wrique Posted January 11, 2018 Posted January 11, 2018 I have a ISY994i with the Z-wave module and I just purchased 2 Kwikset 910 locks. I have everything installed, paired and working remotely through the ISY, but when I manually lock/unlock the lock by hand, the status does not change in the ISY. This is very disappointing since we almost always lock the locks manually, not programmatically. Is this the correct that the status doesn't change or do I need to configure something?
lilyoyo1 Posted January 11, 2018 Posted January 11, 2018 The status changes. Do you have any repeaters nearby or are those the only zwave devices that you have.
wrique Posted January 11, 2018 Author Posted January 11, 2018 I got a repeater very near by (within about 5 feet). That is the only way I can reliably lock/unlock the doors from the ISY. The ISY's range seems short, whereas the repeater's range seems longer. I can lock/unlock all day long if done from the ISY. I will try to get a trace from the ISY of what is happening when I manually lock/unlock.
lilyoyo1 Posted January 11, 2018 Posted January 11, 2018 Delete the lock from the ISY. Do an exclude then include the lock. Personally, I add locks next to the ISY rather than go through repeaters. I just don't trust them. If you do the exclude/inclusion and you're still not getting status, so would recommend bringing the lock closer to the ISY and redoing the process.
wrique Posted January 11, 2018 Author Posted January 11, 2018 When I first added the locks, I had them right next to the ISY. Then I moved them out to the doors on the past the repeater and healed the z-wave network. But I will try your technique. Thanks!
MWareman Posted January 12, 2018 Posted January 12, 2018 Make sure to do a ‘Repair’ whenever you move a device. Otherwise, they likely won’t use your repeater to send messages back to the ISY.
wrique Posted January 12, 2018 Author Posted January 12, 2018 When I log the events I never see any Z-wave events when I manually lock/unlock the doors. But I see them when I lock/unlock them with the ISY. I tried doing the Repair and I got one of the locks to produce the Z-wave event when I manually locked it, but it only did it once, then never again. The other lock never did it. This weekend I am going to try moving the locks within a foot or so of the repeater and the ISY and then try them again. I also thought about re-calibrating the Kwikset lock where you hold down the Program key while inserting the battery. Any other ideas?
Michel Kohanim Posted January 12, 2018 Posted January 12, 2018 Hi wrique, I suspect it has something to do with signal strength. I think your test of within a feet is a great idea. With kind regards, Michel
lilyoyo1 Posted January 12, 2018 Posted January 12, 2018 I would test next to the ISY to make sure it works properly. If so, put it back in its final location and test. If it doesn't work then you need another repeater.
danbutter Posted January 12, 2018 Posted January 12, 2018 When I log the events I never see any Z-wave events when I manually lock/unlock the doors. But I see them when I lock/unlock them with the ISY. I tried doing the Repair and I got one of the locks to produce the Z-wave event when I manually locked it, but it only did it once, then never again. The other lock never did it. This weekend I am going to try moving the locks within a foot or so of the repeater and the ISY and then try them again. I also thought about re-calibrating the Kwikset lock where you hold down the Program key while inserting the battery. Any other ideas?
danbutter Posted January 12, 2018 Posted January 12, 2018 The calibrating by holding the button down and putting batteries in is just for the lock mechanism. Should have no bearing on the zwave operation. I had many issues with this myself and it took much experimentation to get everything working. I now have 4 kwikset locks and all change status on ISY when manually locked or unlocked. It may take a few seconds, but it does update. One of the things I recall is adding a repeater using some sort of add as secure menu. Sorry for being so vague as I don't recall the exact terms. It never made any sense to me since as I understand it that is supposed to be for the lock itself, but it really seemed to make a difference. Could have been coincidence.
wrique Posted January 12, 2018 Author Posted January 12, 2018 danbutter, Thanks for the info! I am using an inovelli repeater (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B06XG25T2Y/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1) that looked pretty good and customers have said that it works with the Kwikset 910 lock. There is a item in the ISY Z-wave menu that says "Allow secure devices to be included..." and it was checked (it was on by default). Perhaps that is what you used.
danbutter Posted January 12, 2018 Posted January 12, 2018 After scanning this thread again it seems like you have One repeater. Is this correct? If so that is likely your issue. There is no one size fits all with zwave and the number of devices needed to have a reliable network, but one is not enough. I say one because the locks themselves won't repeat as they are battery powered. Change out some light switches or outlets or get more plugin modules between the ISY and your locks. Zwave is a mesh network so a few more devices will allow it to function better.
wrique Posted January 12, 2018 Author Posted January 12, 2018 Yes, I have one repeater. I will look into adding more nearer the doors. Please excuse my newbie-ness, I have had Insteon for many years and this is my first dive into Z-wave. Thanks so much, I am learning a lot from you guys.
