saclarkdoc Posted July 18, 2023 Author Share Posted July 18, 2023 Getty - a couple of questions to ensure I start off fresh programming from scratch on my new eisy and 2413 USB PLM: (1) From the IoX Finder, I have selected Admin Console (LAN) instead of Admin Console (Cloud). Is that the best choice? (2) Although I never was able to 'Migrate my 994i data, when the Admin Console (LAN) launches, I am able to see all my switches and timing data (even though I'm not sure what "Response type 10" means). Can I use this as a starting point to build my sensor timing data? (SEE ATTACHED ADMIN CONSOLE) (3) Why does the Admin Console>About screen still show my Internet DISABLED? (SEE ATTACHED ABOUT) Link to comment
Geddy Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 1 hour ago, saclarkdoc said: Getty Thanks, but it's GEDDY (as in Geddy Lee - from Rush - best band ever!) Further, to mention somebody on the forums start with @ then typing their name a list should appear under and select the name it should put a bubble around their name. It then sends a notification on the forums. Otherwise, posts might go unread by the person you're trying to address. Like this: Once selected would then look like this: @saclarkdoc (Since I've quoted you in this reply you'll probably get a notice that you were quoted, but if I hadn't it would say you were mentioned. Like this: ) Now...to your questions (oh, and you can split quotes out by selecting text and a popup shows up for "quote selection" Before I do though...I would like to make sure you review the UDI wiki. You can read and search there for any other questions you might have: https://wiki.universal-devices.com/index.php?title=Main_Page 1 hour ago, saclarkdoc said: (1) From the IoX Finder, I have selected Admin Console (LAN) instead of Admin Console (Cloud). Is that the best choice? If you are local to your device these are mostly interchangeable at this point. "Local" should grab the admin.jnlp directly from the eisy. Whereas the "Cloud" will grab the file from UDI's site to match your firmware. IoX Launcher was developed in the 5.x time of beta testing so that people wouldn't have to clear cache all the time and would automatically pick the correct UI for the Firmware. Since we all know "UI and FW must match!" (FW = firmware) 🤓 Although, I will comment that anytime you update the firmware it's still good practice to clear java cache. During eisy updates I have often had the "Local" version complain that it doesn't match FW after an update so it's just standard operating practice (SOP) to clear java cache (checking all 3 boxes in the process) and running a new "start.jnlp" to make things happy. 1 hour ago, saclarkdoc said: (2) Although I never was able to 'Migrate my 994i data, when the Admin Console (LAN) launches, I am able to see all my switches and timing data (even though I'm not sure what "Response type 10" means). Can I use this as a starting point to build my sensor timing data? (SEE ATTACHED ADMIN CONSOLE) "Response type 10" is due to a missing switch/module/node. Because the ISY process doesn't now how to reach whatever it was before it fills the line with this. If you have a printed version of your programs from the old ISY994 maybe it has the device that it should be. You should be able to click on the line and see if it has devices as an option to update to. (Old thread that mentioned this issue: https://forum.universal-devices.com/topic/39625-programs-have-response-type-10-on-them/) It might be a "starting" point to rebuild your "sensor timing data" - not 100% sure what you mean by that...if you mean "programs" yes. You seem to like using the word "sensor" a lot. Please clarify what DEVICE you mean rather than "sensor". (I feel like I'm channeling @Goose66 a little bit here remembering this post he made a while back.) Finally, best way to share a program on the forums is by selecting the program, right click, last option in the menu will be "copy to clipboard" then paste into the forum reply. If you wanted to you can use the code brackets in the formatting bar to insert as plain text, but that's not really necessary. Screenshots aren't helpful because usually people will want to help edit/alter the program and the text version is easy to be copied and edited by those helping you. (Please review @MrBill's signature seen on page 1 of this thread) Like this: ~Flood-Motion If '~NodeServers / ~Ring / ~932 Driveway (Motion)' is switched Motion And From Sunset + 1 hour To 6:30:00PM (same day) Then Set 'Desk Lamp' On 100% Set '~NodeServers / ~Hue / Couch' On Wait 2 minutes Set 'Desk Lamp' Off Set '~NodeServers / ~Hue / Couch' Off Else - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action') 1 hour ago, saclarkdoc said: (3) Why does the Admin Console>About screen still show my Internet DISABLED? Don't worry about that. It's not important and