System stopped responding

[astark]

All of a sudden my entire system stop responding. I have tried controlling from the admin console, app, and agave.  none of the 3 are responsive.  I checked my PLM and it connected and working fine.  I have restarted my ISY and my PLM.  None of the programs are running...I dont know what else it could be.  Can anyone lend some insight as to what it could be.?

Would restarting my router do anything?

[tmorse305]

From your description it sounds like you can log into the admin console.  When you do that do all of your programs appear there?  What happens if you try to turn on an insteon device, any error messages?  If you activate an insteon device directly does it's state change in the AC?

 

[astark]

12 hours ago, tmorse305 said:

From your description it sounds like you can log into the admin console.  When you do that do all of your programs appear there?  What happens if you try to turn on an insteon device, any error messages?  If you activate an insteon device directly does it's state change in the AC?

 

Yes programs appear.  no error messages when I try to turn on and offer dimmers. Lamp modules will give me the error "failed to communicate with"  

No,  The AC does not adjust if I manually turn a insteon device on and off.  Its really strange.

[Techman]

You have a communications issue between your PLM and your devices.  Could be either a failing PLM or the cable between the PLM and the ISY.

Is the green led on the PLM lit?

If you do a PLM link count from the admin console do you get any responses?

 

[MrBill]

if you have an ISY 994 what are the lights on the front of the ISY showing you?

[astark]

I have sent my PLM out for repair and all of the tests are coming back that everything is A-Ok.  I think the issue maybe from the ISY but all of my zwave devices are working without fail.  I have tried changing the cable between the PLM and the ISY and that hasnt solved my issue.  The gentleman who tested my PLM mentioned that he has heard similar issues to mine and  that it may be a java issue.  I do recall the latest java update on PC and perhaps that has an affect?  

[astark]

On 10/17/2022 at 3:39 PM, MrBill said:

if you have an ISY 994 what are the lights on the front of the ISY showing you?

only has lights flashing when I send a command.  

[astark]

On 10/17/2022 at 1:32 PM, Techman said:

You have a communications issue between your PLM and your devices.  Could be either a failing PLM or the cable between the PLM and the ISY.

Is the green led on the PLM lit?

If you do a PLM link count from the admin console do you get any responses?

 

The green light is illuminated.  I have tried switching out the cable.

How would link count from the admin console?

[tmorse305]

1 hour ago, astark said:

How would link count from the admin console?

[Geddy]

8 hours ago, astark said:

I do recall the latest java update on PC and perhaps that has an affect?  

What version Java are you running? Make sure it's just the current version of Java you can download when you visit java.com.  (Current version is: Version 8 Update 351 - Released 10/18)

You should clear you Java cache (make sure you select all three boxes in this process). Get a new download of the ISY Launcher (name recently changed to IoX Launcher), found on UDI's site. 

When you log into the Admin Console go to Help -> About and confirm that your Firmware and UI match EXACTLY (even date code should match). 

While in Admin Console make sure you don't get any warnings that you're in "safe mode" (meaning the PLM isn't connected). 

 

@MrBill asked you about the lights on the front of the ISY. Please refer to the wiki for meaning. 

https://wiki.universal-devices.com/index.php?title=Main_Page#Front_Panel_LEDs/Lights

If you don't have a steady (and very bright blue) power light then make sure you change the power supply. The type of power supply is covered in the wiki (and mentioned in lots of other posts on the forums - a recent one is here). 

 

8 hours ago, astark said:

I have tried changing the cable between the PLM and the ISY and that hasnt solved my issue.

What cable have you tried? Don't try any typical/standard network cable. It might cause problems. It has ends like a standard network cable, but only certain wires are used to carry signals between the PLM and ISY. 

 

Finally, don't just do a single link count. Those are often very inaccurate. If there is ANY traffic (switch activated, battery motion sensor, heartbeat signal) it will corrupt your link count. For that reason it's suggested to do it when nobody is home and/or when nobody else is awake. Take multiple counts. If you get a few that are the same you should be good. But, then...what do these link counts really tell you? What to you try to fix once you've done a (few) link count(s)? That's never part of the suggest when it's given. Who knows what your link count was before you had issues? How do you know if your link count is giving you an accurate number? And then what do you do next? I don't know...that's why I'm asking. 

 

 

[kclenden]

4 hours ago, Geddy said:

But, then...what do these link counts really tell you? What to you try to fix once you've done a (few) link count(s)? That's never part of the suggest when it's given. Who knows what your link count was before you had issues? How do you know if your link count is giving you an accurate number? And then what do you do next? I don't know...that's why I'm asking. 

There have been discussions about link counts which give some pretty detailed information.  As a summary, the count of links that are in the PLM can be a diagnostic tool because links are only created when you add Insteon devices to the ISY, or add devices to scenes.  They are only deleted when you remove Insteon devices from the ISY or deleted devices from scenes.  Knowing that:

• If you don't get a stable count of links in the PLM and you're not adding/deleting devices and/or scenes then the PLM is likely faulty
• If you don't have at least twice as many links in the PLM as Insteon devices added to the ISY, then something is likely wrong because whenever you add an Insteon device to the ISY, at least two links are created (one that says the PLM is a Controller, and one that says the PLM is a responder).  It's those links that allow the ISY to control devices and that allows devices to report their status back to the ISY.  If the device is more complex than a switch (say a Keypad) then more than two links are added when the device is added to the ISY.
• Generally you'll have more than twice as many links in the PLM as Insteon devices because every time you add a device to a scene, at least one more link is added to the PLM. 
• From the points above, you can generalize that you should see at least two links per Insteon device and two links per scene (because why create a scene if you don't want to control at least two devices).  If you have fewer than 2xDevices + 2xScenes links in the PLM then something is likely wrong.