MWareman Posted January 12, 2018 Posted January 12, 2018 You usually need three or so powered repeater-capable beaming-capable security-capable devices to form a base network before good reliability is usually obtained in a zwave network. Consider the ISY one of them. You have one already (assuming it supports beam forming and security, I have not been able to verify this yet) - add one more (consider the Aeon Siren - it has done wonders for my zwave network reliability - and many others on here use it to good success). When you add a repeater - remember to repair again. Run repair any time you change the zwave topology, by adding, removing or moving devices.
stusviews Posted January 13, 2018 Posted January 13, 2018 When I added my first repeater, I found that location was more important than distance. In particular, the lock worked best the repeater was further from the ISY than the lock was. [repeater]<--->[lock]<--->[iSY] worked better than [lock]<--->[repeater]<--->[iSY] Now, with 5 repeaters (2 sirens, 2 doorbells 1 Gen6 repeater), I no longer need to be concerned
MWareman Posted January 13, 2018 Posted January 13, 2018 When I added my first repeater, I found that location was more important than distance. In particular, the lock worked best the repeater was further from the ISY than the lock was. [repeater]<--->[lock]<--->[iSY] worked better than [lock]<--->[repeater]<--->[iSY] Now, with 5 repeaters (2 sirens, 2 doorbells 1 Gen6 repeater), I no longer need to be concerned I have to say, my experience was identical. In the early days, I had two locks. I got a couple of Aeotec ‘Repeaters’, had all kinds of trouble, replaced the Aeotec Repeaters with Aeotec Sirens and boom - instant reliability. Both sirens are further from the ISY than the locks. Now, I have about 25 Zwave devices - so also not a concern now.
wrique Posted January 17, 2018 Author Posted January 17, 2018 After putting in 2 more Z-wave repeaters (near my doors), it seems to be working a lot better. I have some more testing and enhancements to do, but this made a big improvement. Thanks to all!
btreinders Posted July 6, 2018 Posted July 6, 2018 I am having a similar issue with the latest Kwikset convert Z-wave lock. It will not report status when used manually and I have tried everything. Adding it at the door, adding at the ISY, moving repeaters around. Nothing seems to make it work. It works just fine when the ISY locks and unlocks it so I don't think it's a signal issue. It is z-wave plus and my repeaters are too. I am using the latest 5.0.12 firmware. I don't see anything in the event viewer. Could it be the lock itself? Model number 914ZW500CONV11P. Thanks!
lilyoyo1 Posted July 6, 2018 Posted July 6, 2018 Bring it close to the Isy. Remove it from the Isy. Redo the process (exclude then include) while it is close to the Isy, does it pick up you manually locking/unlocking your lock?
btreinders Posted July 6, 2018 Posted July 6, 2018 Yes, I did that again just now and still the LED on the lock will update when I turn it manually but will not update in the ISY.
