akss Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 @Kentinada I know you're probably trying to avoid replacing the thermostats if you can find a way to integrate what you have. If you're looking for a thermostat with a local-only and well documented API, you might want to look at Venstar thermostats. They have a decent reputation; I don't own one; I'm not affiliated in any way. But something to consider since most have never heard of them. @Michel Kohanim Good points. Out of curiosity, have you thought of using your already sourced hardware (or arguably a cheaper variant with no HDMI ports) to just build a straight HA Yellow alternative? I realize it might represent a distraction from core business, but it also seems like a market opportunity - off-the-shelf, pre-built solution for HA, with no dependencies on RPi's. Anyway, congrats on the record sales! Link to comment
Michel Kohanim Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 @akss Thank you for the suggestion and the kind words. I definitely would especially since we are investigating a lower cost N100 chipset as well. My only issue is support. Since we do provide support for everything, I am concerned that we won't have the bandwidth to support installation/configuration issues that may arise especially since our expertise and Linux have a minimal intersection! And if we add the cost of support, then the price might not be as attractive. Once we have a better understanding of HA running on eisy, we'll be better informed as to what is/is not possible. Of course, if you wish, you can help us 😉! Thanks again. With kind regards, Michel 1 Link to comment
slimypizza Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 3 hours ago, Kentinada said: No I did not because Total Connect Comfort doesn’t support the T9’s. You have to use the Resideo Smart Home app. Ah! I didn't realize that. Thanks. Link to comment
DualBandAid Posted January 12 Author Share Posted January 12 Quote Once we have a better understanding of HA running on eisy, we'll be better informed as to what is/is not possible. Of course, if you wish, you can help us 😉! I'm happy to jump in there. I was originally thinking of running the EISY in HA. But now...this idea of HA inside EISY? Man this is a brain-bender. I'll guess I'll have to figure out the pros/cons of each. Link to comment
Michel Kohanim Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 @DualBandAid, Since you already have an eisy, and as long as you know how HA works, it's a no brainer. We'll give you a script that will install HA in a hypervisor VM in eisy. You can play with both at the same time and decide. With kind regards, Michel 3 Link to comment
DualBandAid Posted January 12 Author Share Posted January 12 Well...I don't quite know how HA works...but I'm gonna learn. Happy to demo the script Link to comment
DualBandAid Posted January 12 Author Share Posted January 12 Wait, question. I think I misunderstood. I thought were talking about either running ISY as a plug in inside an HA system (like the green). VS Running an HA node inside of the EISY gui (if that makes sense). But with the VM, are you talking about using the EISY hardware itself to run the HA system (gui and all ) independently as its own system? Link to comment
Michel Kohanim Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 @DualBandAid, You cannot run HA node inside eisy. I know you can connect to eisy from HA. 5 minutes ago, DualBandAid said: But with the VM, are you talking about using the EISY hardware itself to run the HA system (gui and all ) independently as its own system? YES. With kind regards, Michel Link to comment
DualBandAid Posted January 12 Author Share Posted January 12 Quote using the EISY hardware itself to run the HA system (gui and all ) independently as its own system? I'm def interested in that. I will toy around with the HA system on my green just to get familiar with it. But question, if I have a PLM and my old EISY/Java thing set-up...and all those links to my Insteon devices, will this new HA system: 1) Utilize the existing plugged-in PLM 2) Have to set up its own links 3) Will that screw things up? I also might possibly be asking an ignorant question here, or using the wrong terms. Link to comment
akss Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 (edited) @DualBandAid, it's helpful to think of it as two discrete machines, just run virtually as isolated instances on one physical piece of hardware. So from a logical design perspective, it would be the same as running HA on your green, and EISY on the EISY, but now they're just separate VMs on the same piece of hardware. Like an apartment building instead of two houses. Almost certainly, UD's scripts would be passing the USB ports through to the EISY virtual machine and not giving HA direct access to hardware. In that way, the EISY VM would be the controller for any hardware accessories connected to the box (like radio dongles), and then via a network connection HA would use the EISY integration to see all the devices that EISY can see. The HA would, however, see and establish direct connections to other elements exposed just on your IP network (Wifi, etc). One of those elements exposed on your IP network will be the EISY VM itself, so you'd use the ISY integration in HA to communicate with it, NOT the direct Insteon integration - because your HA VM is not seeing the USB port the PLM is connected to. Zigbee and ZWave would work the same - EISY sees them, and HA sees the EISY over the IP network. Again, just think of them as logically being two separate machines, but physically the hypervisor, a low-level manager of hardware abstraction, lets you run both of these machines on one piece of hardware. Is that about right @Michel Kohanim? Edited January 12 by akss 1 Link to comment
jc986 Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 HAOS in a VM on the EISY is a very interesting idea. That would enable the fully managed version of HA+Linux with the add-ons in an internally managed docker instance - relatively low complexity from a user perspective. With the HA emphasis on a local / non-cloud Voice Assistant capability that might need to be accounted for. Link to comment
