@kclenden , thank you again for the information. I am currently writing a Python script to parse through the even viewer data. The differences between your EISY data and my ISY994 are significant. I have many instances where the ISY will issue multiple commands prior to receiving an ACK from the PLM. I am trying to implement logic to "look ahead" for proper ACK's. It's not easy (and I'm a python novice). My ISY instance hung today after roughly 50 hours. I have not seen a PLM ECHO error as yet. I will move the routine to another dedicated PC that will hopefully be able to run longer.

I appreciate the offer of providing your program. Please allow me some time to poke at this from my side. I see advantages in having multiple eyes/approaches to addressing the problem.

I should be able to test the invalid message sequence (02 62 00.11.00 CF 13 00) in the AM. I see no reason that this would not produce an ALL-OFF. I use the old Busyrat PLM tool to write command sequences to the PLM. I retired the old windows PC that had the tool installed. Resurrected the PC from dead storage a little while ago and verified the tool functionality. Will try executing the all off in the early AM so as not to upset family members (and the Boss).

12 minutes ago, IndyMike said:

The differences between your EISY data and my ISY994 are significant.

I've run my scanner against Event Viewer logs from both my eISY and my old ISY994. There were no differences in the layout of the log. So I'm curious what you're seeing that is significantly different.

13 minutes ago, IndyMike said:

I have many instances where the ISY will issue multiple commands prior to receiving an ACK from the PLM.

I have the same thing happen on my eISY. My scanner takes that into account and attempts to match up the proper ACK. As a failsafe, my scanner quits looking for an ACK after ten seconds and retires the INST-TX-I1 and marks it as a NoAck. This means that even if a barrage of communication causes confusion, the scanner will naturally get back into synch with INST-TX-I1 / INST-ACK pairs.

19 minutes ago, IndyMike said:

I see advantages in having multiple eyes/approaches to addressing the problem.

Agreed.

20 minutes ago, IndyMike said:

I should be able to test the invalid message sequence (02 62 00.11.00 CF 13 00) in the AM. I see no reason that this would not produce an ALL-OFF.

I'm actually surprised that it caused an ALL-OFF. My understanding is that devices are supposed to look at the "To Address", in this case 00.11.00, and only act on the message if it's addressed to them. Still, the CF byte indicates a standard group broadcast message so that must be the key.

If you're trying invalid message sequences, you might also try (02 62 0F.19.00 CF 11 00) which was one of my ALL-ON events. Ironically that is a corruption of this command (02 62 21 68 01 0F 19 00) which is a status request sent to my fan controller by the program that I wrote to detect ALL-ON events.

Edited October 29Oct 29 by kclenden

@kclenden , we have confirmation of the invalid sequence

1) 02 62 00 11 00 CF 13 00 was acknowledged by the PLM and turned all lights off (responders to group 00).

2) 02 62 00 11 00 CF 11 00 was acknowledged and turned all linked group 00 lights ON.

3) 02 62 0F 19 00 CF11 00 also acknowledge and turned all linked group 00 lights ON.

I used a spare PLM that had been factory reset. I used Houselinc to link 3 devices to the PLM (group 00). All three devices were older and had been previously identified as responders to the Insteon All-on command. The PLM was an older 2413UH version V1.5 Date Code 1123.

As far as the invalid format is concerned, the "Broadcast Group" command (message flag CF in the above) only considers the lower byte of the address since groups are limited to 00 to 255 (00 to FF). Group 00 is normally reserved for devices linked to the PLM. Group FF is defined as "all linked devices". I am not entirely sure how they differ.

I normally use group FF for my testing. Wasn't entirely sure whether group 00 would work. I was also not sure whether the extraneous data in the upper address bytes would be rejected by the PLM. They were not. I had never considered that the PLM might miss or swap entire bytes in my testing. Your data has been an eye opener.

