Lights switch on at random times

[jlloyd_UD]

I upgraded my ISY994ir to an eisy several weeks ago, and after some minor problems, I finally got my Insteon devices and programs reinstalled, along with my Alexa "spokens."  For the past several weeks, everything worked as it had before the upgrade without any glitches..  Yesterday evening, many, if not all, of my lights were randomly switching on with no command, either by voice or through a program.  The lights were switching on in the middle of the night without explanation.  I rebooted the eisy (power off and on), and that did not change the behavior.  What should I look at to see what might be triggering this unwanted activity?  I have just upgraded my subscriptions to Alexa (new voices and more conversational), but I do not think that is the trigger, although it was a coincidental change I made and the random light switching followed soon after.  I ask Alexa to switch the lights off and she is able to do that.  Does the Amazon change possibly create a trigger signal somehow?  I am using IOX version 5.9.1 of the eisy and have a serial PLM, and my Internet is disabled.

[Techman]

Take a look at this article

INSTEON Random All On Events - Universal Devices, Inc. Wiki

You should also do an "upgrade packages" on your eisy which will update you to 6.0.0 and contains substantial upgrades/improvements over your current firmware.

 

Edited Saturday at 10:30 PM by Techman

[jlloyd_UD]

Techman, I upgraded my eisy to version 6.0.0. I had been meaning to do that, and your prompt caused me to get it done.  Thanks. After upgrading, the random light behavior remains. I had hoped it would solve the unexplained behavior.  I read the article and, to the extent I understand its content, I am not thinking this is a source for my problem.  This is not an "all lights on" situation.  This is individual lights that come on at unexpected times (middle of the night, for example) when there should be no events that trigger the behavior. So far, there have been no instances where more than one light switches on at a time, and, therefore, these events appear to be independent. When I look at the log I can see where the light switches to an "on" state but there is no indication why it changes its state from "off." What else might I investigate?

[Guy Lavoie]

Is there any pattern to it? Like the same light coming on at the same time? Do any of your programs have time triggered events?

[paulbates]

How old is your PLM? An older PLM nearing end-of-life is a possible explanation. If you don't know, there's a white sticker on the back with 4 numbers on it. What are those numbers?

[jlloyd_UD]

paulbates, my dual band PLM is Model 2413S revision 2.4, 2817

[jlloyd_UD]

Guy Lavoie, I have several programs that are triggered by sunrise and sunset times and are typically offset by minutes.  But the lights affected also include lights that are not in programs.  I have not determined that there is any pattern involved.  Some lights are also linked by several Insteon switches, but some are commanded only by one switch

[paulbates]

10 minutes ago, jlloyd_UD said:

paulbates, my dual band PLM is Model 2413S revision 2.4, 2817

Ok. That means it was manufactured in the 28th week of 2017 and making it 8 years old. There's a time around then when Insteon remedied a problem with capacitors that caused the early demise of PLMs, I don't know exactly when so it's candidly tough to call it as the root cause to  me. 

I would still say it's likely

Here's some more steps

• In iox. Go to tools / diagnostics / PLM info. What does it say?
• Report that back
• There's another step but it comes after hearing what the first step reports

 

Edited yesterday at 02:19 PM by paulbates

[Techman]

@jlloyd_UD

If you're seeing the on command for the light(s) in your log then it's most likely not connected to an all on event.  I would focus on a program that's probably turning on the light(s)

Take a look at your program summary tab to see if a program ran at the same time your light(s) turned on.

It's also possible that the link tables for the light(s) got corrupted. Try doing a factory reset on the light(s) then a restore device

[jlloyd_UD]

paulbates, I am attaching a snip of the information for my serial PLM. 

[jlloyd_UD]

15 minutes ago, Techman said:

@jlloyd_UD

If you're seeing the on command for the light(s) in your log then it's most likely not connected to an all on event.  I would focus on a program that's probably turning on the light(s)

Take a look at your program summary tab to see if a program ran at the same time your light(s) turned on.

It's also possible that the link tables for the light(s) got corrupted. Try doing a factory reset on the light(s) then a restore device

I just had one of my lights illuminate and looked at the program summary tab.  Of the 8 programs I have that are enabled, all were idle at the time the light was switched on.  I will, at some point, perform a factory reset and restore in case the link tables are corrupted.  This situation affects at least 7 lights, and I am still thinking the events are independent.

[paulbates]

The next step is suggest is a restore modem / plm from the file menu in iox. If that works, it's likely a bad plm on the the way to failure.

