I made a mess of things...

[stealle]

I have a new ISY 994i Pro ZW/IR.  I only have 3 insteon switches installed and linked to the ISY 994i. Along with a z-wave thermostat/controller (American Standard Acculink Platinum 1050).

The thermostat is a z-wave controller.  ISY could not find it using the thermostats "Add" function but it did let me add it with its "Learn" function. I used the "Add" function on the ISY.

The z-wave thermostat was added to the ISY but in the admin console it is just there... no controls or data. In the dashboard it has a question mark by it.  In mobilinc, it calls it a "status only" device but doesn't show any real data from the thermostat. So, I did a right click/delete from the list on ISY (realize now that was a mistake, should have gone through the z-wave/remove function).  Then I tried to add the z-wave thermostat again, now the ISY will not let me add z-wave devices. I go to z-wave > add a z-wave device and nothing happens.  It wasn't trying to find z-wave devices.  I did z-wave > receive (learn mode) and the thermostat was found.  Problem is it is the same as before.  The thermostat seen in ISY but no kind of usable data or capability. 

At this point I attempted to remove the thermostat the proper way. Through Z-wave > remove devices.  Nothing happened.  It did not remove.  Then the real problem started.  I decided to restart the ISY.  I didn't see anything in the admin console to reboot so I unplugged it for about 30 seconds and plugged it back in.  Now all of the previous issues still exist but I have some new ones.  My 3 insteon switches have red exclamation marks next to them.  These switches don't respond to commands in the admin console any more. 

Please help...

[oberkc]

Is there a way, from the thermostat, to remove itself from the network?  If so, I would give that a shot.

what other devices are plugged into outlets near (or on the same circuit as) the PLM?

[lilyoyo1]

If your thermostat is your only zwave device, most likely you are having a range issue. For both insteon and zwave to work properly, you need to have a strong mesh network. I would add a couple of zwave repeating devices such as the aeotec range extender, smartswitch 6, or siren to help build out your network.

[stealle]

37 minutes ago, oberkc said:

Is there a way, from the thermostat, to remove itself from the network?  If so, I would give that a shot.

what other devices are plugged into outlets near (or on the same circuit as) the PLM?

Yes. I can remove the thermostat from the network. Then what?

I have the plm and isy plugged into the same outlet. That’s all. 

[stealle]

5 minutes ago, lilyoyo1 said:

If your thermostat is your only zwave device, most likely you are having a range issue. For both insteon and zwave to work properly, you need to have a strong mesh network. I would add a couple of zwave repeating devices such as the aeotec range extender, smartswitch 6, or siren to help build out your network.

Yes. The Zwave thermostat is currently the only device on the network. I do have 2 schlage deadbolts that I was attempting to add to the ISY but in its current state it isn’t even attempting to find them. The add function doesn’t seem to be working.  

[lilyoyo1]

3 hours ago, stealle said:

Yes. The Zwave thermostat is currently the only device on the network. I do have 2 schlage deadbolts that I was attempting to add to the ISY but in its current state it isn’t even attempting to find them. The add function doesn’t seem to be working.  

Battery operated devices do not repeat signals. It's working. Your devices just aren't in range to communicate with the Isy

[MWareman]

Sounds like you need more capable devices to securely repeat and issue the correct wake commands to your locks. I’ve never had success with using thermostats for that purpose.

Try the Aeotec gen5 repeater or Siren.

[oberkc]

9 hours ago, stealle said:

Yes. I can remove the thermostat from the network. Then what?

In my case, I recall having to remove a zwave device by doing so both from the ISY and from the device, itself.  Once removed in both places, it could then be re-added.  

Quote

I have the plm and isy plugged into the same outlet. That’s all

what about other outlets on the same circuit breaker?  I am wondering if you are having something interfere wih the inseteon communications over the powerline

[stealle]

On 7/20/2018 at 7:10 PM, lilyoyo1 said:

If your thermostat is your only zwave device, most likely you are having a range issue. For both insteon and zwave to work properly, you need to have a strong mesh network. I would add a couple of zwave repeating devices such as the aeotec range extender, smartswitch 6, or siren to help build out your network.

I don’t particularly need any more z-wave devices at the moment besides my 2 door locks and thermostat. So I’ll just buy whatever will do the best just of extending my range  Is this the best bang for my buck? Or should I be looking at something else?

Aeotec Range Extender 6, Z-Wave Plus repeater https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01M6CKJXC/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_1ArvBbN66FBSQ

The thermostat is advertised as a “controller.” I suppose the ISY is a controller as well.  Should the range extenders be added to both the ISY and the Thermostat? Or, should I only be adding all of my devices to the ISY?

