Insteon and Distance Problem?

[DirtRoad]

As a complete newbie, I need direction from the experienced members please…

I have switched out all the old X-10 switches and modules to Insteon models or directly replaced those switches I don’t need automated at this time with single pole on off switches.  I am down to two remaining X-10 devices.

The problem I have, I believe, is one of distance:  Device #1 is an on/off switch located about 200 feet from the house in a shed that protects my well and pump.  This switch controls two lights at my road entrance another 200 feet further out.  The electric lines run from this shed out to the entrance and feed the lights and gate opener.  Using the old X-10 system, both lights and gates worked just fine.  I tried replacing #1with an Insteon on/off switch but the ISY 994i says it cannot determine the engine (or something like that).  I also tried manually putting in the address but receive a similar message.  When I tried to simply add the X-10 switch in as is, the ISY adds it to the device list but nothing happens when I run the program.  Given all this, I am assuming the distance is too great?

Device #2 is an X-10 relay set to deliver a single pulse to the gate opener which signals the gate to open / close.  Since I couldn’t get the lights to work, I haven’t yet attempted replacing it with an Insteon relay…

Other than these two remaining items, the system is working very nicely.  So, any suggestions on how to handle this problem would be greatly appreciated. 

[Techman]

Insteon is based on a mesh network. The more dual band devices you have the more reliable your system becomes as each device relays the signal.

"cannot determine the engine" means that your PLM is unable to communicate with the Insteon device.

Adding dual band plug in modules will improve the range of your devices. You also need to make sure that both sides of your 120 powerline are coupled via dual band devices.

Take a look at these troubleshooting links:

https://wiki.universal-devices.com/index.php?title=INSTEON:_Troubleshooting_Communications_Errors

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NMx5yHTU2g4

https://wiki.universal-devices.com/index.php?title=INSTEON_Signal_/_Noise_Troubleshooting

If you have any X10 repeaters installed you should remove them as they can interfere with the Insteon signal.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[lilyoyo1]

Also try factory resetting the device. Something may have corrupted the device

[DirtRoad]

Thanks, I didn't know about the repeaters...  I have some hardwired that I will need to remove...  I'll check out the trouble shooting guides first thing tomorrow!!

[DirtRoad]

Sorry, forgot to ask what you mean by dual band devices?  Examples I might buy?

[kclenden]

16 minutes ago, Techman said:

Insteon is based on a mesh network.

As Techman says, Insteon is a mesh network.  Any wired Insteon device you add will repeat commands.  If there are outlets or switches in between the breaker and Device #1 located in the shed, replacing them with an Insteon equivalent will definitely make the signal going to Device #1 stronger.  In the case of outlets, you could use a plug-in module instead of replacing the in-wall outlet.

Another thing to check is the location of your PLM.  It should be as close to your breaker box as possible.  This reduces the distance a signal from/to it has to travel.  It also reduces the chance that signal suckers on any branch will weaken the signal going to another branch.  In my case, I have my PLM plugged into an outlet located right next to my electrical box and so there's less than 5' of wire between it and any electrical branch.

Speaking of signal suckers, are there outlets in your shed that are on the same branch as Device #1?  If so, check whether they have known signal suckers plugged into them (UPS, power supplies, electronic devices, etc).  If so, try unplugging them and test the communication to the switch again.

[kclenden]

20 minutes ago, DirtRoad said:

Sorry, forgot to ask what you mean by dual band devices?  Examples I might buy?

Dual band devices communicate on both the powerline and via RF.  An example is the  2635-222 Insteon Remote Control Plug-in On/Off Module.  Their description will usually say something like "This product is an Insteon Dual-Band device" or "Transmits and receives Insteon commands via powerline and RF."

[Brian H]

1 hour ago, DirtRoad said:

Thanks, I didn't know about the repeaters...  I have some hardwired that I will need to remove...  I'll check out the trouble shooting guides first thing tomorrow!!

The X10 repeaters have an amplifier in them. Example Leviton HCA02, X10Pro XPCR, Smarthome BootserLinc.

Passive X10 couplers like the X10Pro XPCR just couple the X10 power line signals between the two incoming power lines. They should be fine and since the Insteon power line signals are fairly close to the X10 power line signals. They should couple Insteon fine.

[Techman]

Kclenden,

Plug in modules such as the on/off module or the lamplinc dimmer work well as range extenders as their antennas are external. Try placing one in the shed, in an outlet as high as possible and as close to the house as possible. Do the same with a module in the house. The two modules will (hopefully) speak to one another via powerline and RF signals.

In the wall modules have their antennas located at the rear of the module which limits their effective RF range, especially if they're installed in a metal box.