The following is from page is from the "Insteon Whitepaper: The Details" version 2 - 2013 (page 21). I know you understand this information well. I am not trying to be insulting or pedantic. I am hoping that others may have the same Ah-Ha moment that I had when I saw your log.

We are now well off the track of the OP's original thread. This may be related to what @someguy is experiencing. I do not believe it is related to @jlloyd_UD 's issue which appears to be purely Alexa base. WE should either start a new thread or ask for his blessing to continue.

2 hours ago, IndyMike said:

We are now well off the track of the OP's original thread. This may be related to what @someguy is experiencing. I do not believe it is related to @jlloyd_UD 's issue which appears to be purely Alexa base. WE should either start a new thread or ask for his blessing to continue.

I am a neophyte when it comes to network concepts and lingo, but I understand at a basic level what is being done to troubleshoot. I have been dabbling with UD and Insteon for about a decade with some degree of achievement. I have enjoyed the back and forth, but if my troubles are Alexa-based, I have not heard anything that would allow me to correct/eliminate the random lights on situation. If someone has provided a suggestion or a solution, I apologize if I have missed it and would appreciate a few ideas on how to proceed. I have been commanding Alexa using "vocals" to turn off the uncommended lights when they (too frequently) happen and disconnecting my eisy from the lan during bedtime. It would be nice to return to normalcy! I would not mind closing this lengthy thread if I could obtain a solution that I can easily apply. My household has become too reliant on Alexa's vocal controls. 🙃

5 hours ago, jlloyd_UD said:

I am a neophyte when it comes to network concepts and lingo, but I understand at a basic level what is being done to troubleshoot. I have been dabbling with UD and Insteon for about a decade with some degree of achievement. I have enjoyed the back and forth, but if my troubles are Alexa-based, I have not heard anything that would allow me to correct/eliminate the random lights on situation. If someone has provided a suggestion or a solution, I apologize if I have missed it and would appreciate a few ideas on how to proceed. I have been commanding Alexa using "vocals" to turn off the uncommended lights when they (too frequently) happen and disconnecting my eisy from the lan during bedtime. It would be nice to return to normalcy! I would not mind closing this lengthy thread if I could obtain a solution that I can easily apply. My household has become too reliant on Alexa's vocal controls. 🙃

My opinion, but I don't think our current discussion in any way helps with your issue. I view this as a Alexa/rest issue and I am not qualified to help in the matter. I do very much hope that you find a quick resolution. If we continue our current discussion we will be diluting possible responses/solutions.

Edited October 29Oct 29 by IndyMike

6 hours ago, jlloyd_UD said:

if my troubles are Alexa-based, I have not heard anything that would allow me to correct/eliminate the random lights on situation.

I've lost track, but if each of your random ON has an associated REST command, then our deep dive into eISY / PLM communication will be of no help. If I recall correctly, your error log did not show a corresponding IP address which would seem to indicate a process internal to your eISY. Do you have any node servers loaded in PG3?

I would like to continue to try to solve (if possible) this problem as I still have devices occasionaly going on for no obvious reason. most of what you kind fellows are saying in this thread goes over my head, unfortunately. is there any way I can contribute to try to solve this problem? is running my "event viewer" on level 3 going to help me (us) any?

@someguy , I would be interested in seen your event viewer logs. I f you could run a couple of days worth we might get some additional insight.

Please also post the Insteon address of your problem devices.

Edited Saturday at 12:32 AM5 days by IndyMike

@someguy

Do you have any Insteon motion sensors installed?

Do the lights all come on at the same time?

If you look at your EISY log do you see any activity just before the light(s) come on

Do you have any older, non dual band insteon devices, in your system?

Do you have any power supplies plugged into your a/c outlets

Did you look at your program summany page to see if any programs ran at the time your light(s) came on?

@IndyMike I started my even viewer. I will only send it if I have an event occur, which happens about 2-3 times per week. my suspicion is that you'd just want the event viewer info surrounding the event.

