Simple Control (Former Roomie Remote) and ISY Integration

[pinuz]

Good evening everyone.

I am new to this forum but Im an X10 / Insteon User (and from 2011 an ISY User).

 

Im an avid Simple Remote (Roomie Remote) passionate user and I am wondering if we could create a section in UDI Forum about the ISY integration with Simple Control, reason being Simple Control forum doesn't have an active group of people (and it is also moderated).

 

Anyone interested?

 

 

 

[TrojanHorse]

Yes. I support the idea.

I use roomie with my ISY, just a couple lighting scenes per activity.

Roomie is good, but it hasn't fully replaced my old RF to IR Harmony due to lack of hard buttons.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Michel Kohanim]

Hi pinuz,

 

I also support the idea. This said, let's see how many other positive feedback we get.

 

With kind regards,

Michel

[pinuz]

Yes. I support the idea.

I use roomie with my ISY, just a couple lighting scenes per activity.

Roomie is good, but it hasn't fully replaced my old RF to IR Harmony due to lack of hard buttons.

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

To be honest, after we got the echo dot (4 of them so far) we barely use the devices (iphones/ipads/ipods) to control the tv at least not for power on or off.

Basically by saying  Alexa Living Room On, Simple control opens the first activiti in the Living room and goes direct to the news.

Same for ISY and Alexa (which even easier because you can assign a spoken name to each device scene).

The integration between Alexa Isy and Roomie really makes our day way more fun.

 

Unfortunately Triggers don't really work so far for Keypads and on this Michael may help for the rest I have created a facebook page in case we need it but I hope we attract more users.

 

Thank you for your Support !

 

 

 

 

 

 

[pinuz]

Hi pinuz,

 

I also support the idea. This said, let's see how many other positive feedback we get.

 

With kind regards,

Michel

Thank you Michael 

I can start with a question about the feedback keypadlinc give.

This is one answer from Roomie Support

-------

As we state in the compatibility list we support Brightness, Synchronization of all Areas and Lights. If you look at Lutron we list that we support Buttons as well as those items. If there is no lighting brightness with feedback for the keypad then we would not be able to see that the light is on at 255 to match the trigger. So I believe the issue is that we are not able to see actual brightness feedback for these buttons as they do not have an actual light associated with it. What you would be looking for is a .BUTTON PRESS which is not currently supported with Insteon. You are welcome to make this a feature request on our user forum.

 

I would need to look at their API but it is possible their buttons do not provide feedback for brightness levels, and their dimmers/switches would. Putting a feature request will help us take a look at this integration. I will make note of this to review and mark this ticket as solved for now.

----------------------

 

Any thoughts? 

[Michel Kohanim]

Hi pinuz,

 

I do not think they support subscriptions. For any client to receive status feedback, they need to subscribe to ISY.

 

With kind regards,

Michel

[jtara92101]

It works for me.

 

I have my kitchen ceiling cans on a KPL. I have a slider for the kitchen ceiling cans in my SimpleControl layout. The slider shows the current level, and I can change the level with the slider. If I change the level manually by holding the top or bottom button down, the slider handle position follows the brightness level.

 

Can you clarify if you are using the main on/off or instead are using one of the small buttons? (Controlling some scene?) The feedback wouldn't work if using one of the small buttons. The buttons have no dimmer, they are just used as scene controllers or program triggers.

 

My setup:

 

Type: Slider

Name: Kitchen Cans

Device: Insteon Automation ISY-99i 

Feedback: Brightness

 

It seems SimpleControl support misunderstood your question, since they talk about Lutron, and you have an Insteon KPL.

[pinuz]

Hi pinuz,

 

I do not think they support subscriptions. For any client to receive status feedback, they need to subscribe to ISY.

 

With kind regards,

Michel

 

Morning/Afternoon Michael, all status feedback from ISY are obtained locally by logging in into the isy within Simple Control APP (ISY is autodiscovered) enter user name and password and click update the manifest, all extremely simple.

All syncronization/triggers is then handled by Simple HUB Software which in my case is running on my server (MAC) which also handles all their subscription services, I have to say that after version 4.5 things are working pretty good.

Issue is that for insteon they pick only Brightness instead of ON/OFF status so we can't for instance use buttons.