just fine to be disabled (that's the default status). I believe that's from an old ISY## time that would setup port forwarding options, but most don't worry about it and it being disabled is default and fine to be left alone. There used to be a menu option in the file menu to enable/disable internet access. That's gone, but apparently the Help -> About still shows the setting. https://wiki.universal-devices.com/index.php?title=ISY-99i/ISY-26_INSTEON:File_Menu#Enable/Disable_Internet_Access (see...for the ISY26/ISY99 era of products) Before you go much further, since you have a NEW PLM and you might have devices in your system from the restored backup you made you could run into issues. I'm not sure the real best way to proceed if you're leaving the restored backup data in the eisy to build from here. I would have factory reset the eisy (10 button presses - mentioned in the wiki!) or opened a ticket with UDI Support to get help completely clearing out the ISY information you restored from the backup. It could create link issues if you try using "exiting" devices that came from an unknown backup version. I don't know if you could attempt a PLM Restore with the devices in the ISY system currently then go through a Restore Device for each device. When I suggested clean slate I meant "100% pure clean slate". Don't use any info from the backup you tried to restore because it could have errors you don't know about in there. Good luck! Link to comment
saclarkdoc Posted July 19, 2023 Author Share Posted July 19, 2023 @Geddy - Many thanks for the added eisy 'smarts' you shared with me in your lengthy response!!! You have given me a lot to digest. I will clean out the remnants of the old 994i and start anew (and by the way, sorry I keep using the word sensor instead of switches or programs - an old habit from my time at NASA that I need to break) UPDATE: I cleaned out Java, then I did the Factory Reset of my eisy (clicked button with paper clip 10 times). 30 minutes later IoX Finder could NOT find eisy, so I did a reboot (clicked 5 times). 10 minutes later still 'No Joy' (sorry, mil pilot expression), so I disconnected and reconnected power. Now Finder could 'see' my eisy, so I launched Admin Console. It came up but unfortunately all my old device programs were still there!! HELP!! Also , how do I close out this lengthy and obsolete thread (if necessary I will start a new one) Link to comment
MrBill Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 1 hour ago, saclarkdoc said: Also , how do I close out this lengthy and obsolete thread (if necessary I will start a new one) that's not how it works... just stay in the same thread. then we don't have to ask the same questions already answered. 1 Link to comment
saclarkdoc Posted July 19, 2023 Author Share Posted July 19, 2023 @Geddy - MORE RECENT UPDATE: I deleted all programs except the Parent, then hit "Save Changes." That did the trick. However, when I tried to add my first sub-program (Upstairs Hall Shelf), I received an error message , "Cannot Determine Insteon Engine." How do I correct this? Link to comment
Geddy Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 3 hours ago, saclarkdoc said: It came up but unfortunately all my old device programs were still there!! HELP!! Unsure if there's a "simple" way to wipe out IoX so I'd suggest opening a support ticket and see if that's even best course of action. There might be other "tricks" they can suggest given the current state of your system. 3 hours ago, saclarkdoc said: (clicked button with paper clip 10 times) Since the front power button is the multi function button used to reset the function it's best just to use a finger to press it. Paper clip isn't needed. I'm not sure if there's another button to push that would need a paper clip to access (It's been a while since I examined the eisy case). 45 minutes ago, saclarkdoc said: However, when I tried to add my first sub-program (Upstairs Hall Shelf), I received an error message , "Cannot Determine Insteon Engine." How do I correct this? I think this will be part of what support needs to help with. If you've got the new PLM connected to the eisy and Insteon support box checked (on configuration tab) and you've linked the devices again then you shouldn't have issues. Also make sure that your Firmware and UI match (Help -> About). More than likely your devices aren't linked properly. I think you made a comment earlier that devices were added from the restore attempt, but you weren't able to control them. That's because the eisy and PLM are probably unable to communicate because of broken link tables from a (probable) failed migration attempt. Link to comment
