Hi there,

Just set up a new ISY with the z wave in it and it added my 4 insteon switches with no problems. I have a smart hub for my Schlage Connect lock and I'd like to get rid of the smart things hub/app and use the ISY (and hopefully agave as the phone app?)

I understand you have to remove THEN add so in the ISY I go to remove, but on the lock, the only information I have that sounds like that I should be doing is "enrolling on a z-wave network". I tried this with the smart things box plugged in and not and it makes no difference. I hit the schlage button, put in the 6 digit programming code and then hit 0 but it gives the X meaning in the lock was not enrolled/unenrolled.

Am I going about this wrong? The ISY is right next to the smart things hub so I wouldn't think there's a distance issue.

thanks!

@watson524 , As long as the exclude window was open in your ISY when you entered the information in your lock you should be good. That is the correct way to exclude a Schlage lock. You should now be able to add the lock to your ISY. 

29 minutes ago, dbuss said:

@watson524 , As long as the exclude window was open in your ISY when you entered the information in your lock you should be good. That is the correct way to exclude a Schlage lock. You should now be able to add the lock to your ISY. 

And then I should just be able to go to add/include and have that window open while I do the schlage button - admin code on lock - 0? I don't think that's working. It comes up with the red X on the lock and the ISY admin console just says listening

@watson524 Yes, with the add or exclude window open on the ISY, extend the bolt on the lock and then perform the following:

1. Press the Schlage logo button.

2. Enter your programming code.

3.Press 0

You should then get a check mark if the lock was included or excluded and an X if the attempt was unsuccessful.

I would exclude the lock from your Smart Things hub before trying to add it to your ISY.

 

Edited September 30, 20187 yr by dbuss

Sorry for being dumb about this but how do you exclude it from the smart things hub? I only have the app and don't seem to have anything in there to do that

 

@watson524

Here you go:

https://support.smartthings.com/hc/en-us/articles/115002058563-How-to-exclude-Z-Wave-devices-in-the-SmartThings-app

 

1 hour ago, dbuss said:

 

@watson524

Here you go:

https://support.smartthings.com/hc/en-us/articles/115002058563-How-to-exclude-Z-Wave-devices-in-the-SmartThings-app

 

They reference a "devices" tab that does not exist in my smart things phone app.... I did manage to find a Z Wave Utilities screen in the app and went into "general device exclusion" and hit "remove" where it said it'll put the device in exclusion mode so I hit that and it says "exclusion move active" but a circle spins in front like it's waiting and then there's a cancel button under it. But then back in the console, nothing happens when I either exclude of add. It just says listening. While it was in this exclusion mode on the phone, I also tried the master code + 0 on the lock and nothing changes.

@watson524 are you extending the deadbolt before trying to exclude or include?

Schlage locks usually include or exclude easily in the ISY as long as they are close enough to the ISY.

Yep deadbolt is extended. The ISY (and router and all) is probably about 40' away

I believe I got the thing excluded finally from the hub. I did a general device exclusion on the phone, punched in the code + 0 on the lot and got the check mark. So that's progress.

So now the hub should not be in the mix at all right? I have no "things" in the ST app on the phone now.

But if I go to the ISY admin console, and go to z wave add/include, it says listening, then I go put the code in, and it says "the z wave network failed to securely include your new device. Please exclude the device and try including it again." So I did the exclude on the ISY admin consol, and this time I got the green light after I put in the code. Then I did the add on the admin console, this time it found it and started to do things but then came back and said it failed to securely include your new device and try again.

Edited September 30, 20187 yr by watson524

15 minutes ago, watson524 said:

Yep deadbolt is extended. The ISY (and router and all) is probably about 40' away

@watson524 , The ISY is most likely too far away to add your lock. You will need to move your ISY closer to the lock or the lock closer to the ISY. They need to be very close, within a few feet to get the lock included. Once the lock is included you will be able to move them further apart.

Ok let me go get a longer Cat5 cable and report back.

Not quite sure what to make of this. This time, with the ISY sitting a the base of the door, so can't get any closer, it found it just fine and RIGHT after it found it it said "error not implemented" in red, then it just kept going. That box then just changed to all white with "error" in upper left, "X" in upper right and an "ok" button in the middle. 

That box won't go away but behind it the ISY admin console is reading the lock state and changes from locked to unlocked appropriately when we manually move the lock. There doesn't appear to be buttons to hit lock/unlock from the ISY so maybe that's part of the error? I did find that it's actually 3 of those white boxes on top of the one with the red error text so I had to close 3 of them to get back to the regular one

Appreciate all your help on this one!

Edited September 30, 20187 yr by watson524

@Watson, This is what you should see in your ISY.

Yep I only get the top part, the locked and battery number. Nothing below that. And now that I've put the ISY back where it belongs about 40' away, it can't communicate with it and keeps popping up the white box on top of white box.

@watson524 , Z-Wave is a mesh network. The more devices you have, the better the communications will be between devices. Keep in mind battery-powered devices don't repeat the Z-Wave signal. So, you will need devices such as switches, outlets, repeaters, etc. to improve your mesh network.

19 minutes ago, dbuss said:

So, you will need devices such as switches, outlets, repeaters, etc. to improve your mesh network.

Totally true. If you look for a quick and easy mesh improvement, then use plug-in devices such as the Inoveli or similar Zwave Plus plugin modules.

And keep in mind that with door locks you often need a repeater VERY close to the door itself.  Consider that the location and environment for z-wave door locks is very harsh -- first, the door lock itself, in order to be secure, needs to be made of fairly thick metal -- that'll block a lot of the RF signal.  Then, the door itself is often metal, or has a thick metal skin on one side.  Usually around the door one will find masonry, under the door is often concrete, and the lintel is often a metal angle iron to hold the weight.

