All Node Servers "Unmanged" after Polisy->eISY migration attempt

[JTsao]

I followed the Wiki instructions very carefully but cannot get any node servers to work - they appear to be in the original slots, but all report as unmanaged with "no details available" - tried multiple reboots and re-starts of PG3x - any suggestions?

Edited February 4, 2023 by JTsao
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[DennisC]

4 minutes ago, JTsao said:

I followed the Wiki instructions very carefully but cannot get any node servers to work - they appear to be in the original slots, but all report as unmanaged with "no details available" - tried multiple reboots and re-starts of PG3x - any suggestions?

Have you migrated your licenses? If so, I believe you need to go to Purchases Tab and reinstall one at a time in to the same slot. Select the "Re-install" button on that tab.

[bpwwer]

What instructions did you follow?

"Unmanaged" means that the node server config exists on the IoX but the config points to a different instance of PG3(x). 

If you simply restored a Polisy backup on the eisy, this would be the result.  It would restore the Polisy's node server config so all the node server configs would be pointing back to the Polisy's PG3 and would still be considered managed by the Polisy's PG3 instance.

To migrate the node servers, you need to backup PG3 on the Polisy and then use PG3x's migrate from PG3 backup button to migrate the PG3 backup and convert it to PG3x format and change the node server configs to point to PG3x.

[gzahar]

16 minutes ago, JTsao said:

I followed the Wiki instructions very carefully but cannot get any node servers to work - they appear to be in the original slots, but all report as unmanaged with "no details available" - tried multiple reboots and re-starts of PG3x - any suggestions?

Did you delete the node servers from Polisy or power down?  If they are still running there and pointing to the same IoX as eisy this would happen.  Go into IoX node server menu, and select 'configure' then any node server and see where it is pointing (IP address).

[DennisC]

This is the link to latest migration directions, updated yesterday:

https://wiki.universal-devices.com/index.php?title=Eisy:User_Guide#Migration

 

[JTsao]

All - thanks for the replies - I migrated the licenses, I did the "migrate from PG3", and I powered down the Polisy before I started the migration process - so far it appears that I have to re-install node servers in the same slots one at a time, and then re-configure them... I have got Rachio and Weatherbit working now - I was hoping that this would not be necessary, but it isn't terrible - not sure if I'll have to re-edit all of the programs using the node servers, though...

 

[bpwwer]

11 minutes ago, DennisC said:

This is the link to latest migration directions, updated yesterday:

https://wiki.universal-devices.com/index.php?title=Eisy:User_Guide#Migration

 

Those are instructions for migrating from a i994 to either Polisy or eisy.  Not instructions for migrating from Polisy to eisy. while some the steps may be the same, it doesn't really cover the PG3 to PG3x migration steps I specified above.

[JTsao]

OK - to be honest, I didn't completely understand what you meant, but I am trying to digest -

"To migrate the node servers, you need to (1) backup PG3 on the Polisy and then (2) use PG3x's migrate from PG3 backup button to migrate the PG3 backup and (3) convert it to PG3x format and (4) change the node server configs to point to PG3x."

I'm pretty sure that I did (1) and (2) but can you elaborate on (3) and (4)?

EDIT: OK I found what gzahar mentioned and had to change all IP references to the eISY's new IP address in IoX admin panel node servers->Configure - so that's obviously been a problem - should I re-do the migration again to more quickly get everything working?

 

Edited February 4, 2023 by JTsao

[bpwwer]

3 and 4 happen are what PG3x does to migrate the node servers over.

The PG3x backup/restore screen has two options for restore:

1) Restore Backup

2) Migrate from PG3 Backup

Using #1 won't do anything with a PG3 backup since the backup formats are different between PG3 and PG3x.

Using #2 looks at each node server in the PG3 backup and one-by-one migrates to the PG3x, you should see status updates on the PG3x screen as this happens.  It's not quick, as I was testing with 30 node servers or so, I would walk way and come back later since it can take a minute for each node server.

When the migration is complete, the node servers should not be "unmanaged" state. 

It won't hurt anything to the do the migration again.  It doesn't really care what the current state on PG3x is, it will start clean and migrate from the PG3 backup.

[gzahar]

OK - to be honest, I didn't completely understand what you meant, but I am trying to digest -
"To migrate the node servers, you need to (1) backup PG3 on the Polisy and then (2) use PG3x's migrate from PG3 backup button to migrate the PG3 backup and (3) convert it to PG3x format and (4) change the node server configs to point to PG3x."
I'm pretty sure that I did (1) and (2) but can you elaborate on (3) and (4)?
EDIT: OK I found what gzahar mentioned and had to change all IP references to the eISY's new IP address in IoX admin panel node servers->Configure - so that's obviously been a problem - should I re-do the migration again to more quickly get everything working?
 