saclarkdoc Posted July 20, 2023 Author Share Posted July 20, 2023 @Geddy Well, I'm on a good roll (PARTLY). Somehow I got rid of all my old programming. I thought I did a Factory Reset, but now I see I did something else. I used a paper clip to push the button inside a hole on the back 10 times instead of pushing the button on the front (so I really did not do a factory reset). Having said that I have entered 6 programs without any problem, and I have verified they work just fine. However, an additional 6 programs gave me the "Cannot Determine Insteon Engine" error message, so I am inclined to do a real Factory Reset using the front button, and then re-boot and start over. Your thoughts? Also when I have a duplex wall socket, and I only want to activate one of the sockets, do I identify the top socket using the format: xx.xx.xx.1? Link to comment
saclarkdoc Posted July 20, 2023 Author Share Posted July 20, 2023 I am starting to program my new eisy manually, but some of my switches/Outlets will not program. Does anyone know how to overcome the following two error messages when trying to add a new switch/outlet? "Cannot Determine Insteon Engine" "Cannot Determine Device Link Table Address" Finally, what is the format if you only want to switch on a single outlet in a duplex socket? Link to comment
stevehoyt Posted July 20, 2023 Share Posted July 20, 2023 here's a very old video about the problem. Not sure it is still relevant but at least taking a look in the event log might give you a clue. Link to comment
saclarkdoc Posted July 20, 2023 Author Share Posted July 20, 2023 @stevehoyt Thanks for the above video (I assume if I am dealing with a ToggleLink Wall Switch, the set button will be visible if I remove the wall plate). Also, any suggestions on how to overcome my second error message when trying to add a new switch/outlet ("Cannot Determine Device Link Table Address") Link to comment
Techman Posted July 20, 2023 Share Posted July 20, 2023 The older Togglelinc is a single band device. If you're having problems communicating with it then you either have noise on your powerline which is interfering with the Insteon signal, or the switch is on the opposite leg of your powerline. In either case a dual band device installed close to the Togglelinc should rectify the problem. "Can't determine Insteon Engine" and "Cannot determine Device Link Table Address" means that the PLM is not communicating with the device. If you're manually entering the device address when attempting to link the device, then either the address you entered is incorrect or you have the issue explained above. Link to comment
saclarkdoc Posted July 20, 2023 Author Share Posted July 20, 2023 @Techman Appreciate the clarification. I have one more question. I will shortly be installing two doors with Z-wave locks. What is the proper Z-Wave add-on for my eisy? Link to comment
Techman Posted July 20, 2023 Share Posted July 20, 2023 Regarding Zwave - You may need a zwave repeater between your EISY and your door locks unless you have other Zwave line powered devices in your zwave network. Z-Wave: Configuring Range Extenders and Door Locks - Universal Devices, Inc. Wiki (universal-devices.com) I've also attached a PDF file on Zwave installations. Here's the Insteon troubleshooting instructions: INSTEON: Troubleshooting Communications Errors - Universal Devices, Inc. Wiki (universal-devices.com) zw.pdf Link to comment
saclarkdoc Posted July 21, 2023 Author Share Posted July 21, 2023 @Techman Many thanks for the info. I have purchased an Aeotec Range Extender 7 for my setup (I hope that will function as my repeater). What do you think? Also, I am still trying to determine the proper module to add to my eisy to enable the Z-wave function. Recommendations? Link to comment
Techman Posted July 21, 2023 Share Posted July 21, 2023 The Aeotec range extender will do the job. I have one in my system. The only Zwave module that's compatible with the eisy is this one: ZMatter USB: Z-Wave+ & Matter Module for eisy (Beta) - Universal Devices (universal-devices.com) Before you venture into zwave You should get all your Insteon devices and programs debugged. In an earlier post you mentioned putting a paperclip into a hole to reset your eisy. That's the reset method for the Polisy, the EISY uses a button on the front panel for resets. Are you sure you have an EISY? Link to comment
saclarkdoc Posted July 21, 2023 Author Share Posted July 21, 2023 @Techman Sure am. Bought it 30 days ago from UDI. There were no instructions about the rear port, but I will stay clear of it from now on. I subsequently did reset and reboot pressing the front Power Button. I am working furiously to get present system working before connecting the Z-wave. Our new doors should be delivered in about two weeks. So far I can communicate with most Insteon devices, but a few Outletlinks (2472D) and Lamplinks (2457) are giving me trouble, even though I can communicate with other same model devices. Also, although I can control most devices using the Admin Console, turning them ON & OFF: however, most of them are not responding to their individual programming routines. In addition, Amazon Echo fails to recognize commands as well, stating I should "check network connection & Power Supply." So I'm really having lots of fun here (especially since when my old 994i was still functioning, All these same modules worked perfectly together, so I'm trying to understand what new variable the eisy introduced that 'screwed up' communication). Other than that, my day is just fine, thank you!! Link to comment
