Devices respond to some commands... communication issue?

[B0SST0N]

I am setting up a new system in a ~1500sqft house. I have 4 access points, one is piggybacked on the PLM and the others are spread out around the house. At least 2 are on separate legs of the incoming line. I have moved the PLM/ISY to different circuits in my house, each move is resulting in communication issues on different circuits each time. Right now I am having particular difficulties with a 4 gang switch plate that has two switchlincs installed in it. The weird thing is that these switches will ALWAYS respond to the "Fast On" or "Fast Off" buttons instantly. But, when I try to command them with the regular "On" or "Off" buttons, they will NEVER respond. Is it possible for devices to act in this fashion? Responding instantly to one command but not another? Am I endlessly searching for communication issues when I may have some bad hardware? I have some filterlincs installed on a couple UPS units... and I have tried systematically unplugging most commonly offending devices in the house. I am pretty new to Insteon/ISY... and this is driving me nuts... If I move the PLM/ISY to a different location, I have the same problems but in different parts of the house. I have tried moving the 4 access points around too with little success. About 20 insteon devices are currently installed. I have 15 more to do... could it strengthen the system to install the rest or should I quit while I'm ahead and invest in another technology?

[B0SST0N]

Now the two switchlincs mentioned before are responding perfectly with no changes to the system... but my two stairway switchlincs are not responding. Why do the problems seem so intermittent and on different circuits at different times? The only circuit that is reliable is the one that the PLM/ISY are on... I have tried to notice anything running that would be interfering... A/C? Water Heater? Refrig? All to no avail... I can turn them all on or all off and get different results every few minutes.

[Michel Kohanim]

Hi BOSSTON,

 

Apologies for the inconvenience. It sure sounds like phase coupling issues. Are you sure you have Access Points bridging your phases? If not, I certainly recommend it otherwise you are going to have these problems intermittently with no end.

 

With kind regards,

Michel

 

Now the two switchlincs mentioned before are responding perfectly with no changes to the system... but my two stairway switchlincs are not responding. Why do the problems seem so intermittent and on different circuits at different times? The only circuit that is reliable is the one that the PLM/ISY are on... I have tried to notice anything running that would be interfering... A/C? Water Heater? Refrig? All to no avail... I can turn them all on or all off and get different results every few minutes.

[Brian H]

I would also say it sounds like a phase coupling problem or noise and signal suckers.

 

Although this is based on X10 troubleshooting. Many of the tips can also be applied to Insteon problems also. As the Insteon 131.65 KHz power line signal is not that far from the X10 120 KHz one.

 

http://jvde.us/x10_troubleshooting.htm

 

The noise and signal sucker stuff is very helpful. I was not surprised by the noise found from some CFL bulbs and a Cell Phone Charger.

I have seen reports of things like Microprocessor controlled washers, dryers and refrigerators being problem also. Not as much with Insteon as the modules do pass messages along and X10 does not.

[B0SST0N]

I setup the first two access points according to the instructions to make sure they are on different phases as close to the breaker as possible... right now I am thinking of installing a hardwired phase coupler and as many filterlincs as possible... hopefully that will improve the situation. It is a little disheartening to have to spend that kind of money/time in addition to the costs already incurred. Starting to wonder if I should have waited until the ISY for Zwave is released... but I am sure that comes with its own problems as well...

[SteveL]

Bosston,

 

One thing to note is the difference between a fast on and an On command. Fast on will over ride a slow ramp rate of 0% on level. Make sure the On level for your device is set above 0% and the ramp rate is not 9 min.

 

SteveL

Smarthome

 

Please contact me directly if you want to discuss your INSTEON network.

[B0SST0N]

I spoke with Scott tonight at SH for over an hour, very knowledgeable and helpful. We were looking at my 4 Access Points, 2 are Rev1.0R and 2 are Rev1.6. He had me unplug the 2 1.0R access points and just use the 1.6 points. So far everything is communicating MUCH better than last night... we will see if the good luck holds up. I have had a few hiccups but they may be due to some of the links being broken that the ISY had programmed during the times of bad communication. I am restoring my PLM and Devices tonight to see if that will clear up any remaining problems. **crossing my fingers**

[Rob]

I spoke with Scott tonight at SH for over an hour, very knowledgeable and helpful. We were looking at my 4 Access Points, 2 are Rev1.0R and 2 are Rev1.6. He had me unplug the 2 1.0R access points and just use the 1.6 points. So far everything is communicating MUCH better than last night...

 

Your post prompted me to look into a problem I was having. I have 3 AP's- one on a PLM and another one are on 2 different legs, both are same rev. (I forget which). The 3rd AP was purchased later (different rev.) and had in my MBR. One particular light in the MBR (plugged into a lamplinc) would often not respond to the PLM but worked fine when controlled by a keypadlinc in the same room. I even went so far as to piggyback the AP directly on the lamplinc but still had problems. I tried all the usual troubleshooting but never had much luck.

 

Anyway, after reading your post I removed the AP from the MBR and put it on another circuit. Boom, the troublesome light is now 95% improved. I guess more AP's aren't always better, at least if they are different revisions.

 

thanks

rob

[SteveL]

I had a problem in my house with three access points installed two of them on different phases and I had a area in the house that I was having a hard time communicating with. I moved one of the access points and my communication problem went away. I found that I had a loose connection behind one of my outlets on the neutral.

 

Steve L

Smarthome

[Rob]

Thanks Steve for that info! As a matter of fact I had a switch (non-insteon) in that same room that wasn't working. I pulled it out and noticed the line connection was loose. I didn't even think to check the neutral. I wouldn't be suprised if that was the problem.