB 13 00 LTOFFRR(00) Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:04 PM : [standard-Group][14.56.66-->Group=2] Max Hops=3, Hops Left=2 Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:04 PM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 14.56.66 12.9F.E4 41 13 02 LTOFFRR(02) Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:04 PM : [standard-Cleanup][14.56.66-->ISY/PLM Group=2] Max Hops=1, Hops Left=0 Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:04 PM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 01.DB.DE 12.9F.E4 2B 29 02 POKE (02) Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:04 PM : [standard-Direct Ack][01.DB.DE-->ISY/PLM Group=0] Max Hops=3, Hops Left=2 Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:04 PM : [01.DB.DE.1] EZxx start address at 0x0FFF Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:04 PM : [iNST-ACK ] 02 62 01.DB.DE 0F 28 3F 06 SET-MSB(3F) Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:05 PM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 01.DB.DE 12.9F.E4 2B 28 3F SET-MSB(3F) Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:05 PM : [standard-Direct Ack][01.DB.DE-->ISY/PLM Group=0] Max Hops=3, Hops Left=2 Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:05 PM : [iNST-ACK ] 02 62 01.DB.DE 0F 2B FF 06 PEEK (FF) Mon 04/25/2011 09:42:05 PM : [iNST-SRX ] 02 50 01.DB.DE 12.9F.E4 2B 2B 85 PEEK (85)

It takes longer than the few seconds shown in the Event Viewer trace to add the EZX10RF to the ISY for the first X10 code. The status messages in the lower left corner of the Admin Console should track the progress. If the EZX10RF Set button is pressed too soon after clicking the first OK the link record in the EZX10RF that was created by the Set button (done under the covers by the ISY) has not been updated with the correct information needed by the ISY. Thus the mismatch between the link record created by the simulated Set button press and what the ISY needs to have written in the EZX10RF. I will delete my EZX10RF and add it back with a B1 which you have now determine to be unrelated. I’m pretty sure the device add process is not completing before the EZX10RF Set button is pressed to advance the process. I will post the Event Trace from the initial part of the first device add as well a generally time the first EZX10RF X10 code add.

I linked B1 to my EZX10RF so it does not appear to be a general systemic problem with the EZX10RF. Do you have another X10 receiver that can be used to verify the Palm Pad is sending the correct code for the top button press.

Ergodic I don’t know what “Link device†is. The documented process for adding the EZX10RF to the ISY and defining an X10 code is Link Management | Add X10 Device to EZX20RF. I suggest following that process. Any other way of defining the EZX10RF is not what UDI publishes for adding the EZX10RF and may explain why the first code is having a problem. Lee

Ergodic The following link record was established with a Set button link from a PLM with revision 92 software. The ISY did not complete the “Add X10 Device to EZX10RF†process. This can happen if the System Busy process is not allowed to complete after clicking OK. 0FF8: E2 01 11 CC CD 03 05 92 The ISY plays no direct part in establishing the actual X10 code with the EZX10RF. Setting the X10 code is between the EZX10RF and the device sending the B1 code. I have not heard of a problem with the EZX10RF having an issue with a specific X10 code. What are you using to send the B1 X10 address? I’ll set up a test here using B1 specifically. Please confirm you added the EZX10RF to the ISY using New Insteon Device specifying the EZX10RF device type rather than using the Link Management | Add X10 Device to EZX10RF. If done this way it makes the first X10 code added to the EZX10RF slightly different since the EZX10RF is already defined to the ISY. Lee

sanders2222 On the Smarthome sales page for clear KPL button conversion kit are several links to button prototypes, MS Word, Adobe, maybe something else if memory is correct. Almost all of my KPL buttons are clear. That is all there was in the beginning. Avery Labels have small mat finish that I used to label all the paddle switches. I place the label just below the paddle middle. Turned out better than I thought it would. Might be able to use something like that on a KPL. Would have to cut the small labels even smaller for a KPL button. Lee