Techman Posted July 21, 2023 Share Posted July 21, 2023 It sounds like you may have some older single band Insteon devices, the 2472 is single band, the 2472D2 is dual band. You may want to replace older single band devices with the newer dual band devices which will improve the reliability of the Insteon mesh system. If devices can be controlled via the admin console but not programs, then the issue is most likely within your programs. Link to comment
saclarkdoc Posted July 21, 2023 Author Share Posted July 21, 2023 @Techman Forgot to mention I have had a Bridge across L1 and L2 mounted in my Circuit Breaker panel for many years. I also have a curious addition to my IoX Network in the Admin Console. In addition to all my modules, something suddenly appeared called the "NOTIFICATION CONTROLLER." I di not install it, instead it just 'showed up.' Any idea what this is, & why it just appeared out of nowhere? Link to comment
saclarkdoc Posted July 21, 2023 Author Share Posted July 21, 2023 @Techman FYI - All my 2457's are actually 2457 D2 Link to comment
Techman Posted July 21, 2023 Share Posted July 21, 2023 1 hour ago, saclarkdoc said: @Techman Forgot to mention I have had a Bridge across L1 and L2 mounted in my Circuit Breaker panel for many years. I also have a curious addition to my IoX Network in the Admin Console. In addition to all my modules, something suddenly appeared called the "NOTIFICATION CONTROLLER." I di not install it, instead it just 'showed up.' Any idea what this is, & why it just appeared out of nowhere? Not sure what the "notification controller" is. It must be something you installed. if you expand it what are its nodes? Did you previously install any node servers? What type of bridge do you have across your power line legs? Having dual band devices on opposite legs of the power line will act as a bridge. Link to comment
MrBill Posted July 22, 2023 Share Posted July 22, 2023 14 hours ago, Techman said: Not sure what the "notification controller" is. I think the notification node server is now automatically installed. Not 100% certain of that tho. Link to comment
saclarkdoc Posted July 22, 2023 Author Share Posted July 22, 2023 @Techman I'm finally sending you photos to answer two questions of yours. (1) you asked "...you mentioned putting a paperclip into a hole to reset your eisy. That's the reset method for the Polisy, the EISY uses a button on the front panel for resets. Are you sure you have an EISY?" The photo shows the location of the hole with a push button of the rear of the eisy. Any idea what it's for? (2) You also asked "...What type of bridge do you have across your power line legs?" I have attached a copy of the Leviton Bridge installed on by circuit breaker panel; the red lights are modulated and indicate they are both functioning (the photo seems to show only one illuminated, but trust me, they are both lit all the time). Link to comment
Techman Posted July 22, 2023 Share Posted July 22, 2023 I've never noticed the (reset?) hole in the back of the eisy. It's not mentioned in any manuals. I have no idea what it does. Maybe one of the forum developers knows. The device in your circuit breaker panel appears to be a surge arrestor, not a powerline bridge. I can't read the model number, so I'm not sure what it is. It's possible that it may be attenuating the Insteon signals. Link to comment
Andy P Posted July 23, 2023 Share Posted July 23, 2023 (edited) This is the MELE Quieter3 document - it labels the hole CMOS Reset/BIOS Reset Edited July 23, 2023 by Andy P 2 Link to comment
saclarkdoc Posted July 23, 2023 Author Share Posted July 23, 2023 @Geddy @MrBill @Techman et al: As I am making progress with connecting my eisy system, I have one basic question; I have a setup that could easily be connected as either an Ethernet system ( I am currently connected to a 2413 USB PLM, but I also have a powerful Mesh wireless covering my entire house). Five of my thirty-one devices are unable to connect to my eisy, and give me one of two different error messages in the Admin Console, either (1) Cannot Determine Insteon Engine," or (2) "Cannot Determine Device Link Table Address." QUESTION #1: Should I configure my eisy as Ethernet or as Wireless? Question #2: Any recommendations on how to address the two error messages? Link to comment
Recommended Posts