gduprey Posted January 13, 2016 Posted January 13, 2016 Howdy, Okay -- playing with this and being relatively new to Echo skills and add-ons, I'm curious about using the Connected Home vs the ISY skill. 1) It seems like I can use the skill and not enable connected home -- is that correct? 2) Other than syntax differences, are their any capability differences between the Connected Home and Skill method of controlling the ISY? 3) Any other pros/cons (better name recognition, etc)? Any reasons to use one over the other? Thanks!! Gerry Quote
Michel Kohanim Posted January 13, 2016 Posted January 13, 2016 Hi Gerry, 1) yes 2) yes ... different syntax. Connected Home is for lighting only (on/off/dim/brighten). Skill is for more advanced things such as door locks, thermostats, energy information (shortly), etc. 3) you should use both With kind regards, Michel Quote
MWareman Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 (edited) 3) you should use bothThis. No reason not to! It's *so much better* to say 'Alexa, turn on the kitchen light' and get 'OK' back instead of 'Alexa, tell Izzy to turn on the kitchen light' and maybe it will work, but have it respond 20% of the time that it couldn't find the device due to the Izzy not being heard properly and the request getting misrouted. Much, much better now! Edited January 14, 2016 by MWareman Quote
gduprey Posted January 14, 2016 Author Posted January 14, 2016 After just a few days of using both, I'm actually not in agreement on #2 & 3 . On #2 (connected home for devices) - it's easy to use connected home for programs and scenes as well as devices. Once you know that "xxxx on" runs the "then" portion, you can either use as is or write a "proxy" program that Alexa will run to in-turn do what you need. As for #3 (use both), I think the skill is (relatively) difficult to use and much less reliable (from s spoken word recognition standpoint). In this house, so far, there is absolute zero interest by anyone for using the skill once they see how easy the connected home stuff is. Even running programs is so much easier Connected Home: "Alexa, Evening Lights On" (success over 95% recognition) vs. Skill: "Alexa, tell izzy to run Evening Lights" (success: like 60% recognition) #1 works like 98% of the time and is shorter. #2 works about 60% of the time and takes longer to say. So while the skill obviously allows a lot more of ISY to be exposed, I'm finding that, for Echo so far, about a dozen connected home phrases hit most of what my family actually wants/needs. Other than my "two echos, two ISYs" issue on another thread (which I just do not think is going to play well with connected home), the connected home stuff is the more natural, "Echo-esque" solution. This also fits into my previous experience with house-based voice recognition. The idea of being able to control everything by voice sounds nice, but at some point, it either results in lengthy statements or, more often, non-working statements as most folks don't remember the exact name for every single thing in the house. I feel it's much better to focus on things that the family will really want to control via voice and then use a combination of ISY programs/scenes and connected home commands to make that work reliably and "as people expect" it to work. Then incrementally add more as there is actual demand. Gerry Quote
Michel Kohanim Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 Hello everyone, Amazon has verified that there's an issue with how Echo processes words that are not in the lists (and loses them) and they are going to fix it. In the meantime, based on extensive testing (thank you Benoit) and Amazon feedback, we just submitted our next iteration of the skill which should dramatically improve skill recognition. We need to wait for recertification! With kind regards, Michel Quote
Guest Digger Posted January 15, 2016 Posted January 15, 2016 Skill would not work for me unless I opened it for each command. Connected home so far works almost every time Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote
stusviews Posted January 15, 2016 Posted January 15, 2016 I seem to have lost the Skill. I had disabled the Skill some days ago and re-enabled the Skill today, but Izzy can't find any device, program, lock, etc. I do get messages that indicate that the Skill is enabled. Quote
Michel Kohanim Posted January 15, 2016 Posted January 15, 2016 Hi all, We are looking into it. With kind regards, Michel Quote
bmercier Posted January 15, 2016 Posted January 15, 2016 I seem to have lost the Skill. I had disabled the Skill some days ago and re-enabled the Skill today, but Izzy can't find any device, program, lock, etc. I do get messages that indicate that the Skill is enabled. Hi Stusview, What error message do you get exactly? Can you type the exact message you get, or copy-paste from the echo app? (You can use echo.amazon.com instead of the mobile app) Benoit Quote
stusviews Posted January 15, 2016 Posted January 15, 2016 Living room ceiling is a SwitchLinc dimmer. Alexa, ask Izzy to turn on the living room ceiling I could not find device living room. Turn on which device? When only the skill was available, this command worked. Also, I can give you detailed help for one of the following topics: Skill configuration, Controlling devices, Controlling Locks, Controlling Thermostats and Programs. Which topic can I help you with? You can try the following commands: Tell ISY to run program. Tell ISY to stop program. Ask ISY to get program status. Do you need help on another topic? which indicate that the skill is involved. When I told Alexa to ask Izzy to run program verticals, Alexa heard, ""yes why ride caro graham bird." When I tried again, Alexa offered help. Alexa, ask Izzy to lock all locks, Alexa heard, "Yes it to lock all lox." Sounds tasty. so I tried, ask Izzy to lock all door locks, Alexa replied with, "0 device locked successfully." I have a few Schlage Z-Wave locks which did lock successfully before I added Connected Home and disabled the skill. Quote
