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Insteon HUB (2245) cloud servers shut down

MrBill

By MrBill
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johnmsch Experienced

johnmsch

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Posted
2 hours ago, MrBill said:

If you want to pay instead of DIY, there's a guy on ebay... just type "PLM repair" in the ebay search box.

I checked that out earlier and thought it said he just fixes the power supply.  I'll go back and look again.  Still have a few burnt out toggle switches I could practice the soldering on.

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MrBill Advanced

MrBill

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3 hours ago, johnmsch said:

I checked that out earlier and thought it said he just fixes the power supply.  I'll go back and look again.  Still have a few burnt out toggle switches I could practice the soldering on.

There are 2 ads... one for no power and one for communication issues:

image.png.ec8b5c3fe6ee0a328c53f72b6ee64f80.png

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dotScott New

dotScott

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On 4/19/2022 at 2:03 PM, MrBill said:

22 bids brought it up to that price....  It's not a Buy it Now item.

Strange, it had zero bids at $1100 BiN purchase price.  Now at auction $305 with 2 bids.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/165436803245?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=IZDUHAv_Rmm&sssrc=2349624&ssuid=MorWqO_-Thm&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

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chris932 Member

chris932

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3 hours ago, PB11 said:

@Athlon you seem to be very familiar with HA, is there any benefit to running it in parrallel to my polisy? The interface looks slick and easy.

Thanks

I'm using HA through the ISY (which I assume is essentially the same as ISY on Polisy) and it allows you to integrate all sorts of devices.

I never really liked Polisy and it always breaks when I try to update to the latest version. Polisy V2 of course since it's the latest version that allows running on a virtual machine. I am not aware of any ZIgbee support even on V3.

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Mustang65 Advanced

Mustang65

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Posted

Even the  "Wired" magazine picked up on the Insteon debacle.

https://www.wired.com/story/insteon-shutdown/?bxid=5e9da520f543e6336310d1de&cndid=60773587&esrc=profile-page&mbid=mbid%3DCRMWIR012019 &source=EDT_WIR_NEWSLETTER_0_DAILY_ZZ&utm_brand=wired&utm_campaign=aud-dev&utm_content=WIR_Daily_042122&utm_mailing=WIR_Daily_042122&utm_medium=email&utm_source=nl&utm_term=P6

 

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stillwater Advanced

stillwater

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11 minutes ago, chris932 said:

I'm using HA through the ISY (which I assume is essentially the same as ISY on Polisy) and it allows you to integrate all sorts of devices.

I never really liked Polisy and it always breaks when I try to update to the latest version. Polisy V2 of course since it's the latest version that allows running on a virtual machine. I am not aware of any ZIgbee support even on V3.

I believe you mean Polyglot (which is a software facility for node servers commonly run on a Raspberry PI or on a Polisy (which is a piece of hardware sold by UDI that can run node servers in conjunction with an ISY or now can also run ISY software obviating the need for a hardware ISY). There is a Polyglot V2 but not a Polisy V2.    I suspect you don't have a Polisy.   PGC ran on virtual machines in the cloud until it was shut down for security reasons.  

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Athlon Advanced

Athlon

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10 hours ago, PB11 said:

@Athlon you seem to be very familiar with HA, is there any benefit to running it in parrallel to my polisy? The interface looks slick and easy.

Thanks

Actually, I'm not overly familiar with HA. I only know what it can do from reading about it, however I've never actually deployed it.

You reacted to my post here: https://forum.universal-devices.com/topic/35746-insteon-hub-2245-cloud-servers-shut-down/?do=findComment&comment=334365

In that post I said I'm not running HA - I only talked about the benefits of using HA on an RPi for those who have not factory reset their Hubs. I don't know why you would need to run HA if you have a Polisy - there are 75 Node servers and counting.

I suppose you would need HA as a bridge if you have a device to control that doesn't have a Node server in PG3, but other than that I see no benefit if you have a Polisy.

 

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MrBill Advanced

MrBill

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12 hours ago, PB11 said:

@Athlon you seem to be very familiar with HA, is there any benefit to running it in parrallel to my polisy? The interface looks slick and easy.

Thanks

I use HA and ISY... very beneficial to me.  The Universal Devices Integration is outstanding.  When I started out HA was my front end (or mobile app) for the ISY... Since then I've gone places I can't go with ISY...like zigbee.

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Wayne664 Newbie

Wayne664

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On 4/20/2022 at 8:35 PM, g800 said:

I just finished setting up my raspberry pi with home assistant. Almost all of my insteon hub devices were automatically linked and I'm able to again control all my lights from my app

If anyone needs to talk through exactly how to do that, message me and I'm happy to walk you through it. I was in desperate need of a dumbed down, step-by-step walk through but couldn't find one ... and now that I suffered through it myself I'm happy to help ?

I will say however that Home Assistant is incredibly slow in executing scenes. Insteon Hub was night and day different. It also doesn't recognize all my devices all of the time. Unfortunate.

I'm new to all this, but learning. The Raspberry pi is a small stand alone computer used as a server? Or is it a board you add to your existing PC? What makes it different from the UD Polisy? You still have to upload a software package (eg home assistant), link to your insteon network somehow (PLM?) and program, correct? Does the Polisy come with software already loaded, or is it a completely stand alone firmware package? Is Polisy going to be as slow as Pi/HA seems to be for you?

On a separate note, I disconnected my Insteon (dead) hub from my network, but see that previously programmed on/off schedules are still working! Is this on/off programming imbedded in the individual dimmer firmware??

