Is ISY/Polisy/eisy/UDI dying?

[jkraus]

 

Ok, so maybe an exaggerated title, but…

·        I got an isy in 2008.  Loved it to use with many Insteon devices.  Then  Insteon went belly up, now back but questionable future IMHO, and devices are expensive

·        …so what is the replacement?

·        Zwave needs so many repeaters, how many unused socket in my house do I need to put an “ugly” repeater in to get a good mesh?  Maybe Zwave LR will solve, but that is our in the future…and more devices??

·        Kasa is questionable, can’t seem to ever get the NS correct, constantly in flux, no way currently that I know of to add new device

·        Yolink works great and long range, but limited devices and need an additional hub

·        My system is getting to just be a mishmash  of devices, how does one just do a simple HA without becoming a master in all these device, and cost??

On the positive side, the UDI support is great as always, but would maybe help if there was a good solid solution for HA

…am I being too critical??

Edited Wednesday at 05:04 PM by jkraus

[paulbates]

• Insteon remains a sold solution - If you want switches that work fast in scenes and continue to function in virtual n-way circuits when the controller (PLM) dies
• ISY, by design is, meant to integrate a variety of different technologies
• Like other competitors that do the same, they rely on community developers
• UDI does not rush things out the door
• UDI just announced numerous new releases for Jan 2025 on the way
• All of the alternatives have their own, different type, Achilles heels

At the risk of speaking for UDI, eisy is what it is. If its right for you, stay... if not, find something else. You need to decide what's right for you.

The pace of release is based on stable, reliable product.

Edited Wednesday at 05:30 PM by paulbates

[Guy Lavoie]

- A product that stops getting updates is a dying product. As Paul just mentioned, the eisy is getting a well anticipated update just next month. That's a good sign.

- Not being vendor specific allows the eisy to evolve with whatever promising new standard comes out. No single platform seems to have emerged yet as a defacto standard. As your own post says, they all have their merits. Maybe that's not such a bad thing. Some seem to be good for low power, low bandwidth applications, others for versatility (eg: scenes in Insteon) I just switched from X10 to Insteon, and I'm quite happy with the performance. I also bought everything used, keeping costs down significantly. 

- Currently, voice control is a big thing, and acts as a unifier in some ways (how many products can you count that say "works with Alexa"?).

- Matter, is it the next big thing? Well, UDI will be supporting it, so they're staying ahead of the curve. Only time will tell. The use of wifi in products will only be growing, and the Thread component of Matter is basically adapting wifi for use with home automation devices.

 

I think that the attraction of the UDI controller for us is the programmability and expandability (with plugins). It's not a simple consumer product, just like Visual Studio isn't for the casual computer user. If you're getting a controller like the eisy, it's because you already know what you want to to with it. I find it to be a very good single-box solution for people who want full programmability, without getting into hand editing drivers, config files, etc.

[vbPhil]

I’d be happy with a rock solid Insteon hub to use with HA. Long for the days of the ISY. For me, UDI should remake a simple ISY in addition to eisy. When my Polisy dies I may go with the Insteon Hub  2 or whatever version is the latest. 

[Guy Lavoie]

2 hours ago, vbPhil said:

 When my Polisy dies I may go with the Insteon Hub  2 or whatever version is the latest. 

Why? Too much to maintain? Does having local control have value for you? With an Insteon hub, you'd only have Insteon capability, which might be ok if that's all you need.

[oberkc]

7 hours ago, vbPhil said:

I may go with the Insteon Hub

When SmartHome shut down, and before selling the Insteon business, the hubs became inoperative because the cloud servers were shut down.  I recall the reaction from so many that had Insteon hubs and I doubt they would ever again go back.   I would consider this a major downside to relying on the Insteon hub and would not do it.  Refresh my memory: is there an annual fee to use the hub?

Edited yesterday at 02:39 AM by oberkc

[paulbates]

There's translation needed here. Some ISY users are moving to the HA (home assistant) platform. Insteon is not a core product feature of the HA (home assistant) platform, and Insteon support is not native like it is with the ISY. HA has the equivalent of an eisy plugin to support Insteon. Nothing against plugins. I own a number of them. But plugin authors have "day jobs" and in this case can't buy/integrate/test every Insteon device as UDI has done with the ISY.