With Lutron they do support Buttons, probably with Smartthings too and insteon hub too.

THank you for your reply

[pinuz]

It works for me.

 

I have my kitchen ceiling cans on a KPL. I have a slider for the kitchen ceiling cans in my SimpleControl layout. The slider shows the current level, and I can change the level with the slider. If I change the level manually by holding the top or bottom button down, the slider handle position follows the brightness level.

 

Can you clarify if you are using the main on/off or instead are using one of the small buttons? (Controlling some scene?) The feedback wouldn't work if using one of the small buttons. The buttons have no dimmer, they are just used as scene controllers or program triggers.

 

My setup:

 

Type: Slider

Name: Kitchen Cans

Device: Insteon Automation ISY-99i 

Feedback: Brightness

 

It seems SimpleControl support misunderstood your question, since they talk about Lutron, and you have an Insteon KPL.

 

Hello Jtara, thank you for your reply

What Simple Control meant in their reply is that for Lutron they do support Buttons to trigger Activities but for Insteon they don't since buttons only give ON or OFF status. and no brightness as you also pointed out.

 

Supporting buttons is actually the best feature when comes to Keypads since you can assign commands and or TV on OFF etc etc and it is very convenient and I don't believe it is that difficult for them to implement.

I have 4 Keypadlincs, 8 and 6 buttons.

 

I have a large insteon base in my house and I do use Simple Control with an HDMI Matrix system (and Itachs) Ibeacons.

Mobilinc and Roomie are the 2 apps that I use the most and subscription isn't that cheap either (Roomie 50$ per year and 29 for Mobilinc) 

 

I am sure there is a workaround so any idea is really appreciated.

 

 

[etsvilik]

pinuz, If I understand correctly you are truing to use SC Trigger feature by using keypads button presses as triggers. I'm not using Triggers feature in the Sc itself. Instead Keypad buttons trigger program in ISY and in turn ISY sends REST call to Simple Hub starting an activity.

 

I would like to have Simple Control subforum. Using it extensively from early Roomie days.

[jtara92101]

Do you HAVE to have a button in your SC layout? What's wrong with a slider? It works, and as an added bonus, you can control the level instead of just on/off.

 

I've never messed with SC triggers. I vaguely recall seeing that it has something called "trigger", but don't know what it does. Or maybe that's my Denon receiver?!

 

As does etsvilik, I just use a REST call from ISY to SimpleHub if I want to control something AV with a SL button. I don't do this currently, but in the past I had a button to switch surround speakers for 2 rooms. The only thing I have right now that runs hub commands is IFTTT responding to Google Home "watch cable TV", "watch Apple TV", etc.

[pinuz]

pinuz, If I understand correctly you are truing to use SC Trigger feature by using keypads button presses as triggers. I'm not using Triggers feature in the Sc itself. Instead Keypad buttons trigger program in ISY and in turn ISY sends REST call to Simple Hub starting an activity.

 

I would like to have Simple Control subforum. Using it extensively from early Roomie days.

 

Yes the press of a button triggers an activity which can be anything from one of my 39 devices , a particular channel or any activity, what you suggest uses Simple Control Rest API which may be a better solution for lots of things but since we pay already 50$ per year for the subscription I would like them to implement ON/OFF status instead of only brightness but your suggestion is great and advanced.

I have created a Facebook group that we could use if you like, putting togheter ideas we could take ISY and Simple control to a whole new level which control4/crestron can only dream.

 

This is the group

http://i.imgur.com/RJMXRoK.jpg

[pinuz]

Do you HAVE to have a button in your SC layout? What's wrong with a slider? It works, and as an added bonus, you can control the level instead of just on/off.

 

I've never messed with SC triggers. I vaguely recall seeing that it has something called "trigger", but don't know what it does. Or maybe that's my Denon receiver?!

 

As does etsvilik, I just use a REST call from ISY to SimpleHub if I want to control something AV with a SL button. I don't do this currently, but in the past I had a button to switch surround speakers for 2 rooms. The only thing I have right now that runs hub commands is IFTTT responding to Google Home "watch cable TV", "watch Apple TV", etc.