bmercier Posted January 15, 2016 Posted January 15, 2016 Alexa, ask Izzy to turn on the living room ceiling I could not find device living room. Turn on which device? When only the skill was available, this command worked. This message indicates that the skill received "living room" as the device name. I looked up in the database for your spokens, and I found "living room ceiling", but not "living room". This is why you are getting this message. If whenever you speak "living room ceiling" alexa passes "living room", you may want to change your spoken to just "living room". If it worked before, it may be that it was previously understanding and passing "ceiling". That we don't have control over it. The skill configuration, like utterances and device samples, have not changed since skill went live. That's about to change though, a new version is coming. Also, I can give you detailed help for one of the following topics: Skill configuration, Controlling devices, Controlling Locks, Controlling Thermostats and Programs. Which topic can I help you with? You can try the following commands: Tell ISY to run program. Tell ISY to stop program. Ask ISY to get program status. Do you need help on another topic? which indicate that the skill is involved. When I told Alexa to ask Izzy to run program verticals, Alexa heard, ""yes why ride caro graham bird." When I tried again, Alexa offered help. Alexa, ask Izzy to lock all locks, Alexa heard, "Yes it to lock all lox." Sounds tasty. so I tried, ask Izzy to lock all door locks, Alexa replied with, "0 device locked successfully." I have a few Schlage Z-Wave locks which did lock successfully before I added Connected Home and disabled the skill. About your locks, I looked up you spoken, and I couldn't find any device of type 'lock'. Please go to your list of spoken, search for 'lock'. Make sure you have devices of type 'lock'. If you see a lock that is not properl of type 'lock', then that would be a bug. Benoit. Quote
stusviews Posted January 16, 2016 Posted January 16, 2016 My concern is thermostats and locks. I successfully added and named the locks. Izzy doesn't like "front door lock," nor "front door deadbolt" (i.e., can't find "front door"), "side door deadbolt" is accepted, but all locks are locked or unlocked. In response to tell Izzy to run [program_name], "Get status for which program?" At least the skill recognized "program." Izzy also can't find the "bedroom" or "living room" thermostat, but after a status question understands that a temperature is being asked for, so the skill is enabled. BTW, as of now "living room ceiling" is working--sometimes. Quote
bmercier Posted January 16, 2016 Posted January 16, 2016 My concern is thermostats and locks. I successfully added and named the locks. Izzy doesn't like "front door lock," nor "front door deadbolt" (i.e., can't find "front door"), "side door deadbolt" is accepted, but all locks are locked or unlocked. In response to tell Izzy to run [program_name], "Get status for which program?" At least the skill recognized "program." Izzy also can't find the "bedroom" or "living room" thermostat, but after a status question understands that a temperature is being asked for, so the skill is enabled. BTW, as of now "living room ceiling" is working--sometimes. Try "front door" instead. It should work, this is what alexa passes to the skill. Recognition for "front door" is far from perfect, but it works (when she don't hear "from door") But other than that, be patient, a new version of the skill is under certification review. It should help significantly. There is still a bug where values not listed in the samples are not being passes to the skill. But in the mean time, 3-slot device names have been implemented, and the words in the samples have been enhanced also. Benoit. Quote
DIYguy Posted January 21, 2016 Posted January 21, 2016 I feel like the guy overhearing an interesting conversation but not completely understanding the conversation. I've had my ISY for years with LOTS of Insteon devices, programmed, scenes etc. MobiLinc Pro on the iPhone and iPad. Just bought the Hub in anticipation of the Echo. Bought the Harmony Elite because it will link with Insteon and the Hub and hopefully not frustrate the wife. Just ordered the Echo and waiting for it to be in stock and ship. Trying to do my home work while waiting for the Echo to show up and trying to figure out....what Connected Home? I can't find a link to to a specific software or operating system Connected Home, just the concept. What is Connected Home and how do I get it? Quote
jerlands Posted January 21, 2016 Posted January 21, 2016 I feel like the guy overhearing an interesting conversation but not completely understanding the conversation. I've had my ISY for years with LOTS of Insteon devices, programmed, scenes etc. MobiLinc Pro on the iPhone and iPad. Just bought the Hub in anticipation of the Echo. Bought the Harmony Elite because it will link with Insteon and the Hub and hopefully not frustrate the wife. Just ordered the Echo and waiting for it to be in stock and ship. Trying to do my home work while waiting for the Echo to show up and trying to figure out....what Connected Home? I can't find a link to to a specific software or operating system Connected Home, just the concept. What is Connected Home and how do I get it? You need the Echo to fully discover it but it is an interface for control with ISY using Alexa (Amazon's voice recognition/control system.) You don't install it but connect with it via the Amazon Alexa app http://alexa.amazon.com Jon... Quote