@Techman questions answered:

yes, I have insteon motion sensors.

no, I haven't had an "all on" event happen in recent years.

my abnormal events are rare enough that it rarely is a witnessed event. I just come home and find something on when no one has been home and no program could have turned that device on.

yes, I have some older non dual-band insteon devices installed.

yes, I have power supplies plugged into some of my outletlincs (but those outletlincs haven't, to my knowledge, gone on (or off) in one of these events).

because I almost never know, exactly, when these events occur, I haven't been able to find a program that could be causing them.

@someguy , we'll use the event viewer information to try to eliminate external "Rest" commands and PLM serial communication errors that @kclenden posted about.

Since it sounds like this has been going on for some time, it appears to be different than the "Rest" event that you posted about earlier. Would you agree?

Have you tried looking though the ISY log for on/off events on your problem devices? Keep in mind that you are probably looking for communication errors with the problem devices. The ISY may be telling the device to turn off, but the device doesn't hear the command.

Edited Sunday at 01:20 PM4 days by IndyMike

I have just come across this thread. I have had this issue since the V3 Alexa skill upgrade AND re-adding the spokens through the portal. I kept getting the repetitive message from Alexa that after Nov 4th this device wont work unless V3 is put in place. Ive been doing trouble shooting by restoring devices, trying to figure out triggers, etc. This morning I removed the device that came on randomly from the the spokens in the portal. Havent had the issue since. I think it is an Alexa thing. Of course I cant use voice in this state.

I have a program running that checks to see if any of my offenders are on when ISY thinks they are off. I had three of my common offenders on at 8am yesterday. here is the log for the previous four hours.

the offenders are: 15.A6.B2, 71.C2.58, and 15.A2.CC

I don't see anywhere that these devices are being contacted by the system except at around 8am when I query them and then turn them off (with my program that does so).

ISY-Events-Log.v6.0.0__Tue 2025.11.18 17.53.56.txt

Hey Someguy, thanks for posting the data. This will take a little time to go through, but let me give you some feedback.

Positives:

• You have rather good communication with your devices, including the older ones.

• @kclenden and I had discussed communication errors between the PLM and Eisy. I don't see any evidence of that in your file. You had 240 I1 communications with 0 errors and 0 timeouts.

• While I see rest activity (seems to reoccur @5 min intervals) is doesn't seem to be directly associated with your switches. This doesn't seem to be Alexa related.

Your problem devices:

• I see where you query the devices @4 AM (they confirm off) and again @8 AM. Problem is they respond that they are off @8 AM. I would have expected that query to show them ON.

• I will agree that there are no direct commands to devices 15.A6.B2 and 15.A2.CC (Can't tell if they are part of a scene). There are many off and fast off commands and "Beep" commands being sent to device 71.C2.58. The 1st beep command starts @5:01 am and the Off/f-off commands start @5:15:47 AM (Line number 8071).

• There are a number of scenes being turned on throughout. Can't tell if your problem devices are members.

• Your 15.A6.B2 and 15.A2.CC devices are rather old. They will probably respond to an Insteon All-on command.

• Your 71.C2.58 is rather new. It should NOT respond to the Insteon All-on command.

Suggestions:

• Check to see what is issuing the beep/off/fast off commands to your 71.c2.58 device. This looks like a program.

• If your 3 problem devices are not members of any scenes, perform link table scans/compares on each. Factory reset/Restore if you see mismatches.

• If the device link tables check out, but they still respond during the night, It's possible that the Eisy data table is incorrect. In this case you'll need to delete/factory reset/re-add the devices.

Edited yesterday at 02:57 AM1 day by IndyMike

I don't know if there is any commonality here, but I too have recently started having lights randomly turn on. Started maybe a month ago. Checking programs, there are no programs showing as having run at those times. The involved lights are Insteon. I haven't changed my Insteon network in quite some time and the devices involved have had no changes in many years. It has happened maybe 4 times in the past month or so.