apostolakisl

I have a somewhat older KPL that I believe is working fine, but have repurposed and am not getting it to work right. It is a 6 button unit and I am using the 4 middle buttons to run a fanlinc. I have setup 4 scenes and put all 4 buttons in each scene. The 4 scenes being high, med, low, off. I have the buttons to toggle on only. In each scene, I set the 3 buttons that aren't for that scene to have on-levels of off. That way they are exclusive, only one button will be on at a time. This is working great when I control the scene from the KPL buttons. Push "high" and the "off" kpl shuts off for example. However, when I control the scene from ISY (or in other words from the PLM) it turns all of the buttons on even though I have it set to be off. I have tried restoring the device from ISY and changed the on-level to "on" and then back to "off" and still. This should work . . . right?

If you deleted them in the portal, then I don't believe that it is possible for Alexa to make them do anything. All Alexa commands go through the portal. There is a sync button or something like that in the portal, I assume you tried hitting that?

Alexa only knows what you enter in the portal.

You log into the isy portal and map scenes (or whatever) to spoken commands. It is under your isy, connectivity, Amazon Echo. You could also map the program itself to the Alexa spoken command. This would not turn the kpl light on, but it would run the 5 minute fan or whatever.

I assume you have Alexa turning on the scene, but that won't trigger the program since I believe the program is a "control turned on". "control turn on" is only a trigger when that device is the origin of things (for a kpl or any switch that means you pushed it). So if the KPL is responding to Alexa, it isn't a "control" device, and the program isn't running. You would need to add "status" of the KPL button in the if section of the program to trigger the program when KPL isn't the origin of things.

You must have some orphan links on the office switch. I assume the office light shuts off if you use the ISY admin console to shut the same scene off that the 10/15 min program is shutting off. This would mean that the office light is programmed to respond to that scene and here is how to fix it. 1) factory reset the office light switch. Now test shutting the scene off from ISY admin console. If the office light doesn't shut off, then you know you had a bad link on the office switch. 2) Restore the office switch from ISY and test again. If all is good, then you are done. If not 3) Take notes for the office light switch with all of its settings and any scenes it is in. 4) Delete the switch from ISY 5) Factory reset the switch 6) Add it back to ISY and manually put all the settings back into it.

Try downloading the offline java uninstaller. Then run the offline java installer. Then download the start.jnlp file from this forum. Java (at least in the format supporting ISY) is just crappy. I regularly have to mess with it. Back in the day, using ctrl/alt/delete to end some non responsive program was a regular thing, but those days are long gong . . . except for Java. And not on just one computer, but all of my computers. And not just once a year or something, but like once every couple weeks. And I have had to do the offline uninstall/install now about 3 times as well.

I assume you set it to non-toggle off. The reason it took two presses is because the first press was turning it on. Which can work if you set the on-level as off for all the other devices, but still that kpl button itself will alternate from lit to unlit and not correspond to the status of the fan. if you set the off button as a responder to all the other scenes, it will light up when ever you turn on any of those scenes so it will look like something to press to when you want to turn something off.

You could make the "on level" be "off", but it would be better to do what I said and make that button a non-toggle off button.

If you made one button whose only job is to turn everything off, then yes, just make a scene, make that button as the controller, add all the other buttons to the scene as responders (and the fan switch also). Then go into the kpl settings and set the button mode to toggle off only. So pushing that button always sends an "off" command. EDIT: and you can also make that same button a responder in all of the other scenes so that if you turn on any of the other scenes, that button will light up. As a responder to a scene, you can turn the button on (backlight), but that does not execute the scene that the button is a controller for. The scene only executes when you push the button. That is what "controller" means, it means you actually controlled the item directly.

The wiki has sample programs and there is an ISY "cookbook". Regarding KPL,s basically, you can set them up to be 4 on/off switches using the technique I listed. An on/off switch has two exclusionary states and by making scenes with two kpl buttons where one shuts the other off, you can do effectively make 2 states, or 3 states, or 4 states . . etc. With your bathroom, I think you make it an 8 states switch. I have some kpl's that I use as 4 on/off switches using that technique. The more you can do with scenes instead of programs, the better (quicker) the response will be. And if you have the pro 994, then you can set it so that it doesn't write changes until you are done setting things up. That way you don't have to wait every time you make a single change for it to write before doing the next thing. And with programs, your 8 (or whatever you ended up) with timers for your 8 kpl buttons can go very fast by making one program, then copying it 7 times and making the couple edits needed.

Mostly because you were new to most everything you just did. I could have set it up in 5 minutes, and if you continue to get more familiar with ISY programming, you will too. The stuff we did here has other applications letting you do things you might not have known could be done. Like toggling back and forth between two kpl buttons (or all 8). Setting up scenes where turning one scene on turns something else OFF is something that doesn't immediately strike people as a thing.

For the most part, it has built-in polyglot 3 node server. Otherwise, if you want nodeservers you have to use PG2 which is no longer being updated and you have to install the PG2 on a rpi or similar. Eisy is also has way more processing speed and io ports and stuff which generally isn't needed, though I suspect as ISY continues to update it may grow into needing it. Also eisy is supporting some of the newer stuf like Matter which I don't believe 994i does.

