Bullet Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 I have operated my ISY system for over a year and a half, with no issues whotsoever. About 10 days ago, the programming started operating erratically. By the next day nothing worked at all. When I log into the admin console, each of the devices fails to communicate resulting in all of my devices being marked with red asterix. I went through the troubleshooting flowchart with no success. Other relevant notes: Just installed a FilterLinc at audio equipment. No change. Have not brought any new devices or gear into house in last 4 months. Powered down all of the devices and then turned one on to try to communicate. Still failed. At time of failure had not changed any programming or upgraded any equipment or firmware. Upgraded to 3.1.17 while troubleshooting. Can load the admin console but still cannot communicate with any devices. Next steps: Reset the PLM? Replace the Access Points? Any and all assistance is appreciated. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeG Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 Power cycle the PLM. What does Tools | Diagnostics | PLM Info/Status display? Does device to device control work? Insteon 3-way switches for example. Sounds like either the PLM has failed or something on the PLM circuit is seriously interfering with communications. The PLM can be plugged into a long extension cord so that it can be plugged into a different electrical circuit distant from the current plug point. If nothing else has worked then factory reset the PLM. This will require a File | Restore Modem (PLM) operation to rewrite the PLM link database. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bullet Posted March 26, 2012 Author Share Posted March 26, 2012 Power cycled the PLM, ISY, and each of the devices. Yes, inter device control still works. I can still operate the 3 way switches but devices like the Remotelinc do not work. Will try long cord first, then will factory reset the PLM if no change. Will let you know. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bullet Posted March 26, 2012 Author Share Posted March 26, 2012 Sorry, PLM status reports: 12.9C.F2 v85 /Connected Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian H Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 RemoteLinc is an RF device. Check your Access Points or Dual Band devices you are using. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bullet Posted March 26, 2012 Author Share Posted March 26, 2012 Plugged the PLM into a long cord and used an outlet across the house. Interesting - starting the admin console resulted in less errors. Could see status of some devices and could even switch one or two a few times, then communications failed again. I am not sure what effect the remote plug had, other than to change the noise somewhat in the vicinity of the PLM. Should I continue with the factory reset of the PLM next? Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeG Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 Try unplugging the Access Points and see if there is any improvement in communications. That will eliminate coupling so some number of devices are assumed to fail. With the RemoteLinc not working that could mean one of the Access Points is flooding the powerline. This is a process of eliminating possibilities. If unplugging the Access Points does not show a marked improvement in a subset of devices, plug the Access Points back in and factory reset the PLM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bullet Posted March 27, 2012 Author Share Posted March 27, 2012 OK, I tried plugging the PLM in with a long cord and got limited functionality but very erratic. No difference after unplugging the Access points. Reset the PLM. Confirmed PLM links table clear. Restored PLM. No change. Repeated the reset and restore. Interesting that the RF devices (motion and Remotelinc) will communicate their status but somewhat erratically. Any more things to try? Replace the PLM? Thanks for your help! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeG Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 No more ideas. Without a test device that measures signal strength everything indicates a bad PLM. Could be something on the powerline that was not there before but I would think that you would be aware of a new appliance/device. Of course it could be an old device that is acting up now. Some cell phone chargers have been known to put enough interference on the powerline to block all traffic. It would be necessary to unplug all appliances and non-Insteon devices to eliminate this possibility. I suggest getting a new PLM. If that does not resolve the issue then you know for sure something is destroying the ability to communicate on the powerline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bullet Posted March 27, 2012 Author Share Posted March 27, 2012 Will order one tomorrow morning. No issues with replacing mine with the newer version? Once I receive it is the replacement as simple as plugging it in and then restoring again or do I have to tell the ISY the old one is removed? Thanks for all your help with this. Frustrating to say the least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeG Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 Power down both the ISY and the old PLM. Connect the new PLM and power up both the ISY and the new PLM. The ISY will detect that the PLM address now being accessed does not match the old address. When a Restore Modem (PLM) is done all references to the old PLM address will be changed to the new PLM address in all devices. Do not put any RF only devices into linking mode. When the Restore completes all the activity to the RF devices will be queued. Put one RF device into linking mode, right click the node and select Write Updates to Device. When that update completes do the next RF device. Do not try to put multiple RF devices into linking mode at the same time as they will cancel each other out. Also note that if you currently have a 2412S PLM they are no longer available. The 2413S Dual Band PLM is the replacement. Only issue is the 2413S does not power the ISY so a small external power supply for the ISY must be purchased along with the new PLM. Smarthome carries the external power supply. Just a small wall wart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bullet Posted March 27, 2012 Author Share Posted March 27, 2012 If I am placing an order anyway, I am inclined to also buy a 2406 hard wired phase coupler. Am I correct in saying that it may not address this problem but that the system will be more responsive than relying solely on the Access points? I will purchase the 2413 with ISY-Power to replace my 2412. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeG Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 The wired coupler is fine, it will not create a problem. Some users prefer it to Access Points when RF devices are not involved. Could reduce the number of devices plugged into outlets. The wired coupler is passive, it couples the signal to the other 120v leg without any amplification. Access Points get the signal on the other leg at max signal levels. Some folks put the PLM near the power panel. With that PLM placement a passive coupler would be putting a good level signal on the other 120v leg. The lack of a passive coupler is not your problem. The addition of a passive coupler could provide additional signal coverage. Hate to sound vague about the benefits, just not a fan of the passive coupler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bullet Posted April 10, 2012 Author Share Posted April 10, 2012 Received the new 2413, installed and restored, but no change. Is it possible that the ISYNC has a problem? Not sure where else to look... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeG Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 If you have any plugable devices such as LampLincs, ApplianceLincs move one to the PLM plug point and see if the device works plugged into the same circuit as the PLM. If not then the source of the interference is at the PLM plug point. If that works move the plugable device to different locations around the house to see if a pattern of work/no work develops. With such drastic lose of communiction with so many devices not related to a PLM failure there is something generating substantial interference. Some cell phone charges will bring down an entire network. One technique is to unplug (not turn Off) every pluggable appliance. Is any improvement seen. If so then plug the appliances one at a time. Another approach is to turn Off all circuit breakers, turning them On one at a time. The PLM circuit has to remain on and a plugable device should be available to plug into a circuit as it it turned back on. Or test the devices that power up with the specific circuit breaker just turned On. Air gapping all the wired Insteon devices, retoring one at a time to if any if a pattern of work/no work can be determined. EDIT: I don't know what ISYNC is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bullet Posted April 10, 2012 Author Share Posted April 10, 2012 Thanks for your rapid reply Will play sleuth now. Sorry - the iPad autocorrects ISY to ISYNC. I missed it. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bullet Posted April 10, 2012 Author Share Posted April 10, 2012 OK, will go through the process again. Can't help but think this is device related given that it worked for so long with no issues. Sorry, the iPad autocorrects ISY to ISYNC. I missed it before posting. Thanks for all your help LeeG. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeG Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 If it is device related pulling the air gap switches and unplugging all the devices would be the place to start. Over the years I've seen just about every type of interference one can think of. Hard to predict which approach will provide the answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bullet Posted April 14, 2012 Author Share Posted April 14, 2012 Unfortunately, the system is now working exactly as it did before with no known issues. I say unfortunately because I did nothing except wait several hours before beginning the task of troubleshooting. I realized things were working again when the house started behaving. There is nothing worse than never identifying the source of a failure and having it go away. I waited several days to report back expecting that the problem might return - it has not. Thank you so much for your help. It is appreciated. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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