I’m not suggesting you edit the IP address in IoX. Just saying you can confirm it still thinks Polisy is managing the node server. Not sure if changing the IP address there would work or not? As Bob says, it is probably better to restore or re-install each node server. When I went from PG2 to PG3 most of the nodes kept the same name, so program edits were minor. From PG3 to 3x I doubt you would have any.

[DennisC]

53 minutes ago, bpwwer said:

Those are instructions for migrating from a i994 to either Polisy or eisy.  Not instructions for migrating from Polisy to eisy. while some the steps may be the same, it doesn't really cover the PG3 to PG3x migration steps I specified above.

It appears in the link I provided, the migration directions from i994, Polisy, and eisy have been combined in to one document. If you follow the link and scroll down, each topic is divided in to separate sections for i994, Polisy, and eisy. 

There appears to be only one migration document in the wiki now.

I was only able to find one section dealing with Migrating PG3x. It's what I followed yesterday and it worked without issue.

Migrating Node Servers to PG3x

Migration is only possible with version 3.1.17 or later of PG3x. The version of PG3x that ships with eisy is currently 3.1.16 which does not support migration. Please upgrade packages first and make sure you are running version 3.1.17 of PG3x before attempting to migrate.

1. Backup PG3 on Polisy.
2. Restore from PG3 backup on eisy using the "Migrate from PG3 Backup" option.

Cautions:

• Node servers currently installed on eisy will be removed (and possibly replaced).
• Node servers migrated are left in the "stopped" state. You will need to manually start each one after migration.
• If the Polisy was configured to manage node servers on more than one IoX (say both Polisy IoP and i994) only one IoX will be migrated and you can't choose which one it will migrate.
• Node servers installed on the Polisy from the local node server store will likely fail to install on the eisy.
• Node server licenses should be migrated as part of the Portal migration step.

[JTsao]

I am at the point where all node servers should be working, but I am seeing the node server "already started" issue appearing in slots 1 and 2 consistently and other slots randomly with each reboot - I am starting to regret attempting this today...

[bpwwer]

27 minutes ago, JTsao said:

I am at the point where all node servers should be working, but I am seeing the node server "already started" issue appearing in slots 1 and 2 consistently and other slots randomly with each reboot - I am starting to regret attempting this today...

Known issue with IoX 5.5.5 and PG3x, it's being worked on, but no work-around yet.

[mbking]

@bpwwer, I enabled PG3x on Polisy before creating a backup to use with my new eisy, so I did not create a migration backup, I created a standard backup file.  I've moved licenses and restored the PG3x backup from Polisy to eisy.  I've rebooted PG3x on eisy and node servers are displayed, but unmanaged at the moment.  What should my next steps be to get the node servers working again?

I checked the node server configurations in eisy IoX and they are still configured for Polisy IoX.  Should I change the IP and UUID to match eisy?  Never done that, so I'd like to hear what you think before proceeding.

Update: I ultimately re-installed the node servers and everything is normal now.  But I'm curious why a PG3x backup from Polisy didn't completely restore on a new Eisy with PG3x.

Thanks.

Edited May 27, 2023 by mbking
More detail

[DennisC]

Sounds like this step was missed from the instructions:

Restore from PG3 backup on eisy using the "Migrate from PG3 Backup" option.

[mbking]

2 hours ago, DennisC said:

Sounds like this step was missed from the instructions:

Restore from PG3 backup on eisy using the "Migrate from PG3 Backup" option.

PG3 on my Polisy Pro had already been migrated to PG3x, so there was nothing to migrate. I don’t think my scenario is covered by the instructions. I’m hoping Bob can shed some light on that. 

[DennisC]

4 hours ago, mbking said:

PG3 on my Polisy Pro had already been migrated to PG3x, so there was nothing to migrate. I don’t think my scenario is covered by the instructions. I’m hoping Bob can shed some light on that. 

I believe a post at the bottom of this thread by bpwwer provides the best possible explanation:

I'm not sure what that link does. My assumption is that it sets a variable telling the Polisy that it should install PG3x instead of PG3 when doing updates. It should also remove PG3 and install PG3x. and then restart everthing.

When PG3x first starts, it will check to see if it needs to migrate the database/node servers from PG3 to PG3x and will then proceed to do that. Depending on how many node servers are installed, this can take some time. It should send notices to the PG3x UI for each node server it migrates. Expect at least 30 seconds to 1 minute for each node server.

If you interrupt this process you'll probably end up with some node servers migrated and some not so don't be in a rush, take your time.

It also logs the migration progress in the PG3x log file so if something does go wrong, downloading the PG3x log and attaching that to any support request (ticket or forum/PM).

