Clarification: For IoX 5.4.5, does backup/restore include the Zwave network when using Zooz ZST10 700?

[wmcneil]

For IoX 5.4.5, does backup/restore include Zooz ZST10 700? (Please do not answer unless you are certain of your reply. "I think so", "I hope so", etc. are not useful. Ideally someone from UD can reply with 100% certainty.)

This part of the "IoX Release v5.5.0 Is Now Available" directions implies that ZWave is included, but I want to be absolutely certain:

• When IoX restarts, all existing Z-Wave nodes from the old installation are removed
  • Note: The only way to go back is to restore a backup that was made prior to moving to ZMatter Z-Wave+

OR

Does the snippet above imply that ZWave backup/restore for Zooz ZST10 700 is present only starting with IoX 5.5.0, BUT will be available only prior to pressing the Move to ZMatter Z-Wave button?

Edited December 15, 2022 by wmcneil
further clarification

[asbril]

26 minutes ago, wmcneil said:

For IoX 5.4.5, does backup/restore include Zooz ZST10 700? (Please do not answer unless you are certain of your reply. "I think so", "I hope so", etc. are not useful. Ideally someone from UD can reply with 100% certainty.)

This part of the "IoX Release v5.5.0 Is Now Available" directions implies that ZWave is included, but I want to be absolutely certain:

• When IoX restarts, all existing Z-Wave nodes from the old installation are removed
  • Note: The only way to go back is to restore a backup that was made prior to moving to ZMatter Z-Wave+

OR

Does the snippet above imply that ZWave backup/restore for Zooz ZST10 700 is present only starting with IoX 5.5.0, BUT will be available only prior to pressing the Move to ZMatter Z-Wave button?

I am also confused. In my Administrative Console (I am on 5.4.5) I have  FILE-BACKUP ISY and not IOX.

When all Zwave devices disappear after the firmware upgrade to 5.5, it is sufficient to do a RESTORE of my lalest Backup (understanding the Routing issue)  ?

Most likely I am going to wait with upgrade and migration till I receive my eisy and also waiting for clarity in this forum of the experience of others.

Edited December 15, 2022 by asbril

[brians]

I am sure that it does not backup/restore the Zooz stick.

There is currently no migration path from any current Z-Wave (500 series, Zooz) to ZMatter due to a bug in the ZMatter firmware; this has been posted and discussed many times and is reason for the delay of the 5.5.0.

This 5.5.0 version currently released is ONLY for doing a fresh setup with Z-Wave for those who want to use ZMatter's new Z-Wave features now and do not care about the Z-Wave migration (ie. those with small Z-Wave networks, or none at all).

If you want to use continue to use your existing Z-Wave network then stay away from this firmware until they release one that supports migration. We will all hear when this happens.

@asbrilthe reason I speculate why all the Z-Wave nodes disappear after clicking Move To Z-Wave button (not by simply loading the firmware) is because this firmware does not support migration. During this process, all the old Z-Wave are removed/cleaned... maybe due to the way the new Z-Wave code is written vs the old regarding how nodes are stored in IoX causing incompatibility, and also simply to just remove them to avoid confusion and/or expectation that they should work afterwards.

The "Backup ISY" is probably something they forgot to change when they changed name from ISY to IoX, and may be already changed in 5.5.0

 

 

 

[asbril]

2 minutes ago, brians said:

I am sure that it does not backup/restore the Zooz stick.

There is currently no migration path from any current Z-Wave (500 series, Zooz) to ZMatter due to a bug in the ZMatter firmware; this has been posted and discussed many times and is reason for the delay of the 5.5.0.

This 5.5.0 version currently released is ONLY for doing a fresh setup with Z-Wave for those who want to use ZMatter's new Z-Wave features now and do not care about the Z-Wave migration (ie. those with small Z-Wave networks, or none at all).

If you want to use continue to use your existing Z-Wave network then stay away from this firmware until they release one that supports migration. We will all hear when this happens.

@asbrilthe reason I speculate why all the Z-Wave nodes disappear after clicking Move To Z-Wave button (not by simply loading the firmware) is because this firmware does not support migration. During this process, all the old Z-Wave are removed/cleaned... maybe due to the way the new Z-Wave code is written vs the old regarding how nodes are stored in IoX causing incompatibility, and also simply to just remove them to avoid confusion and/or expectation that they should work afterwards.

The "Backup ISY" is probably something they forgot to change when they changed name from ISY to IoX, and may be already changed in 5.5.0

 

 

 

Thanks so much.  I am waiting till I  receive the ordered eisy AND when there is clarity on the migration.

