VenStar T1800 Triggers

[bktong]

All,

I'm thinking usages for the VenStar T1800 thermostat. I found out that the thermostat is a receiver-only device which means it can receive Insteon commands for setting the temperature.

 

What if I want to write a program to trigger Insteon events based on the temperature on the thermostat? For example, if the temperature gets to 80, turn on ceiling fan to move the air. Can the thermostat send out data to ISY? Or Do I need to poll the thermostat every so often or constantly polling it to trigger a program?

 

Thanks

bktong

[Michel Kohanim]

Hello bktong,

 

The new V2 thermostat dongles DO send change of state back to ISY and thus you do not have to query the thermostat constantly.

 

With kind regards,

Michel

[bktong]

Michel,

 

Thanks. I guess the information I read was a bit outdated and based on V1.

 

 

bktong

[JP]

I just purchased a T1800 and installed today. The adapter says that it is v2 (label on the back) and the instruction sheet says V2. My ISY99 is showing it as a 2441V at v.91. It does not seem to send anything on its own, only when I query it.

 

Based on the previous comment, I thought it should send status on its own if it was a v2 adapter.

 

JP

[Sub-Routine]

Hi JP,

 

The thermostat will send updates when the data changes. If there are no changes it will not send anything.

 

You can test by making changes at the thermostat.

 

Rand

 

I just purchased a T1800 and installed today. The adapter says that it is v2 (label on the back) and the instruction sheet says V2. My ISY99 is showing it as a 2441V at v.91. It does not seem to send anything on its own, only when I query it.

 

Based on the previous comment, I thought it should send status on its own if it was a v2 adapter.

 

JP

[JP]

I did make changes, that's the problem. I changed from heat to cold and within heat, I changed the set point. Nothing changed on the ISY99 until I did a Query. Once I issued the query, the response was immediate.

[Michel Kohanim]

Hello JP,

 

For change of state to work on V2 thermostats, you must link it to ISY when it's in the off position. Otherwise, you are not going to get any state changes.

 

With kind regards,

Michel

[JP]

I did link it with it off including the fan being off (manual). The installer also validated that it was off....... I will try to link again.....

[JP]

OK, after relinking it several times, it appears that the nearest AP (about 8 feet way with a wall in-between) is close enough for the query but not receiving the status updates. When I moved the AP (on an extension cord) closer to it (within 30 inches), it worked just fine. I'll just treat it as a v1 until I can determine how to deal with the AP location (no useable outlet near by).

[Michel Kohanim]

Hi JP,

 

There's surely something wrong with either the AP or the thermostat since the range is usually more than 10 feet. Are these new APs?

 

With kind regards,

Michel

[JP]

The one I used, which is normally side-by-side with the PLM, shows ver 1.6 on the label. I think I purchased it within the last 18 months when I replaced the old bridges (sorry, can't remember what they were called but they were the originals).

 

I have at least three APs supporting a single story house of 1800 feet (including an outhouse which is my office). I say at least because I'm missing one but that doesn't mean it is not connected and working somewhere .

 

Even when I moved the AP, I used an extension cord that left it connected to the same circuit as the PLM. The PLM is in the same closet as the WiFi router that serves the main house. I am a little surprised as I’m used to PLC issues due to the dirty power that I have but now RF……….

 

JP

[Michel Kohanim]

Hello JP,

 

In some cases, too many APs (especially when used in smaller venues) cause more harm than good. If you know how many phases you have, the best thing to do would be to bridge the phases right at the breaker (using APs) and then use APs only when you wish to extend the RF range for RF devices. As it is right now, it seems that you are using the APs for both extending the RF range as well as bridging the phases. Correct?

 

With kind regards,

Michel

[JP]

Yes, the original 2 APs were to bridge the phases. Both were in the main house. Then I started using Motion Detectors and TriggerLincs, both outside and in the second building and that is when I added the additional APs. The second building is on the same phases (same meter) as the main house but wireless signals can't always reach. I try to have an AP within 10 to 15 feet of a MD or TL. The AP in the second building did improve the response of the SwitchLincs back there as well.

[Michel Kohanim]

Hello JP,

 

Thanks ... I am quite baffled too. This does not make sense at all. I am not sure what else I can suggest except for swapping the APs and see if the problem moves with the AP.

 

With kind regards,

Michel

[JP]

I realize that mine is probably an unusual situation like everything else in my environment. In this particular situation, the location of the AP is obviously what is driving this. I know my power line quality sucks but I don’t know how this impacts the RF side (amount of traffic and the numbers of repeaters besides the APs themselves, other RF traffic).

 

BTW, this is why I like the ISY product line, to be able to deal with problems like this using the programming capability of the box. Yes I have to deal with the delays using programs but the reliability sure beats the “scene†capability in my environment. Also mixing scenes with programs gives me the best of both worlds.

 

JP

[Michel Kohanim]

Hi JP,

 

From experience I can tell you that there are basically just a very very small fraction of situations wherein signal issues cannot be solved.

 

Do you know or have any feelings as far as where the source of line quality issues are? The point is that if you have line qualitiy issues, perhaps the signals do not even get to the AP to be sent out.

