Why did I have to recreate my scene?

[oh2bnMaine]

First off, I fixed it, but I am still curious if somebody can explain what happened.

I have recessed lights in the kitchen connected to a 2477D (Switch A). I have two other 2477Ds (Siwitch B, Switch C) that controlled the 'live' switch. This has been working for approximately 2 years now. 

This morning, my wife actuated one of the controller switches (not the one that is physically wired to the lights) and the scene seemed to break. The two controller switches stopped working as expected.

1. Turn lights ON using Switch A
2. Note that the LEDs on Switch B & Switch C did NOT change position (this used to work)
3. Actuate Switch B (from OFF to ON) to try to get it in sync with the scene
   • Lights turn OFF
   • Switch A LEDs go from ON to OFF
   • Switch B LEDs go from OFF to ON 
   • Switch C LEDs do not change
4. I removed the three switches from my ISY and re-adding them.
5. I recreated the scene in the admin console. 
6. I then created the scene at the switches.

I'm not sure if I HAD to do both #5 & #6, but just doing #5 did not seem to fix the issue.

I have ~40 scenes. This is the only one (that I have found) that broke.

Any thoughts on what happened?

Two months ago, I migrated from my ISY994 to an eISY. Other than that, I haven't made any changes that I would think could have impacted this aspect of the ISY. None of those changes were in the last few days and we've been using the kitchen lights every day.

[paulbates]

Would this be the first time you tried that particular combo, it may have been "broken" in migration?

In my experience with insteon & plms on several different HA systems, links can break:

1. From migrations from one controller/plm to another
2. Sometimes powerline fluctuations and/or age of device can cause a controller to forget some of its scene programming. For me it was mostly keypads, but it happened with other devices too

[Guy Lavoie]

Insteon works in strange and wonderful ways...  No idea really, but the first thing I would have tried would have been to "Restore Device" on the affected switches. This rewrites the links to them, without losing the references in programs and scenes.

[oh2bnMaine]

20 minutes ago, Guy Lavoie said:

Insteon works in strange and wonderful ways...  No idea really, but the first thing I would have tried would have been to "Restore Device" on the affected switches. This rewrites the links to them, without losing the references in programs and scenes.

I didn't think of using the Restore function until it was too late. That would have been a good test. 

[oh2bnMaine]

Well!! It happened again yesterday evening! I Just found out have performed the Restore Devices function on all three switches.

The first switch I did, the ISY Admin Console restarted itself and I had to re-log in.

Further attempts did NOT restart the ISY console.

Unfortunately, this did not fix the issue.

Any other thoughts? I'll leave it as is for now to see if anybody can help me get to the bottom of this (since it seems like it will come back)

[Guy Lavoie]

Are you able to turn the devices on and off from the Admin Console?

Sounds like something is getting corrupted, or a device is becoming intermittent.

[hart2hart]

Well!! It happened again yesterday evening! I Just found out have performed the Restore Devices function on all three switches.
The first switch I did, the ISY Admin Console restarted itself and I had to re-log in.
Further attempts did NOT restart the ISY console.
Unfortunately, this did not fix the issue.
Any other thoughts? I'll leave it as is for now to see if anybody can help me get to the bottom of this (since it seems like it will come back)

My guess is the switch connected to the fixture is going bad and losing its link table. I would have restored it only to see the impact. Or maybe one of switches is going bad and generating noice on that circuit to which I’d air gap them one at a time to see if problem goes away. First the two controller only and then one connected to fixture. If it’s the one connected to the fixture turning other two on and off will show in their LEDs but fixture will not be controlled.

[paulbates]

2 hours ago, hart2hart said:

My guess is the switch connected to the fixture is going bad and losing its link table. I would have restored it only to see the impact.

Another possibility is that the PLM is going bad. How old is it? There's a sticker on it with 4 numbers that documents the mfg dates, you can post those.

[Brian H]

The sticker should also have a revision number on it. That also may give us information on the PLM.

[oh2bnMaine]

16 hours ago, Guy Lavoie said:

Are you able to turn the devices on and off from the Admin Console?

Sounds like something is getting corrupted, or a device is becoming intermittent.

I can control all three switches from UDI phone app. While controlling the switches, I can see that they are switching on to the correct brightness levels -- I have a routine that changes these from day to night. The switch that is wired to the light is the only one that is actually turning the lights on.

When I have a minute, I'll look for a spare 2477D to change the switches one at a time to see what happens. 

I'll get the PLM information later this morning.

[Andy P]

This is a shot in the dark, but I had an issue kind of like this where the remote switches work but didn't turn on the load switch. Turns out that in the scene definition, somehow those remote switches were set to turn the remote on to 0% instead of 100%. When I fixed the scene, the remote switches worked as expected. Just another quick thing to check.