TheCoppa Posted December 16, 2014 Posted December 16, 2014 (edited) I have been experiencing a strange, but not unheard of problem. I have an 2441TH v.0D. It is powered from the 24VAC of my furnace, and generally works well. I have noticed that it reports changes in humidity very frequently, to the point it is the dominant entry in my ISY logs. I also have a 2441ZTH which had what I believe was an identical problem, I was able to reduce the DC voltage with a resistor to that unit to make it stop babbling. Before I start messing with the AC voltage, or buying transformers, is there a known issue that I am not aware of? I called Smarthome support, but the the guy I got was a rookie (nice all the same) only suggestion was to factory reset the thermo, which I did but it did not change the problem. Any insight is appreciated. Below are the necessary stats: ISY994i 4.2.18 2441TH v.0D Three dual band modules with no apparent communication problems 2 2443-222 v.43 Mivro on of module 1 2477D v.41 Dual band SwitchLinc Dimmer Numerous other power line on off and dimmer modules Below are a few lines from my logs, thirteen updates in 6 minutes seems excessive since this seems to happen 24x7 HVAC / Main Thermo Status Humidity 41% Tue 2014/12/16 02:01:51 PM System Log HVAC / Main Thermo Status Humidity 40% Tue 2014/12/16 02:02:26 PM System Log HVAC / Main Thermo Status Humidity 39% Tue 2014/12/16 02:02:35 PM System Log HVAC / Main Thermo Status Humidity 40% Tue 2014/12/16 02:02:46 PM System Log HVAC / Main Thermo Status Humidity 41% Tue 2014/12/16 02:02:53 PM System Log HVAC / Main Thermo Status Humidity 40% Tue 2014/12/16 02:03:37 PM System Log HVAC / Main Thermo Status Humidity 41% Tue 2014/12/16 02:04:03 PM System Log HVAC / Main Thermo Status Humidity 42% Tue 2014/12/16 02:04:19 PM System Log HVAC / Main Thermo Status Humidity 41% Tue 2014/12/16 02:05:47 PM System Log HVAC / Main Thermo Status Humidity 42% Tue 2014/12/16 02:06:07 PM System Log HVAC / Main Thermo Status Humidity 41% Tue 2014/12/16 02:06:33 PM System Log HVAC / Main Thermo Status Humidity 40% Tue 2014/12/16 02:06:48 PM System Log HVAC / Main Thermo Status Humidity 39% Tue 2014/12/16 02:06:57 PM System Log Edited December 16, 2014 by TheCoppa
Michel Kohanim Posted December 18, 2014 Posted December 18, 2014 Hi TheCoppa, This is from a long time ago: A representitive from Venstar has suggested a fix which I implemented this evening and tested. The Humidity updates on the T1700 are gone. The display on the ISY now shows 0% all the time. They said they will make a change on future T1700's. The Fix: 1. Remove the T-stat from the baseplate. 2. Looking at the PCB with the V2 adapter port faceing down, you will see where a humidity sensor could be installed on the bottom right side of the PCB (it's actually written "Humidity sensor"). Just above this area you will see two rectangular solder bumps. The component label is C32. 3. Get a soldering iron and short these two pads together with a solder bead. BTW When I removed the V2 my stability returned. All x10 fired perfectly and my keypad buttons leds are always in synch. The V2 is now installed and the ISY is controlling nicely. With kind regards, Michel
stusviews Posted December 18, 2014 Posted December 18, 2014 The Insteon thermostat is constructed differently.