 

[lilyoyo1]

2 hours ago, stealle said:

I don’t particularly need any more z-wave devices at the moment besides my 2 door locks and thermostat. So I’ll just buy whatever will do the best just of extending my range  Is this the best bang for my buck? Or should I be looking at something else?

Aeotec Range Extender 6, Z-Wave Plus repeater https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01M6CKJXC/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_1ArvBbN66FBSQ

The thermostat is advertised as a “controller.” I suppose the ISY is a controller as well.  Should the range extenders be added to both the ISY and the Thermostat? Or, should I only be adding all of my devices to the ISY?

 

That can work. I prefer adding devices that can serve dual purposes versus a device that has a singular use such as  a range extender. This serves 2 purposes. The first is that you're automating additional aspects of your life. This capability can be something as simply turning a lamp on or off to make it look like you are home when you are not. The second is that it is less likely to be unplugged. If someone sees a cord in a device they assume it is being used. If it is unplugged for some reason they will plug it back in when done. A blank wall wart on the other hand does nothing. Someone sees it, doesn't know what it is, unplugs it and moves on. Now your system doesnt work and you dont know why.

With all that said, I personally say add at least 1 more device than what you need. If you only add 1 and it doesn't work, you are still stuck in the troubleshooting headache for something that can/should be a simple enough project. Secondly should a device fail, you are more likely to minimize issues due to zwave's self healing capability. Automation is not something to cheap out on. There are places to save money but building a strong network is not one of them. Its a road to failure and frustration.

 

[asbril]

9 hours ago, stealle said:

I don’t particularly need any more z-wave devices at the moment besides my 2 door locks and thermostat. So I’ll just buy whatever will do the best just of extending my range  Is this the best bang for my buck? Or should I be looking at something else?

Aeotec Range Extender 6, Z-Wave Plus repeater https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01M6CKJXC/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_1ArvBbN66FBSQ

The thermostat is advertised as a “controller.” I suppose the ISY is a controller as well.  Should the range extenders be added to both the ISY and the Thermostat? Or, should I only be adding all of my devices to the ISY?

 

I fully agree with Lilyoyo1's assessment. For the same price as the Aeotec   extender you can get a plug-in module such as the Inoveli. This particular one (I like Inoveli products) is out of stock but there are other brands at similar prices. If you want tranquility of your Zwave mesh network, then add one or two devices.

[Jimbo.Automates]

On 7/20/2018 at 4:08 PM, stealle said:

I have a new ISY 994i Pro ZW/IR.  I only have 3 insteon switches installed and linked to the ISY 994i. Along with a z-wave thermostat/controller (American Standard Acculink Platinum 1050).

The thermostat is a z-wave controller.  ISY could not find it using the thermostats "Add" function but it did let me add it with its "Learn" function. I used the "Add" function on the ISY.

The z-wave thermostat was added to the ISY but in the admin console it is just there... no controls or data. In the dashboard it has a question mark by it.  In mobilinc, it calls it a "status only" device but doesn't show any real data from the thermostat. So, I did a right click/delete from the list on ISY (realize now that was a mistake, should have gone through the z-wave/remove function).  Then I tried to add the z-wave thermostat again, now the ISY will not let me add z-wave devices. I go to z-wave > add a z-wave device and nothing happens.  It wasn't trying to find z-wave devices.  I did z-wave > receive (learn mode) and the thermostat was found.  Problem is it is the same as before.  The thermostat seen in ISY but no kind of usable data or capability. 

At this point I attempted to remove the thermostat the proper way. Through Z-wave > remove devices.  Nothing happened.  It did not remove.  Then the real problem started.  I decided to restart the ISY.  I didn't see anything in the admin console to reboot so I unplugged it for about 30 seconds and plugged it back in.  Now all of the previous issues still exist but I have some new ones.  My 3 insteon switches have red exclamation marks next to them.  These switches don't respond to commands in the admin console any more. 

Please help...

Were you ever able to add your Acculink 1050 to the ISY?  I just had two installed as well and they are really nice for handling our new variable speed furnace and compressors, but I'd really like to gain control of them from the ISY.

[Jimbo.Automates]

The manual is here, and on page 29 it says the device can be used as a secondary or inclusion controller, but I can't figure out a way for the ISY to learn all devices from that controller? @Michel Kohanim or @Chris and ideas?  I've also reached out to their support but don't expect much help.

https://products.z-wavealliance.org/ProductManual/File?folder=&filename=Manuals/2056/AmStd_12-5062-01_final.pdf

I was able to add it like @stealle did, but it just shows up as a node with no control.

