No Wireless devices report status changes

[jrf]

After several years of reliable service from my ISY and insteon network, I've hit my first real snag...and it's a doozy.

Suddenly a few days ago, I was no longer seeing changes to motion sensors, leak sensors and trigger lincs. I have 24 motion sensors, 12 leak sensors and 25 triggerlincs. None of them report status changes. Not a one.

Now, the plot thickens....

If I query the Battery Status for the Motion Sensors, I get a battery report/status right back and it's right. Querying Motion or Dusk Dawn is blank. My remotelincs are working properly and response/control of other devices (both hard wired and plug in mondules)  is nearly instant as it always has. I have dozens of dual band devices and some range extenders. Controlling devices through the console is also working.

I haven't added or deleted any devices in weeks.  

I'm on version 4.5.4.....(downrev I know, but it's been 100% reliable so I wasn't going to go to 4.6.2.) I've already done a restart of the ISY. No change, except the values that were there before and not changing are now blank and not changing. 

Anyone? 

[larryllix]

1 minute ago, jrf said:

After several years of reliable service from my ISY and insteon network, I've hit my first real snag...and it's a doozy.

Suddenly a few days ago, I was no longer seeing changes to motion sensors, leak sensors and trigger lincs. I have 24 motion sensors, 12 leak sensors and 25 triggerlincs. None of them report status changes. Not a one.

Now, the plot thickens....

If I query the Battery Status for the Motion Sensors, I get a battery report/status right back and it's right. Querying Motion or Dusk Dawn is blank. My remotelincs are working properly and response/control of other devices (both hard wired and plug in mondules)  is nearly instant as it always has. I have dozens of dual band devices and some range extenders. Controlling devices through the console is also working.

I haven't added or deleted any devices in weeks.  

I'm on version 4.5.4.....(downrev I know, but it's been 100% reliable so I wasn't going to go to 4.6.2.) I've already done a restart of the ISY. No change, except the values that were there before and not changing are now blank and not changing. 

Anyone? 

Welcome to the forums!!

Some things to try
- Power cycle your ISY and PLM making sure the PLM is well powered up before powering up ISY
- Try the linking button on any MS to see if you can force an update. Try seven rapid taps on the linking button to force a Dark/Light update.
- Try plugging in a dual and device in the same receptacle or next one in the chain to the PLM. Change it's position On/Of to see if the PLM receives it.
- In admin console try the PLM link count a few times and see if it is consistent with no interrupting Insteon traffic.
- Turn off a l breakers at the panel except the one with ISY and PLM and repeat the close device items above. Looking for electrical noise

Do all of your 120Vac devices report statuses OK? Can you control them from the admin console?

How old is your PLM?

Have you tried to factory rest any of the devices and restore them from the admin console?
 

[jrf]

Thanks for the welcome. I've been lurking/monitoring the forums for years. All my wired and plug in devices report status and operate normally across both phases.  I did a power cycle (unplug /replug of the PLM) but only did a restart of the ISY. I did an unplug/replug there too. No Luck. There are plug ins upstream and downstream of the PLM (same circuit). Both work as do all the rest in the house. 

The odd thing is that everything else is working including remotelincs.. Various keypad links throughout the house all work, remotelincs control both wired and plug in devices, and the console is controlling things throughout the house. If I take the battery out of a MS and query it...it recognizes that there's no power there. I put it back in and query it and it sees the batter.  The weird thing is that they've all gone radio silent at the same time, makes me think it's something "central".... or upstream from the individual MS/Moisture Sensors/Trigger Links. I triggers a moisture sensor.  I see the light turn on showing a transmit. No change in the Console. Still blank. Same with Motion and Trigger links. Is see them "send" but I don't see a status change in the console.

I'm going to go grab a new MS from my spares pool and see if I can add it.

 

 

Edited May 17, 2018 by jrf

[larryllix]

Weird! Something jamming the RF signals? Get an AM radio and see if there is lots of radio noise on it. Try an FM radio between stations too.

[jrf]

Ok....added another MS.... it added correctly....mostly. It was added and appeared in the list...but it showed pending writes. So I forced a write updates to device... it completed successfully. And...it reported status (motion) changes.

And....suddenly....now....

So is everything else. All motion sensors, trigger lincs, and moisture sensors are reporting status.

Not a full moon tonight, so I'm going to go with something stuck in it's digital throat (or craw).

All seems to be working properly now. I'll continue to monitor.

Way weirdo. Will watch for a few weeks and then see about updating to 4.6.2.