btreinders Posted July 7, 2018 Posted July 7, 2018 I updated to 5.0.13 and it still does not update. When I query it I get two unknown z-wave messages so maybe the ISY does not support this lock yet. Can someone from UDI confirm this? Model number 914 ZW500 CONV 11P. It is z-wave plus if that matters. Sat 07/07/2018 11:35:34 AM : [ZWAVE-MISC ] ZW028_1 : Kwikset : Unrecognized 0x0000 Sat 07/07/2018 11:35:34 AM : [ZWAVE-MISC ] ZW028_1 : Kwikset : Unrecognized 0x0000 Query with extended commands on: Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:02 AM : [ZWAVE-WAKEUP 28.000] Query device when awake ZW028_1 Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:02 AM : [ZWAVE-TE ] [80/02] Battery Get ACK,AUTO,EXPLORE To=0x1C Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:02 AM : [ZWAVE-TX ZW028_1] [98/40] Security Nonce Get ACK,AUTO,EXPLORE To=0x1C Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:04 AM : [ZWAVE-RX ZW028_1] [98/80] Security Nonce Report - nonce=[938119F22EE6B442] ACK,AUTO,EXPLORE From=0x1C Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:04 AM : [ZWAVE-RX ZW028_1] [98/40] Security Nonce Get ACK,AUTO,EXPLORE From=0x1C Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:04 AM : [ZWAVE-TX ] ... Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:04 AM : [ZWAVE-RD ] [010A00131C0380033C250088] REQ ZW_SEND_DATA Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:05 AM : [ZWAVE-TE ] [62/02] CC=0x62 cmd=0x02 [] ACK,AUTO,EXPLORE To=0x1C Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:05 AM : [ZWAVE-TX ZW028_1] [98/40] Security Nonce Get ACK,AUTO,EXPLORE To=0x1C Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:05 AM : [ZWAVE-RX ZW028_1] [98/80] Security Nonce Report - nonce=[CFC72B2F569B5396] ACK,AUTO,EXPLORE From=0x1C Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:05 AM : [ZWAVE-RX ZW028_1] [98/40] Security Nonce Get ACK,AUTO,EXPLORE From=0x1C Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:05 AM : [ZWAVE-TX ] ... Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:05 AM : [ZWAVE-RD ] [010E00131C076203FF0000FEFE2500AD] REQ ZW_SEND_DATA Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:05 AM : [ZWAVE-TE ] [71/07] Alarm cmd=0x07 [] ACK,AUTO,EXPLORE To=0x1C Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:05 AM : [ZWAVE-TX ZW028_1] [98/40] Security Nonce Get ACK,AUTO,EXPLORE To=0x1C Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:05 AM : [ZWAVE-RX ZW028_1] [98/80] Security Nonce Report - nonce=[9DB42F879FFDC613] ACK,AUTO,EXPLORE From=0x1C Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:06 AM : [ZWAVE-RX ZW028_1] [98/40] Security Nonce Get ACK,AUTO,EXPLORE From=0x1C Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:06 AM : [ZWAVE-TX ] ... Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:07 AM : [ZWAVE-RD ] [010C00131C057108824001250095] REQ ZW_SEND_DATA Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:07 AM : [ZWAVE-TE ] [71/04] Alarm Get type=0x00 ztype=0x06 ACK,AUTO,EXPLORE To=0x1C Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:07 AM : [ZWAVE-TX ZW028_1] [98/40] Security Nonce Get ACK,AUTO,EXPLORE To=0x1C Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:07 AM : [ZWAVE-RX ZW028_1] [98/80] Security Nonce Report - nonce=[69699E062F1B258A] ACK,AUTO,EXPLORE From=0x1C Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:07 AM : [ZWAVE-RX ZW028_1] [98/40] Security Nonce Get ACK,AUTO,EXPLORE From=0x1C Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:07 AM : [ZWAVE-TX ] ... Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:07 AM : [ZWAVE-RD ] [011000131C097105000000FF06FE00250048] REQ ZW_SEND_DATA Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:07 AM : [ZWAVE-MISC ] ZW028_1 : Kwikset : Unrecognized 0x0000 Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:08 AM : [ZWAVE-TE ] [71/04] Alarm Get type=0x00 ztype=0x08 ACK,AUTO,EXPLORE To=0x1C Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:08 AM : [ZWAVE-TX ZW028_1] [98/40] Security Nonce Get ACK,AUTO,EXPLORE To=0x1C Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:08 AM : [ZWAVE-RX ZW028_1] [98/80] Security Nonce Report - nonce=[7A803B566076F3E0] ACK,AUTO,EXPLORE From=0x1C Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:08 AM : [ZWAVE-RX ZW028_1] [98/40] Security Nonce Get ACK,AUTO,EXPLORE From=0x1C Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:08 AM : [ZWAVE-TX ] ... Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:08 AM : [ZWAVE-RD ] [011000131C097105000000FF08FE0025004A] REQ ZW_SEND_DATA Sat 07/07/2018 11:43:08 AM : [ZWAVE-MISC ] ZW028_1 : Kwikset : Unrecognized 0x0000
Michel Kohanim Posted July 8, 2018 Posted July 8, 2018 Hi btreinders, Looking into it. With kind regards, Michel
btreinders Posted July 20, 2018 Posted July 20, 2018 Michel, I got a replacement lock just to be sure and it turns out the lock was broken. New one reports status from manually locking and unlocking. Old one still does not so I'll be returning that one. Thanks for looking! Brent
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