I still don't understand why some have backup iox and others do not, but at this point it does not matter (pun not intended  )

[jec6613]

10 hours ago, brians said:

The "Backup ISY" is probably something they forgot to change when they changed name from ISY to IoX, and may be already changed in 5.5.0

It's not changed in 5.5.0, and probably won't change if at all.  IoX = "ISY on Anything", it's a change from IoP = "ISY on Polisy" to accommodate the eisy | home box they've started selling.  ISY is still in the name

[wmcneil]

@brians , I understand that the current v5.5.0 release is not working as intended with ZMatter. I also understand that one of the things that is not currently working is migration from Zooz to ZMatter. I have read everything that anyone has posted with regard to ZMatter in the last several days, and my questions are still valid.  I want to know what UD intends when things are working, and I want to know for certain. I have had to rebuild my Zwave network from scratch once in the past month, and I do not intend to have to do it again, so I want to know exactly how UD intends that backup is going to work.  I will attempt to further clarify what I originally asked:

@Michel KohanimDoes UD intend to provide a backup and restore capability for Zooz ZST10 700, independent of the migration path from Zooz to ZMatter? If YES, in what version of IoX is this capability planned to first be present? If NO, that implies that only a 1 way migration path from Zooz ZST10 700 to ZMatter will be supported, correct?

 

 

[btreinders]

I would like know as well since I have over 40 zwave devices and rebuilding all the programs and scenes they are part would be awful.

[brians]

@wmcneil

You can backup the Zooz stick using methods I have discussed in the 700 forum using a PC.

During the Move to ZMatter process, you would have pulled the Zooz stick prior to pressing move to ZMatter button. At that point the info on the Zooz stick stays intact. You could theoretically reload a the backup you made back onto IoX, prior to pressing move to ZMatter Polisy/IoX, then plugin the Zooz stick and everything should work as before.

 

 

[asbril]

1 hour ago, brians said:

@wmcneil

You can backup the Zooz stick using methods I have discussed in the 700 forum using a PC.

During the Move to ZMatter process, you would have pulled the Zooz stick prior to pressing move to ZMatter button. At that point the info on the Zooz stick stays intact. You could theoretically reload a the backup you made back onto IoX, prior to pressing move to ZMatter Polisy/IoX, then plugin the Zooz stick and everything should work as before.

 

 

I wish I'd understand

 

[wmcneil]

On 12/16/2022 at 1:42 PM, brians said:

@wmcneil

You can backup the Zooz stick using methods I have discussed in the 700 forum using a PC.

During the Move to ZMatter process, you would have pulled the Zooz stick prior to pressing move to ZMatter button. At that point the info on the Zooz stick stays intact. You could theoretically reload a the backup you made back onto IoX, prior to pressing move to ZMatter Polisy/IoX, then plugin the Zooz stick and everything should work as before.

 

 

I've been waiting for Michel or someone else at UD to respond and answer my question. I know they are busy with IoX 5.5.0 migration plans, but I am asking something that I think is something important that others would like clarification on, so In the interest of potentially helping others, I will comment with some further information while we wait for the official word.

The Zooz ZST10 700 has never had a backup/restore capability provided by the Admin Console (AC). An AC backup/restore feature was present up to and including the 500 Zwave option, so this is a feature that was lost when moving to Polisy and the Zooz stick. There is Windows software that Silicon Labs provides called Simplicity Studio which has a backup and restore function for the Zooz. This is the method brians is referring to above. Simplicity Studio is a large software package that has a lot of functionality in addition to the backup and restore.  It is neither lightweight nor simple to use, but with a little persistence it can be installed and learned.

Once UD has the ZMatter migration software perfected, it will be possible to directly backup from Zooz and restore to ZMatter. My previously stated question was asking if there will also be a backup from Zooz and restore to Zooz available.  My guess is that the answer is no. That being the case, if you want the protection of having a Zooz backup you have to use Simplicity Studio. The reason you would want a Zooz backup is to protect against either the Zooz stick failing before you attempt migration to ZMatter, or a worst case scenario of something going wrong with the migration process that corrupts the Zooz stick (before you unplug it for the final time).

I had a Zooz stick fail after only 7 months, and from what I read elsewhere, I'm not the only one that has had an early life failure.

 

[lilyoyo1]

On 12/16/2022 at 8:02 AM, wmcneil said:

@brians , I understand that the current v5.5.0 release is not working as intended with ZMatter. I also understand that one of the things that is not currently working is migration from Zooz to ZMatter. I have read everything that anyone has posted with regard to ZMatter in the last several days, and my questions are still valid.  I want to know what UD intends when things are working, and I want to know for certain. I have had to rebuild my Zwave network from scratch once in the past month, and I do not intend to have to do it again, so I want to know exactly how UD intends that backup is going to work.  I will attempt to further clarify what I originally asked:

@Michel KohanimDoes UD intend to provide a backup and restore capability for Zooz ZST10 700, independent of the migration path from Zooz to ZMatter? If YES, in what version of IoX is this capability planned to first be present? If NO, that implies that only a 1 way migration path from Zooz ZST10 700 to ZMatter will be supported, correct?

 

 

I know in the past that Michel stated no more upgrades would be coming when it comes to using the zooz sticks. What we have now is what we'll have later.