TheCoppa Posted January 7, 2015 Author Posted January 7, 2015 Michel, do you have anything on the Insteon 2441TH? It is not the same as the unit you mention, it is a fully functional all inclusive Insteon Thermo with active humidity capabilities.
saphotoexpress Posted January 8, 2015 Posted January 8, 2015 Funny, I just noticed the same thing the other day on one of my thermostats but wasn't sure if I should be concerned. This stat is actually an Insteon unit. Should I be concerned? Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 63% Fri 2015/01/02 03:40:06 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 62% Fri 2015/01/02 03:40:10 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 63% Fri 2015/01/02 03:41:19 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 62% Fri 2015/01/02 03:41:23 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 60% Fri 2015/01/02 03:43:28 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 61% Fri 2015/01/02 03:43:32 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 62% Fri 2015/01/02 03:44:18 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 61% Fri 2015/01/02 03:44:22 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 63% Fri 2015/01/02 03:44:46 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 61% Fri 2015/01/02 03:44:50 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 63% Fri 2015/01/02 03:45:27 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 62% Fri 2015/01/02 03:45:31 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 60% Fri 2015/01/02 03:45:53 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 62% Fri 2015/01/02 03:45:58 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 63% Fri 2015/01/02 03:46:15 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 61% Fri 2015/01/02 03:46:20 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 63% Fri 2015/01/02 03:46:48 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 61% Fri 2015/01/02 03:46:53 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 60% Fri 2015/01/02 03:47:29 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 61% Fri 2015/01/02 03:47:34 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 60% Fri 2015/01/02 03:48:12 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 61% Fri 2015/01/02 03:48:17 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 60% Fri 2015/01/02 03:49:46 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 61% Fri 2015/01/02 03:49:59 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 63% Fri 2015/01/02 03:50:41 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 61% Fri 2015/01/02 03:50:45 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 60% Fri 2015/01/02 03:51:28 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 61% Fri 2015/01/02 03:51:32 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 63% Fri 2015/01/02 03:51:54 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 61% Fri 2015/01/02 03:51:58 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 60% Fri 2015/01/02 03:52:24 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 61% Fri 2015/01/02 03:52:28 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 63% Fri 2015/01/02 03:52:58 PM System Log Thermostats / Bonus Rm - Main Humidity 61% Fri 2015/01/02 03:53:02 PM
stusviews Posted January 8, 2015 Posted January 8, 2015 Humidity should be kept between 25% and 60% for both health and comfort. BTW, I, too, would like to see a fix for the Insteon thermostat.
larryllix Posted January 8, 2015 Posted January 8, 2015 That looks like a defect to me. I have two 2441ZTH units (different versions) that send humidity updates every 30 seconds on AC and about 5 minutes on batteries. I would attempting to return the unit under warranty, if possible. The updates are too frequent and erratic timing.
zerop Posted August 3, 2015 Posted August 3, 2015 (edited) I just noticed the same thing with my 2441TH (receiving humidity updates every 20-40 seconds). Is there any more on this subject or is it a defective unit? Edited August 3, 2015 by zerop
larryllix Posted August 4, 2015 Posted August 4, 2015 I can act as a heartbeat for "alive" detections but in my mind it should be quite regular, not erratic timing.
stusviews Posted August 4, 2015 Posted August 4, 2015 The humidity sensor is working correctly. An Insteon signal is sent whenever the humidity changes. No one has found a way to turn that off for the 2441TH.
larryllix Posted August 4, 2015 Posted August 4, 2015 The humidity should not be fluctuating that fast with bobble. Humidity sensors never seem to respond that fast, especially up and down repeatedly. This sounds like a problem with the thermostats. What is your power supply to it?
stusviews Posted August 4, 2015 Posted August 4, 2015 Wired Insteon thermostats (2447TH) have that behavior. Wireless thermostats do not (2441THZ) even if they're externally powered. The power source for my wired thermostats is the HVAC 24VAC supply.
DavidJ Posted July 22, 2017 Posted July 22, 2017 (edited) Has there been a solution posted to turn off this excessive logging of humidity for 2441TH? I plan to install 4 units and it makes the log difficult to comb through. Edited July 22, 2017 by DavidJ
apostolakisl Posted July 22, 2017 Posted July 22, 2017 I just checked my log. I have 9 thermostats and the log has 65,000 entries for humidity. I isolated one thermostat, 10,000 entries in less than 3 weeks. It appears that humidity reports as the actual 1-100 percent and reports with a single percent change. A typical interval is 1 minute. Temp on the other hand rarely reports and looks like it requires a 4 point change. It does not report the actual temp however, it is rescaled so I don't know what 4 points is in degrees F. The typical time interval is generally in the hours range. Now, what does this all mean? I don't know if all this traffic is adversely affecting anything.
