oberkc

I would probably do it different, but based on concerns that you may not have. For example, is it possible that you don't know whether you are going to be late until after sunset-10? What happens to your programs if you toggle the KPL button ON after the lights are already on (it seems to me that you have some potential issues here)? What do you want to happen to the landscape lights if you toggle ON the KPL button after 1158 pm, but before sunrise (I did not address this concern, but you may want to)? Instead, I would probably allocate things a little differently. First, you always want the lights to come on, regardless of button correct? Start with this: if time is sunset-10 minutes and control KPL button is not switched off then turn on landscape lights else turn off landscape lights The program above will always turn the lights on at sunset-10 (regardless of KPL status) and will always turn them off when the KPL is toggled off These next two programs will automatically turn them off at specific times, based on the status of the KPL button: if time is 1158pm and status KPL is off then turn off landscape lights if time is sunrise - 1 hour and status KPL button is on then turn off landscape lights Hopefully, there are some ideas you can play around with.

I have only theories why the light does not go off at dawn. You want the light to come on, or to enable the response to the motion sensor? Is there any particular reason to avoid using the ISY built-in dusk/dawn timer? I am assuming that this suggests that you don't necessarily want the light to come on at dusk and turn off at dawn, but rather you want the motion sensor enabled between dusk and dawn. Change checkbox to ON only. Eliminate this scene. Create a program: if from time = sunset to sunrise (next day) and control motion sensor turned on then turn on porch light wait three minutes turn off porch light else turn off porch light If you would rather use the motion sensor light settings for enabling the motion, change the program to: if status dusk.dawn is on and control motion sensor turned on then .....same else ....same

The ISY does not "check" status on a schedule. ISY programs based on status are triggered when the status changes. If the status does not change, the program will never trigger. The only time your first program would trigger is if the status of either of the two devices in the IF condition change (or if you trigger the program manually or from another program). This program would trigger itself when either the GR Kitchen Lights or GR Island Lights status changes. For status, the cause of the change does not matter (whether a switch was manually changed or from other causes).

I vaguely recall that some of the older keypads do not allow secondary button ON levels of zero. Hopefully I am wrong.

I do not believe so. Hopefully, this will happen very rarely. This is the case at my house.

Shannong's experience with non-toggle off is as mine...the button will flash a couple of times, the turn off. It should work in a scene. At my house, it DOES work in scenes. Perhaps it is a bad device. If it is sending OFF commands, yet the LED is staying on, this would make me suspicious. Is it possible that there are other programs triggered by this button? Could this button also be a responder in another scene?

I agree with LeeG...this is not a program problem. There are lots of possibilities explaining the behavior. My first question is whether the ISY knows that when these two lights are on. Try turning them on manually and checking the ISY to be sure that it noticed the change in status. Do this several times. Does the ISY always reflect accurate status?

Indeed, you are not the first to miss this little detail. This is by design, as I understand insteon, and not unique to the ISY. The purpose of this is to allow multiple buttons to control the same scene, but have different responses. A scene might contain 10 lights, but you may want those 10 lights to be a different levels for, say, watching a movie, versus gathering around, or intermission, or snacks. You could assign four controller buttons to that same scene, but the levels could be set for four different purposes. Most consider this a valuable feature of insteon, I suspect.

I am not sure that I am following what is and is not happening that should and should not happen. Your screenshot captured the ON levels for some of the devices, but not all. Keep in mind that the screen shot represented the ON levels for when the SCENE is invoked from the ISY. These levels COULD be different when the scene is invoked from one of the keypad controller buttons. Click on each controller button and make sure the ON levels are where you want them.

The ISY needs, also, the "PLM" (PowerLine Modem?). Make sure yours included this. Perhaps the difference in price was due to one being a kit (with the PLM) and the other being just the ISY?

This is the very nature of insteon and X-10. The ISY does not solve that problem, though it can trigger X-10 commands from insteon. Yes. Nothing is lost. No. Being in scenes is not necessary for this to happen. But...yes, ISY can handle that. I am unsure. I suppose it depends on how the palm pad remote interfaces with your system. If IR, then almost certainly this would be no problem. If X-10 RF, then no problem. If something else, .... probably, but would have to confirm. It is not needed, but I find it useful. It adds no functional capability. Rather, it makes managing your X-10 devices more intuitive by allowing one to give them names and add them to the device listing.

Erick As your program is now written, the timer would, indeed, continue after the lights are turned off. However, if the lights are then turned back on before the one hour timer finishes, I think you would find that the timer would be reset, due to the new "control on" received. If the light is on when the next person comes, and the timer is nearing the end of the countdown period, then the lights could go off at an inconvenient time. This can be solved by pushing the ON switch (even if the lights are already on), but I would expect this to be easy to forget. I am not sure that there is a programmatic way to solve the second problem. To extend the countdown without human interaction tends to suggest a need for the ISY to know that there is a human present, which tends to suggest the need for a motion sensor.

I would probably look in the manuals for each device, to find out how to factory reset everything. Then I would factory reset everything. Load up latest version for ISY-99 (3.3.10, or something like that) and start linking. Keep in mind that the -99 no longer receives updates. It is possible that it will not recognize some of the latest insteon devices.

I beleive you will get an occasional response from UDI around here, but it is mostly users. The UDI wiki has the contact info for technical support. http://wiki.universal-devices.com/index ... =Main_Page Do ,you have a lot of gadgets on your network? A server? Anything that one can access from outside the home? I wonder if there is an IP address conflict, or a port conflict.

