Motion Sensor Low-Battery Indication Won’t Reset

[srm]

The low-battery node for one of my Insteon 2842-222 motion sensors reported by my ISY994i is perpetually in the ON state (every time I check it).  The ISY also receives low-battery messages to my ISY one to two times per day.  I have followed guidance in other threads on this forum, which I’ve listed at the end of this message.

Here’s what I’ve tried:

-- Replacing the battery 4 times—always measuring the new battery voltage to confirm it was greater than 9 V.
-- Querying all three device nodes (motion, dusk/dawn, and low-battery) both with and without placing the motion detector in linking mode. (Querying was done by right-clicking the device node and selecting Query.)
-- Right clicking on the motion detector and selecting “Write updates to device”;
-- Right clicking on the motion detector and selecting “Restore Device”;
-- Performing factory reset on the motion detector (Remove battery for > 15 seconds; while pressing the set button, reattach the battery; wait for the LED will turn on; continue pressing the set button for 5 seconds and then release).
-- Out of desperation, I even bought a new motion sensor, installed it (after testing the brand new battery that came with it) and then told the ISY software to replace the old motion detector with the new one.  Amazingly, the low-battery state was apparently transferred to the new motion detector!
-- With the new motion detector in place, I repeated the query tests above to no avail.

For what it’s worth, the motion sensor exhibits only a single flash in response to motion.  (This is true at least of the new motion sensor.  I did not check the flashing behavior of the previous one.)

Where have I gone wrong?

Firmware version of ISY994i:  UD994 v.4.4.6
Old motion sensor: Insteon 2842-222, 4814 Rev 2.6
New motion sensor: Insteon 2842-222, 1715 Rev 2.6

Other threads explored:
http://forum.universal-devices.com/topic/15079-motion-sensor-low-battery-event-or-lack-thereof/
http://forum.universal-devices.com/topic/11115-how-to-monitor-for-low-battery-on-motion-detector/
 

[Xathros]

 

The low-battery node for one of my Insteon 2842-222 motion sensors reported by my ISY994i is perpetually in the ON state (every time I check it).  The ISY also receives low-battery messages to my ISY one to two times per day.  I have followed guidance in other threads on this forum, which I’ve listed at the end of this message.

 

Here’s what I’ve tried:

 

-- Replacing the battery 4 times—always measuring the new battery voltage to confirm it was greater than 9 V.

-- Querying all three device nodes (motion, dusk/dawn, and low-battery) both with and without placing the motion detector in linking mode. (Querying was done by right-clicking the device node and selecting Query.)

-- Right clicking on the motion detector and selecting “Write updates to device”;

-- Right clicking on the motion detector and selecting “Restore Device”;

-- Performing factory reset on the motion detector (Remove battery for > 15 seconds; while pressing the set button, reattach the battery; wait for the LED will turn on; continue pressing the set button for 5 seconds and then release).

-- Out of desperation, I even bought a new motion sensor, installed it (after testing the brand new battery that came with it) and then told the ISY software to replace the old motion detector with the new one.  Amazingly, the low-battery state was apparently transferred to the new motion detector!

-- With the new motion detector in place, I repeated the query tests above to no avail.

 

For what it’s worth, the motion sensor exhibits only a single flash in response to motion.  (This is true at least of the new motion sensor.  I did not check the flashing behavior of the previous one.)

 

Where have I gone wrong?

 

Firmware version of ISY994i:  UD994 v.4.4.6

Old motion sensor: Insteon 2842-222, 4814 Rev 2.6

New motion sensor: Insteon 2842-222, 1715 Rev 2.6

 

Other threads explored:

http://forum.universal-devices.com/topic/15079-motion-sensor-low-battery-event-or-lack-thereof/

http://forum.universal-devices.com/topic/11115-how-to-monitor-for-low-battery-on-motion-detector/

 

 

 

This should only require a right click and query of the motion sensor's LowBatt node.  You should see the status of the node change to off instantly with the query.

 

Interestingly, I just had an issue with one of mine yesterday.  I replaced a battery after a sensor issued a low battery warning, queried the low batt node to reset.  The node status changed to Off with the query as expected.  My warning program however, did not see the status change and continued to issue the notice every 12 hrs until I manually forced the If to run this afternoon.  At that point, it properly evaluated false and stopped the run.  I'm on 5.0.4.  Dunno if this is a bug or a fluke.  Waiting for the next occurrence before officially reporting.

 

Hope this helps.

 

-Xathros

[srm]

Xathros, Thanks for the reply.  However, I had previously read the same advice on the forum and tried it (including again tonight). The status indicated by the ISY still shows ON.

 

As I understand it from a previous thread, right-clicking and querying the low-battery node is supposed to reset the ISY's status for that node--without even communicating with the motion detector, but it doesn't happen in this case.  I don't understand why.  I did try the query approach two more times tonight, 5 minutes apart.  The status indicated by the ISY still shows ON. 

 

I also re-measured the battery voltage--without disconnecting it from the motion sensor.  My Fluke multimeter, which I believe to be accurate, measures the alkaline battery at 9.30 V.

 

Other ideas?

[larryllix]

Factory reset those things several times and then operate them from the link buttons a few times before hanging them back on the wall.

 

I have always had problems with the MSes. I have 10 units.

 

I have come to not trust the MS battery low signals or the flashing LED while seeing motion. I have one with a four month old battery, that has been flashing for two months of it, and yet never reported a low battery. Most of them don't seem to ever report it.