jerlands Posted January 21, 2016 Posted January 21, 2016 I feel like the guy overhearing an interesting conversation but not completely understanding the conversation. I've had my ISY for years with LOTS of Insteon devices, programmed, scenes etc. MobiLinc Pro on the iPhone and iPad. Just bought the Hub in anticipation of the Echo. Bought the Harmony Elite because it will link with Insteon and the Hub and hopefully not frustrate the wife. Just ordered the Echo and waiting for it to be in stock and ship. Trying to do my home work while waiting for the Echo to show up and trying to figure out....what Connected Home? I can't find a link to to a specific software or operating system Connected Home, just the concept. What is Connected Home and how do I get it? FYI... home depot also carries it and may be in stock near your location. Jon... Quote
DIYguy Posted January 21, 2016 Posted January 21, 2016 Was wondering if it might be propitiatory with the Echo, haven't seen it with any other HA systems. I expect Amazon is selling the Echos so fast they can't keep them in stock. I received my e-mail from UDI sales this morning announcing the Echo was working with ISY and pretty immediately ordered it. Unfortunately listed as "expected in stock January 28th" so on the pre sale waiting list. I have everything loaded and programmed in ISY but bought the Hub because the wife can use her iPhone to turn on the living room lights while planted on the couch. She doesn't like looking for the itty bitty little white remote control. Phone is ALWAYS in her hand so easy to find. I'm an automation freak but the wife doesn't like all the remote controls. Really looking forward to her being able to run the automation scene for evening lighting by giving a voice command. I know she can do that. Quote
jerlands Posted January 21, 2016 Posted January 21, 2016 There's more info about the Amazon's Connected Home Project here (ISY isn't on the list yet.) Jon... Quote
gduprey Posted January 21, 2016 Author Posted January 21, 2016 ISY has given us two different ways to integrate Echo and ISY (based on what Echo offers for integration): ISY Skill: This lets you can generically control nearly any ISY device via the Echo. As such, the sequences of words to use the skill is slightly longer and doesn't seem (at this time) to be as accurate (voice recognition-wise). Pros: Nearly everything the ISY can do is immediately available from the echo (lamps, programs, thermostats, locks, etc). Cons: Voice recognition isn't as good as other Echo commands (possibly IMHO) and the number of words you have to speak (correctly) to accomplish something is longer Connected Home: A very specific Echo command set (like being able to play music) that Echo itself knows about regarding controlling typical home devices. Since it's more "native" to the Echo, there are less words you need to say to make something happen and the voice recognition is (seems) a lot better. Pros: Shorter commands, better voice recognition. Cons: You have to "define" each thing you want to command this way in the portal and the structure (way you address things), isn't as friendly to things like locks, thermostats, programs, etc.Examples: have echo turn on a dining room light: Skill version: Alexa - tell izzy to turn on Dining room light Connected Home Version: Alexa - Dining Room Light on It may not seem like much of a difference, but using it, the connected home approach is much more natural and easier for non-techie people to pick up.Fortunatly, you can use both -- at the same time. Almost no setup to make the skill work and very easy setup to make the connected home stuff work.I've used the skill about 3 times and it didn't work right all three times (voice recognition issues, not ISY). The connected home stuff has been used since I set it up and it works like you'd expect an Echo connected thing to work. The natural desire, when you first make this work, is to set everything up via connected home. I find that is overload and overwhelming. Too many commands and you'll never remember what the exact phrasing is for each. Instead, start with a half dozen frequently used commands and get them working and then as you live with it, add commands that strike you/your family as useful as you come across them.Final note: If you want to use connected home for things that aren't easily supported via connected home, you can create programs in the ISY and then use connected home commands to execute those programs. For example, if I want to have a command to turn the HVAC/Thermostat fan on continuously, I just create an ISY program that turns the fan on in the "then" section and back to auto in the "else" section. I can then setup a connected home command that goes like "alexa - furnace fan on" and viola!!Gerry Quote
MWareman Posted January 21, 2016 Posted January 21, 2016 Thread about adding the Alexa Connected Home (beta) to your Alexa Portal, to allow ISY control (apparently its currently limited to the first 450 users).. http://forum.universal-devices.com/index.php?/topic/17861-Amazon-Echo---Connected-Home-Feature-(Beta)! Quote
Michel Kohanim Posted January 22, 2016 Posted January 22, 2016 Hi all, More documentation can be found here: http://wiki.universal-devices.com/index.php?title=Main_Page#ISY_Portal.2FAmazon_Echo We are also going to add a comprehensive list of names that the Skill understands. With kind regards, Michel Quote
jerlands Posted January 22, 2016 Posted January 22, 2016 Hi all, More documentation can be found here: http://wiki.universal-devices.com/index.php?title=Main_Page#ISY_Portal.2FAmazon_Echo We are also going to add a comprehensive list of names that the Skill understands. With kind regards, Michel Vroom much appreciated. Jon... Quote
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