sanders2222 All the Insteon RF only devices (RemoteLincs, Motion Sensors, TriggerLincs) must be put into linking mode to keep them awake so the ISY can write the required link records for the Scene. Otherwise they sleep (turn the RF circuitry off to conserve battery) which makes outside initiated communication impossible. “So OK, I've added the RemoteLinc to my list of devices. If I understand it correctly, I must set up scenes for each button (1-6) to control other devices.†Yes. “ Do I need a scene if I use a button to trigger a program?†No. “EDIT: Also, did someone figure a scheme to make the ALL ON/OFF buttons do just that?†All On/All Off works for devices which have been linked as Scene Responders to the RemoteLinc buttons. The All On/All Off buttons cannot be used to trigger a Program. Lee

sanders2222 There is an option Link Management | Link a RemoteLinc that is used to add a RemoteLinc to the ISY. Lee EDIT: until the RemoteLinc is added to the ISY and an ISY Scene defined with the RemoteLinc button as a Controller and the plugin dimmer as a Responder the ISY will not be aware of the RemoteLinc controlling the plugin dimmer with direct links. Should also unlink the RemoteLinc from the plugin dimmer before going any further. Links established outside of the ISY are not known by the ISY and will bite you eventually.

Michel, I made that assumption from the beginning (hope that was not a mistake). Since the InLineLinc added as a Red device when using Auto Discover I believe they are w/sense. That does raise the question of whether the correct device type was selected as they were added originally by specifying the device type. Perhaps they were originally added using the wrong device type. dnl Do you have any ILLs that have not been corrected? If so what is the device type shown by the Admin Console. Lee

Responder only devices are Blue. An ApplianceLinc should be Blue. They do not have the function necessary to Control another Insteon device. Other devices that have paddles/buttons which can control other Insteon devices should be Red. The question about color might have provided some information as to how the Controller link records were lost. It does not in this case. Thanks for the information though, it might have proved useful. Actually it is helpful to know that the color is correct. It eliminates one possibility.

Satwar The image level was not identified so I pulled this from the 3.1.2 announce. The Admin Console must be in sync with ISY firmware level. What are you looking for? 7. IMPORTANT Once upgrade is completed and ISY reboots, use any of the following methods to access your ISY's Admin Console: a. http://isy/admin - applet (Windows only) b. http://isy/admin.jnlp - Java application (Windows only) c. http://your.isy.ip.address/admin - applet d. http://your.isy.ip.address/admin.jnlp - Java application e. http://www.universal-devices.com/99i/3.1.2 - applet f. http://www.universal-devices.com/99i/3.1.2/admin.jnlp - Java application Lee

gadgetfreak If you still have a device that has not been deleted/added back and is not sending state changes, is the device entry in the My Lighting tree Red or Blue. If Blue what is the device type displayed in the right pane when the device is selected and does it show an actual firmware level or v.00. Don't worry about it if you have already readded all the devices. This was just a thought generated by a different thread. Lee

dnl You are very welcome. Glad we found a way to get it working. I wish I knew of a way to fix this without the delete/add sequence but I think that is the only way to get the ISY to treat it as both a responder and a controller. Lee

There is a Scene with 6 responders. The On Level for all 6 responders should be changed to 50%. Of course each individual responder On Level can be set to 50%. Or the "Apply Changes To All Devices" box can be checked which will result in a single line with On Level and Ramp Rate. When a change is made to that single line the change is applied to all the responders in the Scene. The ISY User Guide has a good description of this and the "Copy Scene Attributes From ..." features.

Does the About show 2.8.16 and was the Java cache cleared to be sure the Admin Console is not back level. If using a URL to access the Admin Console does it reflect 2.8.16. No fixes or enhancements for the three 3.1.x Betas indicate any changes to how the InLineLinc is processed. That is not definitive but suggestive there is something else affecting the InLineLinc. What options were used when InLineLinc added to the ISY. I used Auto Detect when I added the InLineLinc to 3.1.2. The ISY would not have established the links necessary for the InLineLinc to send messages to the ISY PLM if it thinks it is a Responder only. This would explain why notifications are not being sent to the ISY. You can confirm this by doing a Show Device Links Table of the InLineLinc and look for a link record with E201 xx.xx.xx where xx.xx.xx is the PLM Insteon address. This link record is necessary for the InLineLinc to send local state change messages to the ISY.