The optimum location for a repeater will vary, but it's best to have one that is in front of the door, rather than plugged into an outlet on the wall adjacent to the door (the RF signal will have less trouble going through or down a hallway than going through a dense wall to get to the lock).

Finally, the z-wave board in the ISY does not communicate well.  I know that some disagree (including the UDI folks), but many of us have observed that a secure repeater has better coverage than does the ISY in the same exact physical spot.  I made sure to have a secure always-on device in the same room as the ISY to serve as a repeater (I used the external antenna before, but the new ISY z-wave dongle doesn't support that, so I now need another repeater - bummer... but still cheaper than all the useless Insteon filterLincs I need to keep my insteon devices working!)

 

48 minutes ago, dbuss said:

@watson524 , Z-Wave is a mesh network. The more devices you have, the better the communications will be between devices. Keep in mind battery-powered devices don't repeat the Z-Wave signal. So, you will need devices such as switches, outlets, repeaters, etc. to improve your mesh network.

Does it seem reasonable that it connects and sees it but doesn't allow control and keeps giving the "error" because of bad communications?

27 minutes ago, asbril said:

Totally true. If you look for a quick and easy mesh improvement, then use plug-in devices such as the Inoveli or similar Zwave Plus plugin modules.

Looks like I will order up a few of the NZW36s. I assume I don't need anything actually plugged into them just using them to help repeat the signal?

11 minutes ago, mwester said:

And keep in mind that with door locks you often need a repeater VERY close to the door itself.  Consider that the location and environment for z-wave door locks is very harsh -- first, the door lock itself, in order to be secure, needs to be made of fairly thick metal -- that'll block a lot of the RF signal.  Then, the door itself is often metal, or has a thick metal skin on one side.  Usually around the door one will find masonry, under the door is often concrete, and the lintel is often a metal angle iron to hold the weight.

The optimum location for a repeater will vary, but it's best to have one that is in front of the door, rather than plugged into an outlet on the wall adjacent to the door (the RF signal will have less trouble going through or down a hallway than going through a dense wall to get to the lock).

Finally, the z-wave board in the ISY does not communicate well.  I know that some disagree (including the UDI folks), but many of us have observed that a secure repeater has better coverage than does the ISY in the same exact physical spot.  I made sure to have a secure always-on device in the same room as the ISY to serve as a repeater (I used the external antenna before, but the new ISY z-wave dongle doesn't support that, so I now need another repeater - bummer... but still cheaper than all the useless Insteon filterLincs I need to keep my insteon devices working!)

Unfortunately, the only place between the door lock and ISY is next to the door about a foot away in an outlet and another outlet further down that hall. It's the front door of a foyer that is about 10' wide and 40' long. 

3 minutes ago, watson524 said:

 

 

Does it seem reasonable that it connects and sees it but doesn't allow control and keeps giving the "error" because of bad communications?

Yes

Looks like I will order up a few of the NZW36s. I assume I don't need anything actually plugged into them just using them to help repeat the signal?

They will repeat the signal without anything being plugged into them.

Unfortunately, the only place between the door lock and ISY is next to the door about a foot away in an outlet and another outlet further down that hall. It's the front door of a foyer that is about 10' wide and 40' long.

 

RF can be very unpredictable. There are instances that you think you will never get coverage and you do. Then there are those times that you think coverage should be no problem and it turns out to be a problem. About all, you can do is add devices until you get the coverage you want/need. 

Ok thanks for the insight. I've got two plug in units on the way to arrive Tuesday so I'll report back on this thread then.

Back to this one. I got two of the plug in units and I'm getting the same error with them that I did on the lock itself. I have the one I was starting with plugged in a foot away from the ISY (because it said I could move it after) and I put the ISY in exclude mode, hit the plug in button 3 - 5 times quickly, it excluded it. Then I put the ISY in include mode, hit the button 3 - 5 times, it finds it, but it detects it just fine and updates things but still says "error - not implemented" and shows this in the console, with nothing down below

I should add that it appears to add 2 things for the same plug in unit, a scene button and an on-off power switch. Not sure if that's normal.

I need to revisit this one since I never got it working and really need to. I started clean by excluding the plug in unit (I plugged it into an outlet about 2' from the ISY) and it took it off the list. I included it, did the button tap, it added it back as two line items (like above), and gave the not implemented error. When I then took into into a bedroom and plugged it into a wall with a lamp on it the lamp came on because the physical lamp switch is set to on since it was on a dumb timer and in the admin console, I do see the status as "on" but I have no way to control it. Even tho ultimately, I want to get the schlage lock in play here, I figured testing with a lamp was best first.

Anyone have any ideas?

1 hour ago, watson524 said:

I need to revisit this one since I never got it working and really need to. I started clean by excluding the plug in unit (I plugged it into an outlet about 2' from the ISY) and it took it off the list. I included it, did the button tap, it added it back as two line items (like above), and gave the not implemented error. When I then took into into a bedroom and plugged it into a wall with a lamp on it the lamp came on because the physical lamp switch is set to on since it was on a dumb timer and in the admin console, I do see the status as "on" but I have no way to control it. Even tho ultimately, I want to get the schlage lock in play here, I figured testing with a lamp was best first.

Anyone have any ideas?

When you included the device did it just add 1 node or were there others ? This node obviously does not work as there is no ON,OFF,QUERY (or more options) at the bottom.

I have seen this sometimes with extra nodes that came with another working node.

If not try to exclude and then include again.

Not sure what you mean? It adds the two items to the list, an on off power switch and a scene button (which has nothing in the right/big screen where the other one just has "on"

I did the exclude/include about 5 times and still get the same issue along with that "not implemented" error