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AD8BC Advanced

AD8BC

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On 4/17/2022 at 8:53 AM, upstatemike said:

I am starting to wonder if Richmond Capital Partners really intended to shut down the servers supporting the Insteon Hubs or if as financial folks they just didn't understand how the the technology works? I could envision a scenario where they shut things down and screw all the remaining employees one of whom in retaliation makes a point of shutting down the servers on their way out the door just to make Richmond Capital look bad and damage their potential for selling the Smarthome name or technology. There is probably more to this story than we know.

I would imagine that they may have just shut the doors and the forum and hosting just expired after a while due to non payment.  Maybe.

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Athlon Advanced

Athlon

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17 hours ago, Wayne664 said:

I'm new to all this, but learning. The Raspberry pi is a small stand alone computer used as a server? Or is it a board you add to your existing PC? What makes it different from the UD Polisy? You still have to upload a software package (eg home assistant), link to your insteon network somehow (PLM?) and program, correct? Does the Polisy come with software already loaded, or is it a completely stand alone firmware package? Is Polisy going to be as slow as Pi/HA seems to be for you?

On a separate note, I disconnected my Insteon (dead) hub from my network, but see that previously programmed on/off schedules are still working! Is this on/off programming imbedded in the individual dimmer firmware??

I'll answer to the best of my knowledge...

[[The Raspberry pi is a small stand alone computer used as a server?]]

Yes. It can be used as a server and also used for many other things - your knowledge and imagination is all that is required. There is plenty of help online. I have two, one runs as a Plex server and the other runs Homebridge.

https://www.raspberrypi.com/

***

[[You still have to upload a software package (eg home assistant)]]

Yes, and HA is free and open source.

https://www.home-assistant.io/

***

[[link to your insteon network somehow (PLM?)]]

There may be some confusion here. This discusion centers around using an RPi to 'save' an Insteon Hub - one that has not been factory reset. HA on the RPi will 'read' and/or control the Hub (the reason you do not want to 'wipe' your Hub). The Hub has a built in PLM, so no PLM is necessary to do this. I do not believe it is possible to connect a PLM to an RPi to control Insteon devices.

***

Does the Polisy come with software already loaded, or is it a completely stand alone firmware package?

Yes. It will run the ISY software (like the Hub only much, much better) as well as run PG2 (depreciated) and the newer PG3 to provide Node Server service for you. There are currently 75 Node servers and that number is growing all the time. The Node Servers allow you to run and control different systems, not just Insteon - almost making the Polisy a universal controller. See the current list here:

https://forum.universal-devices.com/forum/221-polyglot-v3-node-servers-pg3/

***

[[Is Polisy going to be as slow as Pi/HA]]

No. (I'm running as Policy Pro, by the way.)

***

[[I disconnected my Insteon (dead) hub from my network, but see that previously programmed on/off schedules are still working! Is this on/off programming imbedded in the individual dimmer firmware?]]

Pretty much, yes. One of the great things about most Insteon devices.

***

EDIT - Just checked - now there are 78 Node Servers!

Edited by Athlon
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MrBill Advanced

MrBill

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11 hours ago, AD8BC said:

I would imagine that they may have just shut the doors and the forum and hosting just expired after a while due to non payment.  Maybe.

Except some services are still up.  top levels of smarthome.com and insteon.com to name two.

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arf1410 Member

arf1410

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Have a mix of X-10 and Insteon switches... and likely a spare insteon switch or two.  I had used an Insteon Hub, but replaced it with an ISY.  Not really clear what the (now shut down) Insteon servers do? Why should I care?  And is the only risk, to someone like me, is my PLM device - which typically has a short life span - can't be replaced?

Note - I've got some unrelated home automation stuff, related to a wired home alarm system, and a repurposed Kindle Fire tablet used as a control panel... and as I was configuring it, based on internet instructions, this system requires 3 tiny companies, that few have heard of, to remain in business, for it to continue to be functional.  In the likely event one goes belly up in the next few years, I'll have to start again with this project.  Point being, any sort of home automation project that relies on just about any else's server, just seems like a bad idea.  While I certainly dont expect Apple, or Amazon to go out of business, they could indeed shut down some product / service / division.

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Techman Advanced

Techman

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11 minutes ago, arf1410 said:

Have a mix of X-10 and Insteon switches... and likely a spare insteon switch or two.  I had used an Insteon Hub, but replaced it with an ISY.  Not really clear what the (now shut down) Insteon servers do? Why should I care?  And is the only risk, to someone like me, is my PLM device - which typically has a short life span - can't be replaced?

 

The Insteon servers allowed one to access and program the Insteon Hub. For those who have a working hub, it will continue to work they just won't be able to access it via the app, make any changes to the programs, and be unable to add or delete devices from the hub.

It's possible that later this year the "Insteon server" could be resurrected by a new owner as Smarthome's assets will most likely be being sold off.

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arf1410 Member

arf1410

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Havent used my Insteon Hub in ~ 2 years... but I vaguely remember there were 2 ways to access it.  One, via a web portal, that I guess went via insteon servers...but wasnt there a second way that was directly from my network, to the Hub?

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andrew77 Advanced

andrew77

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Not wanting to sound like a noob but I've only ever had the ISY 994i and a subscription to the ISY Portal.

Aside from not being able to buy Insteon devices anymore does the shutting down of the servers affect 

us who didn't have an Insteon Hub?

I'm also wondering what devices are the best to buy now that I'll not be buying Insteon.

(if this should be its own topic please let me know)

Drew

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Techman Advanced

Techman

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The Smarthome/Insteon server only hosted the Insteon Hub. The server shutdown will have no effect on your system(s).

For now, your best bet is to go with Zwave 700 series devices. If you don't plan on upgrading to the Polisy then adding the 500 series Zwave board to you ISY would be the next best step if you want to add more devices to your current setup.

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