 

[lilyoyo1]

Looking at the manual it's not a simole thermostat but designed to be a central hub itslef. Being that it is a controller itself, most likely it can't be added to the isy. That's like trying to add another isy to your isy in order to control it. Potentially the isy could be a secondary controller to that (its own set of problems). 

In reading the manual, it may be locked to the Nexia system. 

[Techman]

You can't have both the ISY and the thermostat as primary Zwave controllers. Only the ISY should be the controller,

Not sure if the thermostat can be added only as a non-controller device. You may want to check with their support.

 

[Jimbo.Automates]

You can't have both the ISY and the thermostat as primary Zwave controllers. Only the ISY should be the controller,
Not sure if the thermostat can be added only as a non-controller device. You may want to check with their support.
 

As I mentioned, I hoped the nexia would allow making the ISY the primary controller but in my somewhat limited zwave knowledge, this doesn't seem possible. I have reached out to their support and asked on their forum as well.

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL with Tapatalk

[Techman]

Worst case scenario you could add it as a Wi-Fi device and use their app to control it. 

[Jimbo.Automates]

I can control all 7 thermostats just fine thru their app which is actually pretty nice. But automation is very minimal so of course I'd like to automate from the ISY a little.

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL with Tapatalk

[lilyoyo1]

1 hour ago, Jimbo said:

As I mentioned, I hoped the nexia would allow making the ISY the primary controller but in my somewhat limited zwave knowledge, this doesn't seem possible. I have reached out to their support and asked on their forum as well.

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL with Tapatalk
 

It's a controller itself so the isy can't control it. It can only be added as a secondary to speak to other devices. 

[Jimbo.Automates]

It's a controller itself so the isy can't control it. It can only be added as a secondary to speak to other devices. 

Yes, I understand. It contains their "bridge* which is the controller, that bridge is also sold as a separate device. As I mentioned, I hoped it could pass all the devices it controls to another primary. But looks like they don't allow that. I get it, but was hoping others could provide a clue if this was possible.

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL with Tapatalk

[BigMojo]

I’ve been all through this with American Standard/Trane.  The short answer is that their thermostats only act as a z-wave repeater.  Ingersoll (the parent company) wants to protect the income stream from the Nexia Service and decided to hobble their Z Wave functionality as a preventative measure.  I called them out specifically on their misleading marketing materials and lack of support all while waving the Premier Z Wave Alliance Member moniker. This of course was met with “Call your dealer” and complete refusal to address this issue.

In the end, I linked my free nexia account (thermostats only) to Alexa and let her drive my HVAC via scheduled automations, voice commands and routines. I haven’t played with setpoint changes driven by ISY variable changes via Alexa because I’ve got 3 HVAC systems (all AS/Trane) and I’d lose control over my optional air cleaners, Humidistat settings, etc.

I will say that they make a great variable speed system that saves us a solid 30% on our cooling costs. It’s a shame they won’t play nice in the Z Wave pool but the cost savings are too huge to pass up for the sake of my single point of control desire. Amazon wields a much bigger stick than we do and even they don’t get full control.  

What we really need is a hungry, well funded class action suit or State AG (franchise law & consumer protection violations) to slap them into shape for their fraudulent conduct.

Sorry you’re having these issues, use the free Nexia T Stat control and build up other areas that are low hanging fruit with high WAF & QOL returns.

[BigMojo]

Original Topic re American Standard / Trane

[Jimbo.Automates]

Thanks @BigMojo appreciate the response and details. Guess I'll start playing with then python lib that uses the undocumented API. My main need is to automate putting it in away mode when the ISY knows I'm away.

[Jimbo.Automates]

1 hour ago, BigMojo said:

Original Topic re American Standard / Trane

I tried emailing the address you mentioned in that thread but it bounced. I did ask thru there online support page so I'll see what they say, if they respond.

[lilyoyo1]

9 hours ago, BigMojo said:

What we really need is a hungry, well funded class action suit or State AG (franchise law & consumer protection violations) to slap them into shape for their fraudulent conduct.

Sorry you’re having these issues, use the free Nexia T Stat control and build up other areas that are low hanging fruit with high WAF & QOL returns.

What's fraudulent? Their manual states exactly what it can be used with and how. It does what it says it does. They make no other promises or claims to anything else