I believe it does not try to start the node servers after it migrates them so they should all be in the disconnected state and you have to manually start each one.  

The migration should not effect any configuration or existing nodes.

My testing involved migrating 30+ node servers multiple times (so yes, it takes quite a while to run) and I didn't see any issues, but I can't account for all the different environments and combinations of node servers.

There's no easy way to go back to PG3. In theory, the variable can be cleared, PG3 can be re-installed and restored from a PG3 backup and it should work. There's probably some other stuff that PG3x did that will need to be cleaned up, but it should work. This hasn't been tested so for now, best to consider it a one-way migration.

If you try https://polisy.local:8443/rest/pg3x.enable and it doesn't work, please submit a support ticket.  

 

[bpwwer]

23 hours ago, mbking said:

@bpwwer, I enabled PG3x on Polisy before creating a backup to use with my new eisy, so I did not create a migration backup, I created a standard backup file.  I've moved licenses and restored the PG3x backup from Polisy to eisy.  I've rebooted PG3x on eisy and node servers are displayed, but unmanaged at the moment.  What should my next steps be to get the node servers working again?

I checked the node server configurations in eisy IoX and they are still configured for Polisy IoX.  Should I change the IP and UUID to match eisy?  Never done that, so I'd like to hear what you think before proceeding.

Update: I ultimately re-installed the node servers and everything is normal now.  But I'm curious why a PG3x backup from Polisy didn't completely restore on a new Eisy with PG3x.

Thanks.

The PG3 (and PG3x) backup/restore process was never meant to migrate.  Hence the need for a specific migrate from PG3 process.

The backup/restore process assumes that the IoX (or really the ISY994) wouldn't change between a backup and restore as it was all developed when only ISY994 existed.

I think the only way forward is to re-install each node server and re-configure them.   You can re-install to the same slot over the unmanaged entries.  

[mbking]

41 minutes ago, bpwwer said:

The PG3 (and PG3x) backup/restore process was never meant to migrate.  Hence the need for a specific migrate from PG3 process.

The backup/restore process assumes that the IoX (or really the ISY994) wouldn't change between a backup and restore as it was all developed when only ISY994 existed.

I think the only way forward is to re-install each node server and re-configure them.   You can re-install to the same slot over the unmanaged entries.  

Thanks @bpwwer, that’s what I finally did and all went well except I had to remember some of the special settings needed for some. Strain on the brain, but I remembered correctly. My biggest concern was having to redo some of my favorites in UD Mobile if any node server references changed on the re-install. Fortunately, that didn’t happen. 
 

I was just thinking about what someone would do if they were replacing a failed eisy and trying to restore from their PG3x backup. With the current process, I think they’ll have to do what I did. 

Since moving to PG3x, I have seen some random connect notices in UD Mobile for all my node servers at once. I’ll post the details in a separate topic. 
 

Thanks for getting back with me. 

Edited May 28, 2023 by mbking

[bpwwer]

@mbking I realized that hardware replacement would cause issues while answering your post so I added that to the issue list.

If all node servers are disconnecting/reconnecting at once, that most likely means that PG3 restarted.  

There's another thread (I think the support thread) where this was reported by someone else. In their case it looks like the network connection between PG3 and the broker failed (reason unknown) which is a fatal error in PG3.

[JTsao]

Well, 5 months later and attempting to migrate again and ended up back here - all node servers unmanaged - I have tried to restore the pre-migration eISY PG3x backup (which has no node servers) and when I do, for a while there are no node servers, then the unmanaged 11 node servers come back - is there another way to wipe PG3x clean and re-start from scratch?

Edited July 22, 2023 by JTsao

[DennisC]

1 hour ago, JTsao said:

Well, 5 months later and attempting to migrate again and ended up back here - all node servers unmanaged - I have tried to restore the pre-migration eISY PG3x backup (which has no node servers) and when I do, for a while there are no node servers, then the unmanaged 11 node servers come back - is there another way to wipe PG3x clean and re-start from scratch?

Were you on PG2 previously?

Did you migrate your node server's according to the wiki?

Do the node server's show up as purchased in PG3x under the Purchased tab?

I believe unmanaged typically means PG3x doesn't know about them, but they are listed in your Polisy/eisy.

You can delete them in the admin console under Node Server tab. After a short delay, the unmanaged node server's will disappear from PG3x. You would then need to reinstall them from PG3x.

If your purchased node server's don't show up to reinstall, you will need to send the uuid of the before and after Universal Devices controller in a support ticket to UD and ask them to move them over to your new device.

[Geddy]

Looks like you started a new thread about this that has you going down a path to solution. Locking this one so you’re not getting help on the same issue in two places.