Upgrade to 2.8.16. At 3.1.2 it is Red so I assume this was resolved in the evolution of 2.8.x Betas.

polexian Is it that you want to actually turn a given device on at a specific level from a Program, that is certainly supported. If the question is can the Local On Level be changed by a Program such that when the device paddle/button is pressed it comes on at a new Local On Level, that may be possible but I would have to run a test to verify. Please clarify which you want to do. Thanks Lee

You are on 2.8.16. That is the latest official release. The 3.1.x are Beta level. Sorry I don't know of any way to handle it but one device at a time. Assuming they are all working at the end of this exercise I would take a backup, and then incremental backups as you get the Scenes and Programs back in operation.

I cannot explain how but the links for that device are wrong. The required link records for the device to notify the ISY of state changes have occurred are missing. The only solution I know of (since Restore did not correct the problem) is to delete the device and add it back to the ISY. After doing that do a Show Device Links Table before doing anything else to confirm the device add does in fact write the E201 xx.xx.xx where xx.xx.xx is the PLM address link record. Do you use other automation software that could have over written the link records. Does not look like that as the Restore should be put them back if the ISY still have a record of them. What firmware level on you on?

Do a Show Device Links Table for the device and look for a link record that looks like this E201 xx.xx.xx .. .. .. where xx.xx.xx is the PLM Insteon address Do a Show PLM Links Table and look for a link record that looks like this A201 yy.yy.yy .. .. .. where yy.yy.yy is the device Insteon address

Definitely not normal. When a device is added to the ISY link records are generated which cause the device to send messages to the ISY whenever the device is manually operated. First is powerline communication of good quality. Do devices turn each other On/Off as expected and can they be controller reliably from the ISY. If powerline communication is intermittent then noise or signal attenuation is suspect. If general powerline communication is good but specific device never notify the ISY of state changes either the link records in the device or link records in the PLM have been lost or corrupted. Pick one device that never works, Restore Device to restore the device link records. If that does not resolve the problem Restore Modem (PLM) to restore the PLM link database. EDIT: routine query of devices should not be necessary. It puts lots of traffic on the powerline that can interfere with other activity. Once the issue is identified and resolved devices will rarely if ever be out of sync. If the ISY is not seeing state changes the use of Control will make no difference. If the ISY sees an inbound state change message such that Control would work the device status would be updated. The status is not being updated because the ISY is not seeing the state change messages in the first place.

johnmsch You are making good progress. A basic Scene is an Insteon construct. The ISY makes defining Scenes pretty easy. Actually defining one ISY Scene results in multiple Insteon Scenes being generated under the covers. Any given Insteon Scene can have only 1 Controller. When you define an ISY Scene and add multiple Controllers, the ISY is actually generating multiple Insteon Scenes, 1 for each Controller and 1 additional which has the ISY PLM as the Controller, again all defined under the covers. It is this PLM Controller Scene that is used by Programs and the Admin Console. If you want other devices to turn On/Off in addition to KeypadLinc Secondary button B, these devices must be added as Responders to the Scene. Insteon does not propagate Controller requests beyond the specific Responders. That is, when KPL Secondary button B is turned On by the ISY Scene, the KPL DOES NOT propagate the On request to KPL button B Responders. A Responder does not turn into a Controller when the responder is directed to turn On by another Controller device. This is consistent across the Insteon line. There is a rather old but mostly still applicable insteondetails.pdf document that covers the basics of Insteon. The document is in the public space on insteon.net web site. Lee

johnmsch Sounds like the Scene is defined correctly. A Secondary KPL button has nothing to "adjust" so it may not appear in the Adjust Scene selection list. Use Insteon (rather than Adjust Scene), select Scene name and On or Off. The Scene names are not in collating sequence unless you restart the Admin Console. I defined a new Scene and added a Secondary KPL button as a Responder. My newscene appears at the bottom of the list. Then added an Action to a Then Clause using "Insteon" Set "newscene" "ON" to confirm I had not missed something. On the UDI Wiki in the How-to Guide section, under Scenes is a step by step explanation on Scenes. Lee