RPerrault Posted January 13 Share Posted January 13 vm - hypervisor - whatever you want to call it i think that is what he is suggesting vm is not necessarily low level - it IS the operating system - allowing you to run other operating systems under it (vm) as if they were just another program - but vm remains in charge of all the resources of the computer - allocating those resources as they are requested by the guest operating systems otherwise, deadly embraces are possible as well as reservations that cannot be preempted that way, resources can be shared - so a plm could indeed be seen by a guest operating system as a dedicated resource - when in fact all resources are owned by vm and allocated between guests as requested vm's performance was so much better after the introduction of the 'test and set' cpu instruction, though it was the longest running instruction at the time but yes, you can view guest systems as completely different computers ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- vm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ unix as guest 1 | unix as guest 2 eisy | ha | ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Link to comment
akss Posted January 13 Share Posted January 13 (edited) Slight correction to your diagram - VMs are the individual instances that run upon a hypervisor. Not sure what EISY is using, but yeah the HV can be packaged as THE operating system (a Type 1 hypervisor) like ESX or ProxMox, or function as a more loosely-coupled application over an existing OS installation (a Type 2 hypervisor), like DosBox or VirtualBox. Edited January 13 by akss Link to comment
DualBandAid Posted January 13 Author Share Posted January 13 This is probably a good time to mention that I'm just a writer. Haha. Link to comment
akss Posted January 13 Share Posted January 13 (edited) 4 minutes ago, DualBandAid said: This is probably a good time to mention that I'm just a writer. Haha. I hereby nominate you to write the "HA guide for Dummies" book that the world needs desperately! Lord knows I can't write a thing unless it's verbose, pedantic, and full of jargon. We can include a chapter on running HA on EISY hardware! Sold! 😉 Edited January 13 by akss Link to comment
RPerrault Posted January 13 Share Posted January 13 ibm called that lpar - logical partition - but also had a vm that was for internal use only (originally) - until customers demanded access to profs (professional office system) the problem with a 'for dummies' book is the different levels of understanding people have - if i had to write one, it would only have a target audience of beginners only - someone that knows a little about insteon or z-wave have difficulty putting aside the concepts they already know (or think they know) - and a hundred other problems long ago i wrote a manual for the computer operators - thinking i'd get fewer calls - the final edit was to add 'and depress the enter key' - i gave up writing after that Link to comment
tazman Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 On 1/12/2024 at 2:59 PM, Michel Kohanim said: @DualBandAid, Since you already have an eisy, and as long as you know how HA works, it's a no brainer. We'll give you a script that will install HA in a hypervisor VM in eisy. You can play with both at the same time and decide. With kind regards, Michel I have installed and run HA on a RPI but I am not the most technical person but did manage with the documentation out there for HA. I would be willing to buy a NVMe M.2 SSD and put it in my eisy to test if you are looking for people to try it. 1 Link to comment
Michel Kohanim Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 On 1/12/2024 at 3:46 PM, akss said: Is that about right @Michel Kohanim? 100%! On 1/12/2024 at 6:30 PM, akss said: Not sure what EISY is using, but yeah the HV can be packaged as THE operating system (a Type 1 hypervisor) like ESX or ProxMox, or function as a more loosely-coupled application over an existing OS installation (a Type 2 hypervisor), like DosBox or VirtualBox. bhyve which uses Intel VTx. @xKing has already created the script and tested it! We'll make it available shortly. With kind regards, Michel 2 Link to comment
xlurkr Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 On 1/12/2024 at 10:59 AM, Michel Kohanim said: By next week, we'll have a script that allows you to run HA in bhyve + hypervisor in eisy (on the NVMe SSD). This could be the thing that gets me to upgrade to eisy from my Polisy. -Tom Link to comment
asbril Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 On 1/12/2024 at 4:59 PM, Michel Kohanim said: @DualBandAid, Since you already have an eisy, and as long as you know how HA works, it's a no brainer. We'll give you a script that will install HA in a hypervisor VM in eisy. You can play with both at the same time and decide. With kind regards, Michel That is huge ! Link to comment
Kentinada Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 Do you add the NVMe SSD to your EISY via an external enclosure? Link to comment
tazman Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 3 hours ago, Kentinada said: Do you add the NVMe SSD to your EISY via an external enclosure? https://developer.isy.io/blog/NVMe Shows installing it inside and setting it up in the operating system. @Michel Kohanim can I setup the SSD drive with 1 partition and the VM will handle the size of the file system needed for the VM? 1 Link to comment
Michel Kohanim Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 @tazman, Yes but it's really up to you. Here's the initial script: https://docs.isy.io/blog/Home Assistant ... please do not do anything yet as we are still testing the script to make sure it's working in all cases. With kind regards, Michel 1 2 Link to comment
tazman Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 2 hours ago, Michel Kohanim said: @tazman, Yes but it's really up to you. Here's the initial script: https://docs.isy.io/blog/Home Assistant ... please do not do anything yet as we are still testing the script to make sure it's working in all cases. With kind regards, Michel I have the SSD setup and ready to go once you give the GO to try the install! Link to comment
Michel Kohanim Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 @tazman, Go for it! Please note that it might take up to 10 minutes for HA's initial boot (expand disk, prepare directories, etc.). Please be patient. Once boot up, it should be pretty responsive. Good luck! With kind regards, Michel 1 Link to comment
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