alixer Posted March 14 Author Posted March 14 11 hours ago, Geddy said: If you operate any other devices in the program (or in the same area) do you see the changes in event viewer? None of my switches cause an event to show up in the Event Viewer when physically pressed. They all show events when operated from the Admin Console or from programs. It does seem like an interference issue. I know the PLM manual said not to put the PLM on a power strip but I'm wondering in practice how do people work around this restriction? Can the PLM be on an extension cord? Is there any type of power strip that will support the PLM? The ISY requires 2 electrical outlets (with PLM) and it has to sit near my network switch to connect there. My old PLM was operating just fine in a power strip for 8-10 years. When I got this new one I plugged it into the same spot just assuming it would work exactly the same but now I'm thinking this is the issue.
oskrypuch Posted March 14 Posted March 14 (edited) The problem with powerstrips is only if they have "surge suppressors" in them. These are just capacitors that force voltage spikes to ground. As the power line signals from Insteon are just that, mini-spikes, that can reduce performance. It won't affect the RF side of course. The irony is that the surge suppressor capacitors eventually give up the ghost, and then the setup make actually magnify the effect of power line surges. In my view, unless properly hardy and heavy duty (like commercial boxes), these are not a good idea. So, just look for the very cheapest power strips, or get the ones made more for the home workshop environment, both usually don't have this circuitry. Or if you are handy, make your own. * Orest Edited March 14 by oskrypuch 1
alixer Posted March 14 Author Posted March 14 53 minutes ago, oskrypuch said: The problem with powerstrips is only if they have "surge suppressors" in them. These are just capacitors that force voltage spikes to ground. As the power line signals from Insteon are just that, mini-spikes, that can reduce performance. It won't affect the RF side of course. OK that wasn't it. I moved the PLM off of the power strip and still I see no communication to the PLM in the admin console when any device is physically pressed? Is this a red herring or a real issue? Attached is what I'm looking at in the event viewer and also one of the switches I am testing with showing the switch type and version
Geddy Posted March 14 Posted March 14 2 hours ago, alixer said: hey all show events when operated from the Admin Console or from programs. What kind of results do you get when controlling a device from admin console? Post the event viewer of that interaction. It will help make sure the hops and ACK is received. 2 hours ago, alixer said: I know the PLM manual said not to put the PLM on a power strip but I'm wondering in practice how do people work around this restriction? I ended up having a 4 outlet setup installed where my network/TV/ISY sit. Most network devices and A/V equipment are on a UPS, but the PLM is directly connected to the wall. I have whole home surge protection at the panel. Thankfully the UPS doesn't seem to impact communication for my setup. Some have suggested putting noise filters in and plugging the UPS into those. If I have an issue in the future that would be my step to reduce signal issues. 28 minutes ago, alixer said: I moved the PLM off of the power strip and still I see no communication to the PLM in the admin console when any device is physically pressed? Is this a red herring or a real issue? When you moved the PLM did you power cycle the ISY994? If not, please reboot the ISY994. Make sure all your connections to the ISY994 and PLM are secure. What computer system are you using to access admin console? Are you on macOS? Would you make sure you verify the UI and Firmware match (Admin Console -> Help -> About)? Just wanted to be sure before getting too far along. Event viewer is normally not "empty" unless you just pressed clear and posted that screen shot.
Techman Posted March 14 Posted March 14 (edited) @alixer When you replaced your PLM did you exactly follow the "replace PLM procedure", see attached. I think this is where your problem exists., Replace PLM.pdf Edited March 14 by Techman 1
alixer Posted March 14 Author Posted March 14 3 hours ago, Geddy said: What kind of results do you get when controlling a device from admin console? Post the event viewer of that interaction. It will help make sure the hops and ACK is received. I attached two images of the events when using the admin console. This first is sending the On command and the second is the Fast Off command Quote When you moved the PLM did you power cycle the ISY994? Yes, and everything seems to be working fine except I'm not receiving events in the ISY from physical switch interaction (which seems to be why the programs are not firing). Quote What computer system are you using to access admin console? Are you on macOS? Would you make sure you verify the UI and Firmware match (Admin Console -> Help -> About)? Just wanted to be sure before getting too far along. Event viewer is normally not "empty" unless you just pressed clear and posted that screen shot. I am running a Mac. They are the same. Screen sot attached. And I did clear the Event Viewer before testing physical presses of the switches, that is why it was empty. I was just showing that I am indeed looking at level 3, device communication events. When events are triggered from programs running on timers I see events. Also the Open Weather node server running on the Polisy is also triggering events.
alixer Posted March 14 Author Posted March 14 1 hour ago, Techman said: @alixer When you replaced your PLM did you exactly follow the "replace PLM procedure", see attached. I think this is where your problem exists., Replace PLM.pdf 172.65 kB · 2 downloads I would say yes I did do this but it did not go smoothly and I had to do multiple attempts. It does appear that everything is working now EXCEPT the ISY is not receiving events from physical presses of the switches. Everything else works perfectly fine. Do you think it is safe-ish to redo the replace PLM instructions again and see if I get better results?