Let's see if it does help. Again, if it does help, it is not all set, this is a symptom of a dying plm

If it doesn't work, now much lost including time.

[jlloyd_UD]

1 hour ago, paulbates said:

The next step is suggest is a restore modem / plm from the file menu in iox. If that works, it's likely a bad plm on the the way to failure.

Let's see if it does help. Again, if it does help, it is not all set, this is a symptom of a dying plm

If it doesn't work, now much lost including time.

 

1 hour ago, paulbates said:

The next step is suggest is a restore modem / plm from the file menu in iox. If that works, it's likely a bad plm on the the way to failure.

Let's see if it does help. Again, if it does help, it is not all set, this is a symptom of a dying plm

If it doesn't work, now much lost including time.

I just did a restore PLM command.  It paused and then displayed a bar that counted up to 2% before disappearing.  Is that a normal response to a restore plm command?  I have been waiting to see if the random lights illuminate again. So far, none have after 5 minutes. I will report back if this has temorarily resolved a failing PLM.

[jlloyd_UD]

6 minutes ago, jlloyd_UD said:

 

I just did a restore PLM command.  It paused and then displayed a bar that counted up to 2% before disappearing.  Is that a normal response to a restore plm command?  I have been waiting to see if the random lights illuminate again. So far, none have after 5 minutes. I will report back if this has temorarily resolved a failing PLM.

Just after I responded, a light illuminated, so maybe the restore step either did not properly function or it made no difference.

[paulbates]

26 minutes ago, jlloyd_UD said:

Just after I responded, a light illuminated, so maybe the restore step either did not properly function or it made no difference.

or, the PLM is having difficulties and the restore prompted it. Hard to say. 

Have there been any power surges that you know of, or brown outs blackouts recently?

Another test of the PLM, which will affect programs, is to unplug it and wait for the problem to reappear... but if anything critical is handled by your iox programs then DON'T do this test.

Edited yesterday at 05:17 PM by paulbates

[Brian H]

5 hours ago, jlloyd_UD said:

paulbates, my dual band PLM is Model 2413S revision 2.4, 2817

V2.4 has the later capacitors and new serial port board. Including the better serial port interface chip and protection on the two serial interface signals.

Edited yesterday at 07:22 PM by Brian H

[jlloyd_UD]

2 hours ago, paulbates said:

or, the PLM is having difficulties and the restore prompted it. Hard to say. 

Have there been any power surges that you know of, or brown outs blackouts recently?

Another test of the PLM, which will affect programs, is to unplug it and wait for the problem to reappear... but if anything critical is handled by your iox programs then DON'T do this test.

I really do not have anything critical especially during the overnight hours.  I will disconnect it when I go to bed tonight. If I do not have lights coming on when I unplug it, does that mean it is isolated as a problem emanating in the PLM?

I have whole house surge protection and have not had any weather-related surges that I know of.  I have a Ting power quality monitor and no surges have appeared before Monday last week.  I will get a weekly summary tomorrow that will identify any power surges for any reason that have happened in the past week.

35 minutes ago, Brian H said:

V2.4 has the later capacitors and new serial port board. Including the better serial port interface chip and protection on the two serial interface signals.

I guess that is an indication that my PLM was an improved version, but does not guarantee that it is not failing due to advanced age.  Thanks for the information, Brian.

[paulbates]

Brian would know that answer for sure. It looks like the plm as a problem is a dead end, unless you find no other solution.

[Techman]

@jlloyd_UD

It's possible that your device(s) link tables became cross linked. A factory reset /restore device would correct that.

In your log do you see any activity just before the light comes on?

Run the link below which will display your eisy configuration and post it

https://eisy.local:8443/WEB/sysconfig.txt

You can also try removing power from the PLM and the eisy for about 30 seconds, then power up the PLM, wait about 10 seconds then power up the eisy.

[Guy Lavoie]

33 minutes ago, Techman said:

@jlloyd_UD

It's possible that your device(s) link tables became cross linked. A factory reset /restore device would correct that.

In your log do you see any activity just before the light comes on?

Run the link below which will display your eisy configuration and post it

https://eisy.local:8443/WEB/sysconfig.txt

You can also try removing power from the PLM and the eisy for about 30 seconds, then power up the PLM, wait about 10 seconds then power up the eisy.

But if there are no scheduled commands of any kind when these random lights turn on, it would take more than messed up links for these events to be triggered. I'd start with leaving the PLM unplugged overnight just to see if the commans appear to come from it. You don't want to assume anything.