Big thanks to you help and suggestions. I have a fairly complex automation environment at home, with Homeseer at the heart of it all. I appreciate all the help I get from the HA community of trailblazers.

Edited May 17, 2018 by jrf

[larryllix]

7 hours ago, jrf said:

Ok....added another MS.... it added correctly....mostly. It was added and appeared in the list...but it showed pending writes. So I forced a write updates to device... it completed successfully. And...it reported status (motion) changes.

And....suddenly....now....

So is everything else. All motion sensors, trigger lincs, and moisture sensors are reporting status.

Not a full moon tonight, so I'm going to go with something stuck in it's digital throat (or craw).

All seems to be working properly now. I'll continue to monitor.

Way weirdo. Will watch for a few weeks and then see about updating to 4.6.2.

Big thanks to you help and suggestions. I have a fairly complex automation environment at home, with Homeseer at the heart of it all. I appreciate all the help I get from the HA community of trailblazers.

Sounds like a failing PLM.

[smokegrub]

I agree, the PLM may be failing. Again, how old is it?

[jrf]

I'd guess around 7-8 years, it pre-dates dual-band. I was thinking about picking up a new spare anyways. Guess I'll make that an order for 2, one to put in now, one for later. 

 

I'm assuming the process to swap PLMs hasn't changed.

Unplug everything.

Plug in PLM. Let it power up.

Plug in ISY. Let it power up.

Log in.

Restore PLM from ISY admin console.

Drink responsibly.

 

Can someone confirm?

Thanks again. 

Edited May 17, 2018 by jrf

[paulbates]

Here is the procedure

You need to keep in mind that the wireless devices need to be put in set mode, one at a time to update them to the new PLM address... the biggest PITA for this procedure. If you have the "Pro" ISY, there is an icon up top to tell it to defer updates to wireless devices... get all the wired/dualband things done first, then wireless... either bring them to a desk or go to them, depending on your preference.

You may want to see if you have a good backup from before the PLM problems. Sometimes the ISY captures the info from the PLM in its "confused" state when its dying. I would try it first with what you have active now, but if that doesn't work have the backup ready to restore to use that PLM links table

I keep a spare PLM too, you never know.

Paul

 

Edited May 17, 2018 by paulbates

[larryllix]

I would order a spare PLM later due to constant tech improvements.

Also you want to swap in the replacement so that you have a tested spare. Nothing worse than holding on to something for a few years only to find it is defective after the warranty is up and you are in desperate need at that moment.

[Brian H]

If the PLM is the single band 2412S. It normally supplied power to the ISY994i or older ISY99i.  So they would power up together.  The procedure is the same as you have pointed out.

Since the PLM  is not Dual Band. All your RF devices have to go through a Dual Band module and be passed on by power line. Maybe you have power line issues.

The new Dual Band PLM is the 2413S and does not supply power. So you would also need a wall wart power supply unless you have one that is in the ISY994i kit.

[larryllix]

15 minutes ago, Brian H said:

If the PLM is the single band 2412S. It normally supplied power to the ISY994i or older ISY99i.  So they would power up together.  The procedure is the same as you have pointed out.

Since the PLM  is not Dual Band. All your RF devices have to go through a Dual Band module and be passed on by power line. Maybe you have power line issues.

The new Dual Band PLM is the 2413S and does not supply power. So you would also need a wall wart power supply unless you have one that is in the ISY994i kit.

That kind of disproves any theory of the PLM going bad then. It seems to point fault back to the closet dual band device that was handling the RF conversion.

[tosterhouse]

OK I am having the exact same problem.

5.0.13 was working then no communication with anything wireless

purchased new PLM - Nope, this did not fix the issue

30 second reset on ISY and PLM, started from scratch, wireless works and event log level 3 shows communication.

Restore my ISY to the previous save and no wireless showing in level 3? Yet I can write changes to these devices???

I am proceeding with rebuilding everything.

 

Edited September 26, 2018 by tosterhouse

[Michel Kohanim]

@tosterhouse,

Replacing the PLM require restoring the PLM. Restoring a backup after you have restored a PLM requires another restoring of the PLM. In short, there is a one-to-one mapping between a PLM, ISY configuration for devices, and INSTEON devices. You cannot just replace one and hope that everything will work.

With kind regards,
Michel

[tosterhouse]

Thanks Michel but this is the process.

Reset ISY -

Restored ISY -

unplugged ISY

unplugged PLM,

held button while plugging in for 10 sec - 

Connected internet cable to plm and ISY

Turned on ISY restored plm

 

I will try again this evening