What you do with the info depends:

• If the link count is 0, then you should try File->Restore Modem.  This will instruct the ISY to rewrite all the links in the PLM with the backup that it maintains.  Afterward, if the count is still 0 then the PLM is likely faulty.
• If the link count is more than 0, but less than 2xDevices + 2xScenes then you probably also want to try File->Restore Modem.
• If the link count is > 900 then your PLM is probably full.  Newly added device links might not be added correctly, or old ones might be wiped out.  You either need to delete Insteon devices from the ISY, reduce the number of scenes, or reduce the number of devices in the existing scenes.

Sometimes weird power happenings can cause the PLM Links table to become corrupted, and a Restore Modem has you back up and running just fine for a long time.  Other times, a corrupted PLM Links table means the PLM is failing and the Restore Modem only fixes things for a short time.

 

Edited November 12, 2022 by kclenden

[Brian H]

Restore Modem. Would also remove links marked as no longer used. So the database would be only the presently known links.

Not presently needed information. If you are still on the old 2412S power line only PLM. Later ones had a >2000 link database but anything over 800 links. Frequently had access time issues.

[MrBill]

13 hours ago, kclenden said:

If you don't get a stable count of links in the PLM and you're not adding/deleting devices and/or scenes then the PLM is likely faulty

It's important to realize that ANY Insteon traffic occurring during the link count will invalidate the link count.  This includes not only operating a switch, traffic generated by a program, etc but also traffic from wireless devices--including motion and heartbeat.

I have approaching 2 dozen wireless devices all sending heartbeat transmissions, if a single heartbeat occurs during the link count, the count is invalid.  Likewise for those with motion detectors, make sure those aren't seeing motion during the link count. 

To stop programs from running, a FALSE folder condition can be used on the root folder usually called "My Programs".   I happen to have Integer variables name $cTrue and $cFalse, so the folder condition I use is

IF
     $cTrue is $cFalse

which should never be true.  (Remember to click Save Changes, and remember to undo it and Save Changes again when finished counting links).

 

Nothing will stop, motion or heartbeats traffic tho, so it becomes necessary to verify the link count by completing it several times.

[astark]

I finally got the PLM back from the repair guy and he said that everything tested perfect. 

1.  I have reinstalled it into my system
2.  I have restored the PLM
3. PLM is connected when I check on the admin panel
4.  I ran a PLM link test and only received 2 links
5.  My UI and my Firmware match exactly
6.  Java is fully updated


I am at the point where i would be happy to pay someone to assist with getting my system back online.  The amount of time I have spent on this so far has been extremely unproductive.  

 

 

  

Edited November 27, 2022 by astark

[astark]

My restore process is taking forever.  It keeps showing that that system is busy.  The progress bar keeps restarting after its completed.

[astark]

9 minutes ago, astark said:

My restore process is taking forever.  It keeps showing that that system is busy.  The progress bar keeps restarting after its completed.

[tmorse305]

I had the same problem once after an upgrade.  It turned out the Insteon support got unchecked.

I have IoP not a 994 so not sure if they're the same.  Does your 994 have a solid blue light on?

 

[astark]

I have a 994 and that setting doesnt exsist.  I dont have any light illuminated on the front of my ISY which is normal unless I send a command then the TX/RX lights will flash.  

[tmorse305]

From a previous post:

 

@MrBill asked you about the lights on the front of the ISY. Please refer to the wiki for meaning. 

https://wiki.universal-devices.com/index.php?title=Main_Page#Front_Panel_LEDs/Lights

If you don't have a steady (and very bright blue) power light then make sure you change the power supply. The type of power supply is covered in the wiki (and mentioned in lots of other posts on the forums - a recent one is here). 

[astark]

I tried deleting a device and readding it.  Guess what it worked...Im not thrilled that I have to re-add every device but at least i can my system up and running again.  

[tmorse305]

If the power light (blue) is not on that is not normal.  You have a 994 power supply problem.  I would fix that before you make the effort to delete and re-add everything

Edited November 27, 2022 by tmorse305

[astark]

I deleted and readded one device and all of sudden everything is working again.  No idea why this happened but glad to have it back!

[Geddy]

@astark great that you're up and running again, but you keep ignoring the question about the light. From what you're saying there's no brighter than the sun blue light on all the time. If that's the case you have a power supply issue (or simply that the connection for that light has gone bad). You should still look to fix your issue rather than just thinking that if you always remove a device and re-add it that will work. That's never a "solution" to the problem. 

Also, do you have any battery devices? Perhaps you should turn off write to battery devices before trying the restore process. If you have the ISY994 Pro (note: Pro is a purchasable update from UDI) you should have a battery icon in the toolbar that looks like this:   

Click that to make it gray and it might have helped your issue. I don't have any battery devices so can't test, but would think that perhaps if you were doing a PLM Restore or other major restore the reason it was taking so long was trying to write to battery devices that weren't awake or in linking mode. 

Once the restore is done then you restore each battery device by right clicking on that device and click "restore device". 

But, as you say...you're happy...I just think you haven't really resolved your issue, but glad you're happy and up and running again. 

 

 

[Brian H]

Since we have seen others with power supply issues. Corrected with a replacement supply. No or very dim Blue Power On LED could be a failing supply.