Yes, you listed "apps" but I asked about those that did not require a computer running 24/7 to operate. I already listed two apps that have this and there are about 6-7 more a quick web search would provide you. Ah! So those who disagree are simply not sophisticated "power users". OK.

I had no trouble on IE10 when I last had it. One of the common pieces of advice is to clear your java cache. Have you tried this?

Yes, I am pretty enthusiastic about the ISY. I don't consider using apps to be a stop-gap or workaround. I DO consider logging on to a web page, whether via a PC or mobile device, (to the admin panel) to remotely control my system to be unnecessarily complex. I consider control right on the home page of my mobile device (via widget or icon) to be the superior approach. I don't believe adding a virtual device, alone, allows for this. What other apps/devices allow the capability of the ISY (without relying on a PC to execute programs and events) that have the virtual device capability? I would love to check this out. So you have said. I admire the enthusiasm you hold for such an opinion. Based on the response given by UDI to your original post, it appeared they shared your opinion. I wonder if this has changed in the intervening years. Clearly you perceive it has value. Yes, there may be others who have similar perceptions. Yes, mobilinc is an additional cost. Is it more complex than what I perceive you are suggesting?...perhaps in setup, but not so in operation. Have you tried the ISY dashboard?" Thank you for your time and explanation. I truly did not understand

.I would expect it to be blank right after cycling power. If, however, you have successfully restored the device (no writes waiting), you see no commands in the event viewer of some (but not all) keypad buttons, and you see no status (blank), I suspect faulty device. You can try moving closer to an access point or other RF device, but I don't expect this to help. I have never pasted an image, but to save a snapshot of your desktop, or part of your desktop, I like the "snipping" tool that comes with windows (I think).

My firmware is 4.05 My UI is 3.3.8. It works on windows 8, using IE 11. I suspect it works on other browsers, but I cannot say that I have tried it.

keep in mind, too, that the remotelinc buttons do not actually have a STATUS. Any status shown in the admin panel is, as I understand, nothing more than the last command received. Perhaps a better method of fault isolating is simply to press the buttons on your remotelinc while watching the event viewer. Do you see the commands when the button is pressed? If some buttons work, and others don't, I cannot help but suspect a faulty remote. When you restored your device from the ISY, did you save those changes to the remotelinc? Make sure there are no red marks or warnings besides the device in the admin panel.

I am using windows 8. I have java update 7 update 45.

Yes, you did explain your use cases. The problem that I am having is that I am (or would be were I interested) able to do every example you cite, without virtual devices, so I don't see the need for having another device (real or imagined) in my ISY admin panel. I can do this via an actual insteon device or via my android phone, or via ipad. If I have internet connection, I can do this anywhere in the world. Doing so using iOS would be equally possible. I have two android tablets throughout my house and can control lighting this way, or via android phone. This can be done via iOS devices, as well. I have a remotelinc at a couple of strategic places, as well. My two tablets are also used for TV remote control. I can integrate this with my insteon system as well. It takes additional hardware, but I don't believe having a virtual device would make this any easier from a hardware standpoint. No, of course not. I use a combination of tasker and mobilinc for this. I don't use the admin UI for anything except MANAGING my insteon system. I often go months without opening the admin panel. But I can easily turn on or off anything insteon via android/iOS device. I admit that doing so via PC is not something that has interested me, so I have not much looked into the options there. OK, I will take your word for this. I have no idea whether having a virtual device makes it easier to create apps. Of the two apps I have seen, they can display status for existing devices, so I am happy to assume that it would be no different than showing status of a virtual device. I can use tasker/mobilinc to create home-screen widgets that can do anything that insteon can control. Using mobilinc directly, one can see status of any device and control any scene. The only complaint I have with this method is inability to create a specific user interface that I would like, which would mostly be an emulation of a keypad. Having a virtual device may help make this a reality, but only if controlling it remotely would result in behavior like a direct (manual) control of a real device.

Am unsure what you mean when you say you have your ISY connected with smartlinc. I have not experienced the problems you are describing, but wonder if it is related to trying to maintain some relationship with smartlinc.

As one who deals with requirements versus solutions for a living, it sounds to me as if you are pushing for a specific solution without defining your requirement. I will admit to being unfamiliar with the rest of the home automation world and programming, in general, and that your requirement may be self evident to those who have this familiarity, but I am having trouble understanding (but still curious) what it is that you are trying to achieve. Is it a desire for a better human-machine interface to allow more intuitive and tailorable interface for control of your system from a web page on your PC...to display this virtual device from the admin panel? Do you want the ISY firmware to include the ability to create this configurable interface? Is it the ability to write apps that interface to the ISY? On what hardware do you want to display this virtual device? (Your mention of "apps" makes me think you are intending this for android or iOS tablets. ) I have no personal interest in controlling my lighting from the PC (or at least providing a wife/guest_friendly means to do so). Perhaps that is what I am missing here. My interfaces are all through tablets or actual insteon devices and I find barely reasonable (room for improvement, however) methods to create that user interface. I must admit, however, that I would definitely like the ability of an android tablet to act as a virtual keypad device, looking like a keypad, showing status for each button. So far, I have not found a solution for this. I do use android tablets and phones to control my system, however. My approach falls short of a "virtual" device in that it does NOT show status for scenes or devices. I have understood this as a limitation of android (multiple icons based on conditions) rather than a limitation of the ISY and don't believe having a virtual device within the ISY as a solution to this problem. I appreciate your patience with me.

And how is this different than using a variable, or another program, to respresent some "virtual" status? So, you are not arguing for a new capability, but, rather, easier use and better integration with the rest of the world. OK