When it comes to Insteon integration, the ISY/eISY is the deep end of the pool. Choosing to migrate to other platforms means you either lose some Insteon capability , and/or you use the equivalent of a plugin to integrate the ISY into HA, or look at adding the Insteon hub to attempt to get the full capability back.

[lilyoyo1]

On 12/25/2024 at 12:02 PM, jkraus said:

I got an isy in 2008.  Loved it to use with many Insteon devices.  Then  Insteon went belly up, now back but questionable future IMHO, and devices are expensive

·        …so what is the replacement?

I think the replacement would be determined by how you use your system. For low cost diy, nothing beats Insteon. Whether they're in business or not, their switches will continue to work. Just have backups for future use if something were to fail. 

While I don't use udi anymore since I switched over to Lutron, their normal RA3 switches (dimmers and on/off) does work with eisy/polisy. Depending on finances, Lutron RA3 could also be an option. Eisy doesn't work for me because it does not support their keypads outside of the main load button. 

On 12/25/2024 at 12:02 PM, jkraus said:

My system is getting to just be a mishmash  of devices, how does one just do a simple HA without becoming a master in all these device, and cost??

I say focus on 1 protocol. Find one that has devices that fits most of your needs. Then it's easier to fill the rest with other stuff to fill out your system. It may require an initial investment but it'll be well worth it long term. 

 

On 12/25/2024 at 12:02 PM, jkraus said:

On the positive side, the UDI support is great as always, but would maybe help if there was a good solid solution for HA

…am I being too critical??

HA was a non starter for me. Ive tried it a few times included last year when they came out with their own box. It just requires to much investment in time for me to be a worthwhile contender to UDI. I'm not in this as a hobbiest/tinkerer like I was long ago when I first got started in this field. For those that use it, it's definitely a worthy investment due to the multitude of devices that it can control. For ease of use and simplicity, it does not come close to the eisy

[dbwarner5]

There are many posts thru the years on this subject. As I interact with friends who want to "automate" their homes, I generally tend to think of a spectrum that encompasses the technologies, the controllers (or integrators), prices and the learning curves of each.

For example: For many people, buying a KASA or MEROSS wifi light switch and using Alexa and/or the apps that come with  the switch is about all they need for simple "home automation". It's cheap, easy to learn and reasonably trouble free. But it's simple. 

The other end of the spectrum would be professional installations like Lutron or Control4. Immense power, but very limited user controll w/o installer help, and expensive. 

In the middle, in terms of Controllers or what I like to call Integrators, you have lots of competition for this space: Alexa, Google Home, Apple HomeKit, Ring, MyQ.... all vying to provide whether with their own hardware across the user space, or acting as pure integrators --> Alexa, where lots of technology brands can talk to, and therefore with each other. 

Universal Devices has provided an awesome product that is on the higher end of complexity, but of which also provides the higher end of control and through its use of Plug-ins, allows for a growing capability of integration. With its native connections to Insteon / zwave / Zigbee and over 100 plugins of different technology platforms, its is an awesome product for the "advanced" home automator without breaking the bank like the professional installations.

Similar to the comment above, I looked once at HA and quickly said NO>.. way too complicated to get to the use level that I have with Eisy.

Combined with UDMobile, the Eisy, is an amazingly, relatively cheap product with incredible support that is really hard to beat for anyone who wants to do more than what Alexa type products can do. 

IMHO.....

[Guy Lavoie]

Somewhere in the middle of that range of users are the hobbyists. Those, like me, who automate things just for the pleasure and challenge of doing it. Those who have more fun getting it working than using it once it's done. It's hard for us to give an unbiased opinion because we tend to give much more time and effort than "worthwhile" to getting some things working. The person who just wants it to work will find that they don't want to put anywhere near that kind of commitment. And that's ok. It's not all or nothing. I think it's just honest that we recognize ourselves and such and don't push too hard on someone who isn't like us.