Thank you to you too for your reply, yes Rest call is the way to go for now, I use alexa with mobilinc and simple control and I have to say that it is amazing !

I will also buy a google home and test it

[texhost]

Hello - Can someone post an example of how the REST API is intergrated with simple control. For example, i want to be able to press a button on my insteon six way button to activate the command "Watch TV" in simple control.  How do you do this? 

 

Thanks.

[jtara92101]

Hello - Can someone post an example of how the REST API is intergrated with simple control. For example, i want to be able to press a button on my insteon six way button to activate the command "Watch TV" in simple control.  How do you do this? 

 

It is slightly convoluted. Here's one I actually use.

 

Configuration > Networking > Network Resources > Add (button on bottom row)

 

Put in a name, example av.watch.cable

 

Click on URL field. A dialog will come up.

 

Choose dropdowns:

  http

  POST

 

Host: (the IP address of the computer that runs the SimpleHub application, for me it's my Mac Mini)

 

Port: 47147

 

Path: /api/v1/runactivity

 

Mode: Raw Text

 

Look at Headers. Click on Content-Type, and then you can change it. Change it to:

 

  application/json

 

Body:

 

{

  "activity_uuid": "32AEC1D0-E38C-4254-BE1D-8BDE6D5B567C"

}

 

Note: you have to discover your own activity ID, the one above is from MY system, it will not work on YOUR system.

 

Now you can use this network resource in a program or programs.

 

----

OK, so how the heck to you discover your activity ID?

 

You can do it in a web browser. The IP address below will work if you browse from the computer that runs the SimpleHub. Otherwise, plug in the IP address or domain name of the computer that runs the SimpleHub.

 

    http://127.0.0.1:47147/api/v1/activities

 

Your browser window will list the activities defined in your SimpleControl, in JSON format. For example, these are mine:

 

{"status":"success","data":[{"icon":"logo-cox.png","roomuuid":"458E1A3B-01BE-45FD-92FC-11C2B32D8A8D","name":"Living Room: Cox","uuid":"32AEC1D0-E38C-4254-BE1D-8BDE6D5B567C"},{"icon":"logo-appletv","roomuuid":"458E1A3B-01BE-45FD-92FC-11C2B32D8A8D","name":"Living Room: Apple TV","uuid":"9519A026-2714-426D-BDFA-A9F680F34152"},{"icon":"logo-bluray3d","roomuuid":"458E1A3B-01BE-45FD-92FC-11C2B32D8A8D","name":"Living Room: BluRay","uuid":"6E435CAA-8CA7-42CB-A4FF-FB506BDF67B4"},{"icon":"poweroff","roomuuid":"458E1A3B-01BE-45FD-92FC-11C2B32D8A8D","name":"Living Room: System Off","type":"off","uuid":"7EBCDE3B-BFB1-45AF-8B50-4064A7FE35EF"}],"code":200}

 

Replace the UUID I showed in the example with the UUID from your browser listing for the activity that you want to run.

 

Full details of the API here:

 

    https://www.simplecontrol.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/HTTPCommandInterface.pdf

[etsvilik]

Excellent guide by jtara92101. It should be pinned.

 

Few notes:

• I use Chrome extension Postman to  quickly test commands and gather uuid's in nice formatted/readable fashion. 
• For some reason Toggle Activities do not work for me. It does not take "+" or "-" sign at the end of uuid, responding as non-existing uuid.  It can be possibly a Simple Hub bug.
• Keypad buttons sometimes need to be assigned to a dummy scene as Controller to be reflected in ISY. Then you can use Status is 100% for toggle buttons to activate the program with network resources. I use Else clause in the program to activate System Off in SC.

[jtara92101]

• For some reason Toggle Activities do not work for me. It does not take "+" or "-" sign at the end of uuid, responding as non-existing uuid.  It can be possibly a Simple Hub bug.

 

 

I don't think that's how it works.

 

It's documented like this:

 

{

  "activity_uuid": "32AEC1D0-E38C-4254-BE1D-8BDE6D5B567C",

  "toggle_state": "off"

}

 

Give it a try and let us know. I don't use off. I just use an activity that turns the whole system off. I'm afraid my brain can't wrap around the notion of turning an activity off. You're doing one activity or the other, or nothing.