paulbates Posted March 14 Posted March 14 2 minutes ago, alixer said: It does appear that everything is working now EXCEPT the ISY is not receiving events from physical presses of the switches. Pick one switch that's not working, right-click on it and select "Restore Device". Does that switch work after doing that?
paulbates Posted March 14 Posted March 14 (edited) 33 minutes ago, alixer said: @paulbates no, a restore does not fix the situation So there's are a couple of possibilities The switches don't have the link for the new PLM - That was the test I just asked you to do. There's noise preventing the switches messages to get back to the PLM/ISY Is there a way to remove all potential noisemakers temporarily (power strips, etc) and retest? Edited March 14 by paulbates
Techman Posted March 14 Posted March 14 @alixer Click on TOOLS, DIAGNOSTICS, PLM INFO STATUS. What address does it show for your PLM?
alixer Posted March 15 Author Posted March 15 4 hours ago, Techman said: @alixer Click on TOOLS, DIAGNOSTICS, PLM INFO STATUS. What address does it show for your PLM?
alixer Posted March 15 Author Posted March 15 5 hours ago, paulbates said: So there's are a couple of possibilities The switches don't have the link for the new PLM - That was the test I just asked you to do. There's noise preventing the switches messages to get back to the PLM/ISY Is there a way to remove all potential noisemakers temporarily (power strips, etc) and retest? Now that I removed the PLM from the power strip I really can't imagine it's a noise issue. It seems more like the switch doesn't have the right address for the PLM. Is it possible for the PLM to be linked to the switch but the switch not linked to the PLM? Meaning I can send commands from the admin console to a device because the PLM knows how to find the device. But the device cannot send events back to the PLM because it doesn't not have the correct address there? As far as removing "all the noise" I'm not sure what that would be. I have a 4000 sf house with more than 50+ Insteon devices, electronics everywhere. Buuuuuut this as all worked great for 8-10 years until just the last couple days when I had to replace the PLM
alixer Posted March 15 Author Posted March 15 @Techman When I select Device Link Table and select Start I get a dialog that lets me choose "From Link" and "Read Links". By default "From Link" is not selected and when I load the link table with the defaults everything looks fine. HOWEVER, when I check the "From Link" check box and change the numbers to "2" and "3" respectively I can see a reference to my old PLM and mismatched PLM references. What do the From Link and Read Links represent and is this a valid check?
alixer Posted March 15 Author Posted March 15 So I guess that just lets you specify how many links to show. I think this device has 5 links. The first 2 and the last are the new (correct) PLM, then there's an empty entry on line 3 but line 4 is my old disconnected PLM.
alixer Posted March 15 Author Posted March 15 Well shoot. I did a factory reset on the device and a restore and it removed the entry to the old PLM but it's events still don't show up in the event viewer and thus my Fast Off program still does not work
Techman Posted March 15 Posted March 15 @alixer I think your main problem is that the new PLM address didn't get written to some or all of your devices. At this point the only suggestion I have left is to do a "REPLACE PLM" procedure following the instructions I sent you earlier.
alixer Posted March 15 Author Posted March 15 2 hours ago, Techman said: @alixer I think your main problem is that the new PLM address didn't get written to some or all of your devices. At this point the only suggestion I have left is to do a "REPLACE PLM" procedure following the instructions I sent you earlier. I'll try it. How should I handle Polisy and Node Servers? Also what should the end result be? Should I see all references to my old PLM completely removed from every single devices?
Techman Posted March 15 Posted March 15 23 minutes ago, alixer said: I'll try it. How should I handle Polisy and Node Servers? Also what should the end result be? Should I see all references to my old PLM completely removed from every single devices? All references to your old PLM will be removed from the devices and replaced with the new PLM Your node servers shouldn't be affected. Let me know what happens, be sure to exactly follow the replace plm procedure
alixer Posted March 18 Author Posted March 18 I did the PLM Restore procedure from your doc. It went smoothly but didn't fix the problem I have. The symptom of my problem is that programs initiated from physical device operation do not work. ie Fast On/Off as a trigger for a program does not work. The possible cause may be that events triggered from physical device presses do not make it to the PLM as evident by the Event Viewer not showing events for physical operation.
Techman Posted March 18 Posted March 18 If the only issue is fast on / fast off, then it may be a timing issue with your button presses. I've noticed that The timing can vary between different controllers. I.e. the Polisy, with a faster processor, responds differently than the ISY994 Are you seeing the admin console display the correct device status when you turn a switch on or off? What's the current firmware and UI of your Polisy
alixer Posted March 18 Author Posted March 18 It is not only fast on/off. I don't see regular on/off commands in the event viewer either. The admin console does not update automatically with the correct state. However if I Query the device it updates with the correct state. The version of both is 5.3.4
alixer Posted March 18 Author Posted March 18 @Techman not sure what you mean. isy is only running on my isy994 so what else is there?
Techman Posted March 18 Posted March 18 I though you also had a Pollisy. In that case I'm not sure what could be causihng your issue. You can try removing power from the ISY, then remove the SD card and clean its contacts with a soft eraser. The final firmware version for the ISY994 was 5.3.4. Here are the release notes. Did you follow the procedures when you updated to 5.3.4? 5.3.4 (ISY994) - Last release for ISY994 - Current Release Announcements - Universal Devices Forum (universal-devices.com)
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