[jlloyd_UD]

6 hours ago, Techman said:

@jlloyd_UD

It's possible that your device(s) link tables became cross linked. A factory reset /restore device would correct that.

In your log do you see any activity just before the light comes on?

Run the link below which will display your eisy configuration and post it

https://eisy.local:8443/WEB/sysconfig.txt

You can also try removing power from the PLM and the eisy for about 30 seconds, then power up the PLM, wait about 10 seconds then power up the eisy.

Last night before bed, I had two approaches that were proposed. One was to power down the eisy and plm for 30 seconds and then power up the plm and wait 10 more seconds to power up the eisy.  The second proposal was to remove power from the plm.  I chose to follow the first option.  I believe it reduced the frequency of uncommanded light on randomly, as I sit here at 2 am, one of my lights just illuminated for no obvious reason.  I will let this approach option run the remainder of the night to see if the frequency of random lights on has indeed been reduced. In other words, the problem has not been eliminated entirely.  I did not run the link https://eisy.local:8443/WEB/sysconfig.txt but will run it tomorrow morning and post it. Tomorrow evening, I will remove power from the plm and let it run unpowered overnight.

 

[jlloyd_UD]

5 hours ago, jlloyd_UD said:

Last night before bed, I had two approaches that were proposed. One was to power down the eisy and plm for 30 seconds and then power up the plm and wait 10 more seconds to power up the eisy.  The second proposal was to remove power from the plm.  I chose to follow the first option.  I believe it reduced the frequency of uncommanded light on randomly, as I sit here at 2 am, one of my lights just illuminated for no obvious reason.  I will let this approach option run the remainder of the night to see if the frequency of random lights on has indeed been reduced. In other words, the problem has not been eliminated entirely.  I did not run the link https://eisy.local:8443/WEB/sysconfig.txt but will run it tomorrow morning and post it. Tomorrow evening, I will remove power from the plm and let it run unpowered overnight.

 

After the trial of the first option (unplug eisy and plm for 30 seconds and replug the plm and eisy 10 seconds later), I had lights illuminating again randomly.  I am not sure if the frequency changed or not.  Rather than wait until tonight to run the second option (unplug the plm and leave it unplugged), I decided to remove the plm and leave it unpowered from 2:30 am until 7:30 am this morning.  I experienced no random light activity during this 5-hour timeframe.  I would think that would indicate that commands might either have been originating in the plm or had to be processed by the plm? After replugging the plm and for about 50 minutes, I have not yet witnessed any random lights appearing but I have not done anything to stop the problem so my expectation would be that the random activity will start again.  I ran the link and am attaching the contents of the text file it created. I will report if I experience the random activity as soon as I witness a light being illuminating with no known trigger.  Thanks all for the help in isolating this annoying experience.

sysconfigtext.txt

[jlloyd_UD]

41 minutes ago, jlloyd_UD said:

After the trial of the first option (unplug eisy and plm for 30 seconds and replug the plm and eisy 10 seconds later), I had lights illuminating again randomly.  I am not sure if the frequency changed or not.  Rather than wait until tonight to run the second option (unplug the plm and leave it unplugged), I decided to remove the plm and leave it unpowered from 2:30 am until 7:30 am this morning.  I experienced no random light activity during this 5-hour timeframe.  I would think that would indicate that commands might either have been originating in the plm or had to be processed by the plm? After replugging the plm and for about 50 minutes, I have not yet witnessed any random lights appearing but I have not done anything to stop the problem so my expectation would be that the random activity will start again.  I ran the link and am attaching the contents of the text file it created. I will report if I experience the random activity as soon as I witness a light being illuminating with no known trigger.  Thanks all for the help in isolating this annoying experience.

sysconfigtext.txt 21.65 kB · 0 downloads

Over the past 90 minutes since replugging the plm I have had one instance of an uncommanded light illuminating. The problem has returned.

[paulbates]

7 minutes ago, jlloyd_UD said:

Over the past 90 minutes since replugging the plm I have had one instance of an uncommanded light illuminating. The problem has returned.

It's looking to me like the PLM is in the initial stages of failing. Do you have a recent backup? 

[Techman]

Your config file looks normal and is up to date.  

Is the green led on your PLM on?

The restore PLM That you did which stopped at 2% is not normal. 

You could try unplugging the eisy and leave the PM plugged in to narrow the problem down to either the eisy data file or the PLM