For each scene, say the 10 minute scene, button C. Add to that scene all the other buttons, but set the "on level" to "off" for all the buttons except C. This way only one KPL button will be on at a time. So the controller is button c, you can see it is red. If you click on that red button c listing, it will show all the settings for all the stuff in that scene when controlled by button c. Now go down the list and set the "on level" to "off" for everything except button c and the fan outlet.

If you shut the scene off, everything in the scene shuts off. So that would shut off both the kpl button and the outlet the fan is plugged into. If you want to shut off something else, then you need to either add it to the scene or list it separatley. By listing all the other KPL buttons as "not switched on", it will cause this program to terminate if you push one of the other buttons. For example, if you push button C, that will be a "switched on" event, which will trigger this program. But it is listed as "not switched on", so that will trigger the else clause. If the wait is already running, then it will end.

Create multiple scenes. Each scene will have one of the KPL buttons and the appliance link running the fan. The KPL button will be a controller of the scene. At this point, pressing any of those buttons will turn the fan on, no programs needed. Now, to turn it off. For each KPL button scene, create a program, adjusting the wait time for whatever you want for each button. If KPL button is switched on (the button you want to set the timer for below minutes) and KPL button is not switched on (one of the other buttons) and KPL button is not switched on (another button . . etc including all of the other buttons) Then wait x minutes set scene that KPL button is in off Also, if you manually turn the KPL button off, this will shut the fan off. EDIT: You might also put in each scene all of the kpl buttons, but make all of the non-primary kpl buttons responders and set the "on level" to off. This way, if you say push button b, then change your mind and push button c, button b will turn off. I also edited the program above so that if you push say button b, then change your mind and hit button c, not only will the kpl light turn off, but the program timer for that button will end.

I guess I am confused here. Is the KPL not hard wired to the fan? And what do you want each of the KPL buttons to do?

On the KPL devices it gets a little screwy because the other 7 buttons are not treated as devices. You have to create a scene for each button even if it is the only thing in the scene to use a program to turn it on/off. If you are going to use a program to control the fan timing and not the other buttons on the KPL, I would switch over to a swtichlinc.

If fan switch is control switched on Then wait 2 minutes set fan switch off

Just replaced the 250v 6.8uF capacitor in one of my very old and long discontinued synchrolincs . . . and it works again! It has been sitting on my workbench for months waiting for me to get around to it.

Yes, that will work fine. Kind of seems like more options than you would really ever need. Without labeling the buttons you will probably forget how many minutes each button does. Personally, I did the simple on/off switch with the 5 minute additions. Rarely use anything more than the single click for 5 minutes.

You could try replacing the capacitors. Most common part to fail in any Insteon device.

What @lilyoyo1 said. Just write some programs in ISY. That is how all of my bathroom fans currently work. No need for a special switch that they haven't made in years and probably will never make again. I have it set to turn on for 5 minutes when you click the on paddle. If I click the on paddle a second time, it adds 5 more minutes. If do a "fast on" it just turns on and stays on. You can get fancy with it that way or just make a simple program that says If control device is switched on Then wait 5 minutes turn device off Or, use variables for something fancy If control device is switched on Then $fantimer += 5 (use a state variable) If $fantimer is not zero Then turn fan on Else turn fan off If $fantimer is not zero Then repeat every minute $fantimer -= 1

If it is turning a fan on and off, you would not want the dimmer. Though it would probably work, you are best to use the relay version since fans are only supposed to function as on/off devices. If you have the ramp rate set to go super fast to 100% it will likely work, but there is probably some chance of damaging the motor or even having it catch fire. And even at 100%, the triac may still be affecting the current flow. I guess if you already have an 8 button kpl dimmer on it and it has worked for years, it would be at your discretion to just replace it with the same. And yes, I do believe the D in the name stands for dimmer. An S stands for switch. Looking at the insteon web page, they don't have any switches in stock. The 8 button dimmer and 6 button dimmer are actually the same device configured differently. They make a conversion kit. The switch is totally different, it has a relay in it that switches the load on and off, the dimmers run the power through a triac dimmer.

If it was working as a timer, then you must have it programmed in ISY to do that. Keypads can't do that by themselves. And yes, you need a new KPL (They are called Keypad Links or KPL for short). Or you could open it up and replace the capacitors which is probably what went bad. Physically replace the old switch with the the new switch and add it to ISY (put ISY in linking mode and press the little tab button on the bottom of the kpl until it beeps, then click the pop-up window in ISY to go ahead and add it). Give it a name like "new kpl". Then, in ISY remove the old KPL from any folder you may have placed it in (right click/remove from folder), then transfer programming to new device (right click old kpl/replace with . . . select the new switch). Then if you like you can move it back to a folder in ISY. Doing the above will transfer all programs and links and everything from the old KPL to the new KPL. It will name the new kpl with the name of the old one and it will totally delete the old kpl from ISY.