 

I keep a list of every MS low battery signal reported in and a few have been flashing for the last two months but never reported in. This sometimes just goes away for another six month period and then resumes, also.

 

I am just waiting until they stop working now. The battery clips won't stand much more of that nonsense.

 

I keep my eye out for AC adapters and white 2.1mm x 5.1mm plug extension cords for a decent price. Only short ones seems to be out there for under the MS price.

[LeeG]

Run an Event Viewer at LEVEL 3 and Query Low Bat node  You should see the following trace.   The trace shows Low Bat node being turned Off.  No actual communication with Motion Sensor occurs because it is asleep.

 

Wed 07/13/2016 08:16:52 PM : [D2D EVENT   ] Event [13 F2 57 3] [sT] [0] uom=0 prec=-1

Wed 07/13/2016 08:16:52 PM : [  13 F2 57 3]       ST   0

[larryllix]

Run an Event Viewer at LEVEL 3 and Query Low Bat node  You should see the following trace.   The trace shows Low Bat node being turned Off.  No actual communication with Motion Sensor occurs because it is asleep.

 

Wed 07/13/2016 08:16:52 PM : [D2D EVENT   ] Event [13 F2 57 3] [sT] [0] uom=0 prec=-1

Wed 07/13/2016 08:16:52 PM : [  13 F2 57 3]       ST   0

Sounds like the MS only has a BattLow On signal and not and Off being a one sided signal only.

Also ISY has compensated by resetting ISY's status to Off by query.

[LeeG]

That is correct, the Motion Sensor Low Bat node only sends an On when battery reaches a low point.   It does not not send an Off when battery replaced.   The Motion Sensor would have to save some permanent indicator that an On was sent which would survive a power loss when new battery installed.

[srm]

 

Run an Event Viewer at LEVEL 3 and Query Low Bat node  You should see the following trace.   The trace shows Low Bat node being turned Off.  No actual communication with Motion Sensor occurs because it is asleep.

 

Wed 07/13/2016 08:16:52 PM : [D2D EVENT   ] Event [13 F2 57 3] [sT] [0] uom=0 prec=-1

Wed 07/13/2016 08:16:52 PM : [  13 F2 57 3]       ST   0

 

 

LeeG, The test you proposed was quite enlightening.

 

I queried the Low Battery Node of a different motion sensor and got an Event-Viewer response just like you showed.  However, when I queried the problem motion sensor's low-battery node, the Event Viewer showed nothing! 

 

Both of these motion sensors function reliably--communicating motion events to the ISY.  Since I had used the ISY software to do a "replace" of the problem motion sensor with a brand new one and the problem was transferred to the new one, I think there is nothing wrong with the motion detector.  Thus, your test seemed to show something wrong with the installation of this motion sensor into my ISY software, so I deleted the motion sensor from the ISY and from all programs, then re-installed it and added the "new" motion sensor nodes to back into my programs.

 

When I right-clicked the low-battery node and selected query, the ISY's display of the node status went from blank to "OFF" and the Event Viewer responded as you had indicated.

 

I think my problem is solved, but will reserve final judgment until after a few days of operation.

 

Thanks everyone!

[gduprey]

So if you reset the low battery flag on a device (via admin console query) but don't actually replace the battery (and assuming the battery is just low, not dead), will it send the low-battery message again?  If so, any idea how often?

 

I always (seems wrongly) assumed that low battery was sent when the sensor sent a heartbeat message (i.e. a bit being set in the heartbeat meaning low battery).  Since it seems it's an actual, discrete message, I'm wondering how often it sends it.

 

Reason for asking: Around the house, its becoming a joke that replacing the battery doesn't work and to ignore all the low battery alerts.  What I'd like to do, assuming the sensor periodically resends low-battery, is to have a scheduled task/program that resets/queries all 'low battery' nodes once a day.  

 

The problem is that I'm often not at the house for weeks at a time and other than myself, no one knows how to run the admin console to reset the battery.  Remote access is possible, but I'd rather just automate the whole thing, if possible.

 

Gerry

[Michel Kohanim]

Hi Gerry,

 

I really do not know the answer and I could not find anything in their documentation. Sorry.

 

With kind regards,

Michel

[gduprey]

Hmm -- understood.  I'll hold off on my implementation and the next time a motion sensor reports low battery, I'll do the 'query' thing to reset the ISY, not change the battery and see how long it takes before it's set again (if ever).  This may take a long time (the batteries last a while), but once it does, I'll try to find this thread and report back.

 

Gerry

[larryllix]

Hmm -- understood. I'll hold off on my implementation and the next time a motion sensor reports low battery, I'll do the 'query' thing to reset the ISY, not change the battery and see how long it takes before it's set again (if ever). This may take a long time (the batteries last a while), but once it does, I'll try to find this thread and report back.

 

Gerry

I got so frustrated with the poor reporting, I wrote a recorder that keeps a list of every lowBatt signal from my 10 MSes. Most of the time nothing is ever sent.

 

Out of, probably 10, batteries I have replaced so far, I think I have had about 2-3 reports of dead batteries. The flashing LED on the MS is much more reliable.

 

When it multiple flashes happen, after seeing motion, it is time to replace the battery, within the next month.

[Teken]

The Insteon Motion Sensor (MS) sends out only one low battery alert message while the existing battery is in place. It should be noted one of the missing capabilities of the MS is that the voltage level of the battery can also be obtained.

 

It would be really great to see 5.XX support this missing feature which is outlined in the API EDOC.