 

With kind regards,

Michel

[JP]

The signal noise problem has existed here for years back when we used X10 devices. With the X10 devices it was even worst even with some automation added. As I have reported previously, there are times of the day where the house looks like a war zone because of the rapid flashing on the APs and PLMs. Using old X10 noise monitors (different freq but still....), I can see a lot of traffic but you tell it is not valid. Some of the times when the false traffic is at its worst is in the middle of the night when everything is turned off.

 

I've done the usual troubleshooting, removing the normal suspect devices (frig, TVs, PCs), dropping circuits, and moving things around. I have not been able to narrow it down and suspect that it might originating on the utility side. I tired to install a whole house filter at the panel but the electrian reported that it could not be done as it is currently set up and would open up a whole can of worms with the power company if he changed out the main panel (I'm grandfathered on several code opportunities).

 

In addition to the noise, I have several V35 SWLs which I believe are the cause of a lot of the “scene†failures but I doubt they are generating the noise.

 

In reality, I’m not even sure how much the noise is a factor vs. the SWL issue. I believe I mentioned that I have converted some of my “scenes†to programs and even with the program delay, the programs are more reliable then the scenes were.

[Michel Kohanim]

Hi JP,

 

Thanks so very much for the update. I can tell you from experience that SWL v35s do in fact contribute A LOT to instability in INSTEON network. The first thing I would do is replace those and then we can address other issues as they arise.

 

With kind regards,

Michel

[JP]

And ultimately that is my plan as well. Just a few bumps in the road as I move that way.

[wlardin]

I also have a T1800 and V2441V which I installed about a week ago. ISY device reports the thermostat adapter as V.91, but the physical unit has a label of V2 on it.

 

I can control the thermostat without a problem, however it's largely just one-way: my thermostat reports no status changes (setpoints, heat, cool, or fan control) and only the current state when queried. Even when I place an AP directly next to the 2441 using an extension cord, nothing is reported. I've also tried re-linking a number of times in accordance with the procedure outlined in the 26/99 wiki.

 

The nearest AP is v1. I also have one plugged into the ISY's PLM, and one to reach a triggerlinc in a storage building about 30' from the house. All three APs are v1. Unlike JP, my powerline is quite clean, judging by an O-scope (except when the dryer is running, but even that doesn't cause problems).

 

Might this indicate a defective thermostat adapter? Should I replace the nearest AP with a new V2? As for the ISY identifying the 2441 as V.91... Should this be a concern or is it expected? Advice would be appreciated.

 

For further info purposes: I recently upgraded to 2.8.4. No problems that weren't there under 2.7.15.

 

Thanks,

-will

[Michel Kohanim]

Hi Will,

 

Before concluding a defective thermostat, would you be kind enough to do the following:

1. Remove the thermostat from ISY

2. Factory reset the dongle and then make sure the thermostat is in Off mode (Mode = Off)

3. Add it back to ISY using Link Management | Start Linking

 

With kind regards,

Michel

[wlardin]

Michel,

 

Thanks!

 

I followed the procedure you recommended, step-by-step, and it system now works as expected. The *_Control indicators are correct, as are the current temperature and setpoint values.

 

Now I can write programs to respond to events of the HVAC system.

 

Thanks again,

-will

[JP]

Just a quick update on my problem, I removed the wireless adapter from the thermostat several times and re-inserted it. It now appears to be sending updates to the AP without problems (still watching because I'm not totally sure and I'm still running my v1 query loop).

 

Question, is there a way to turn on the fan manually from the ISY? Program mode suggests that you can turn it on but not off (no FAN OFF choice) but it does not appear to work. On the main menu, there is also not an obvious way to turn it on and off. The fan state is always ON or AUTO.

 

Thanks,

 

JP

[Sub-Routine]

Hi JP,

 

Good to read that the thermostat adapter is working as expected for you.

 

Thermostats do not allow you to turn the fan off. It is necessary that the furnace/AC be able to control the fan. Thus there is only On or Auto.

 

Setting the thermostat mode to Off and the fan to Auto will prevent the fan from running.

 

See this Wiki page: ISY-99i/ISY-26_INSTEON:Linking_a_Thermostat

 

If your fan changes do not seem to have any effect it could be caused by this:

Changing the Fan status (on the thermostat itself) too quickly causes the updates not be sent to ISY. This is NOT a bug but limitations on the thermostat adapter interface.

 

Rand

 

Just a quick update on my problem, I removed the wireless adapter from the thermostat several times and re-inserted it. It now appears to be sending updates to the AP without problems (still watching because I'm not totally sure and I'm still running my v1 query loop).

 

Question, is there a way to turn on the fan manually from the ISY? Program mode suggests that you can turn it on but not off (no FAN OFF choice) but it does not appear to work. On the main menu, there is also not an obvious way to turn it on and off. The fan state is always ON or AUTO.

 

Thanks,

 

JP

[ronbo]

I am having problems receiving status updates from my V2 thermostat also. If I am to understand, If i get it corectly linked should I see "multiple devices" like I do with my EZIO?