[pinuz]

 

I don't think that's how it works.

 

It's documented like this:

 

{

  "activity_uuid": "32AEC1D0-E38C-4254-BE1D-8BDE6D5B567C",

  "toggle_state": "off"

}

 

Give it a try and let us know. I don't use off. I just use an activity that turns the whole system off. I'm afraid my brain can't wrap around the notion of turning an activity off. You're doing one activity or the other, or nothing.

 

 

Thank you so much for posting this example, it will help all of us! once created one activity it is easy just to click copy and just enter the new name and the udid.

I also used an activity off , I couldn't make it work an off activity

[jtara92101]

 

I also used an activity off , I couldn't make it work an off activity

 

That's because you shouldn't set the "off" activity to "off", You have to set the "off" activity to "on".

 

I think of it as "running the activity". You run the "off" activity to turn everything off.

 

Just leave out the toggle_state. The default is on, if not specified. I've never figured-out just what the use case is for the "off" state.

 

It's a bit like an Insteon scene that sets a group of lights off. Though in ISY, you CAN set a scene "off". But you can also just create a scene that sets all of the light levels to 0, and then you set the scene "on" to turn the lights "off"...

[larryllix]

I have to agree with jtara's logic. I don't use scene off either in programs. I have a scene that sets the devices to 0% or Off.

 

It's nice to have the options but setting a scene to off just grinds my brain also.

 

Alexa necessitated the need for an Off / else program for me against my religion. I am just not going to say

....Alexa. Turn On the Off scene but I don't program that way.

[etsvilik]

That is the exact syntax I use for Toggle Actions. Toggle Actions uuids have + or - as part of uuid string. It does not take it, returning error. If I remove the sign it returns success but does not execute the action. It is not a big deal as I can't find really a purpose to execute it from ISY. 

 

Toggle action may be not exactly right analogy with scene. It has certain purpose where you want to "tweak" the current Action without switching to another Action.. 

For example I have a setup where Receiver outputs video  to flat screen TV and  to overhead projector. I turn first main Action "Watch Roku" which sets up all components and turns flat-screen on . By switching Toggle Action "Projector" On,  I can turn off TV and turn on Projector, kill the light. If I toggle the "Projector" action off - it switches back to flat TV and turns the light on. Toggle actions are not changing the "main" active Action. They just adding some additional features to it. Yes it can be done with 2 separate Actions, but this just makes it a bit more logical for me at least.

[pinuz]

That's because you shouldn't set the "off" activity to "off", You have to set the "off" activity to "on".

 

I think of it as "running the activity". You run the "off" activity to turn everything off.

 

Just leave out the toggle_state. The default is on, if not specified. I've never figured-out just what the use case is for the "off" state.

 

It's a bit like an Insteon scene that sets a group of lights off. Though in ISY, you CAN set a scene "off". But you can also just create a scene that sets all of the light levels to 0, and then you set the scene "on" to turn the lights "off"...

I meant I use the activity that turns the Room Off like  you  

[pinuz]

This is my example

 

 

 

Now I would like to create a 2 ways feedback, basically if I use Roomie or alexa the button will lit.

I'm sure is possible but I can't figure out how

[etsvilik]

Set up a Scene to be Controller/Responder for this button. Then turn the scene on in Then and Off in Else clause of your program. In my example it is SC-Movie scene

Movie - [iD 0069][Parent 0030]

 

If

        Status  'Outside / FamilyKPD.Patio A / FamilyKPD.Movies H' is 100%

 

Then

        Resource 'SC.Family.Roku'

        Set Scene '1st Floor / Family / SC-First Floor' Off

        Set Scene '1st Floor / Family / SC-Movie' On

 

Else

        Resource 'SC.Family.System Off'

        Set Scene '1st Floor / Family / SC-First Floor' On

        Set Scene '1st Floor / Family / SC-Movie' Off

[ahwman]

Thanks everyone, this is exactly what I was looking for and it works great!  That said, does anyone know if it’s possible to launch a room using this same method?  I would like to sync the current room based on occupancy sensors via my ISY.  I’ve been playing with iBeacons within the Simple Control app, but they’re way too slow to respond if at all...

Chuck