DavidJ Posted July 26, 2017 Posted July 26, 2017 Of the two measures (temperature and humidity), it seems that temperature would be the more important data point to store in the log this frequently. It's as though the programmer was debugging humidity measurements and forgot to turn off this logging feature!
larryllix Posted July 27, 2017 Posted July 27, 2017 Of the two measures (temperature and humidity), it seems that temperature would be the more important data point to store in the log this frequently. It's as though the programmer was debugging humidity measurements and forgot to turn off this logging feature! It seems to me that the constant humidity update may have been designed to act as an Insteon heartbeat from the stat. Unfortunately ISY has no program feature using triggered events to detect the signal if the value doesn't change.
apostolakisl Posted July 27, 2017 Posted July 27, 2017 It seems to me that the constant humidity update may have been designed to act as an Insteon heartbeat from the stat. Unfortunately ISY has no program feature using triggered events to detect the signal if the value doesn't change. It isn't a constant update. It only sends when it changes. But it only takes a 1% change to trigger and it changes by 1% a lot.
BigMoose1 Posted July 27, 2017 Posted July 27, 2017 I have two 2447zth thermostats which I use to control fans In two separate rooms. I also have a significant number of humidity updates about 1 minute or so apart from both of them in the log. One of the thermostats has a 5 volt power supply and the other is battery powered. I think I have isolated the reason to air from the fans flowing across the units causing small humidity changes. I would also like to know if these updates are impacting the ISY operation. So far all I have done is save and clear the log once a month. This last month I had 55,000 entries in the log. Thanks
larryllix Posted July 27, 2017 Posted July 27, 2017 (edited) I have two 2447zth thermostats which I use to control fans In two separate rooms. I also have a significant number of humidity updates about 1 minute or so apart from both of them in the log. One of the thermostats has a 5 volt power supply and the other is battery powered. I think I have isolated the reason to air from the fans flowing across the units causing small humidity changes. I would also like to know if these updates are impacting the ISY operation. So far all I have done is save and clear the log once a month. This last month I had 55,000 entries in the log. Thanks That's only about one update every 45 seconds. The ISY CPU will outperform anything a totally flooded Insteon protocol channel could throw at it. Edited July 27, 2017 by larryllix
apostolakisl Posted July 27, 2017 Posted July 27, 2017 The isse as I see it is that it fills the log with a rediculous number of entries that just make it difficult to find anything else without first putting it into excel and then filtering out the 100,000 entries that are all 1% humidity changes. And I can tell you that with very still air, the humidity still changes by 1% every minutes or so. I have 5 thermostats in a building that sits unoccupied with the AC completely off for days on end and it still give is constantly bouncing by 1%. 1
larryllix Posted July 27, 2017 Posted July 27, 2017 (edited) It probably needs more radiant heat isolation between the humidty sensor and the electronic circuitry. Every time the transmitter sends a signal or executes some algorithm the extra heat drops the sensor RH%. My log file is 5.25 MByte since July 7 - July 27. I get a heartbeat from a Venstar stat every 45 seconds, ecobee3 stat every 60 seconds, WC8 weather station (8 values every 20 seconds), NRBridge RGBW LED software, and regular humidity reports from two 2441ZTH stats and updates from 4 CAO tags for humidity, temperature, battv, & X,Y,Z position every minute or so. I think UDI must have installed some log file size management, as last time I looked at it, it took almost an hour to load into Wordpad on a small machine. BTW: In v5.x I have noticed there is an an option checkbox for both my 2441ZTH stats "Send Humidity". I have no idea what it does or if it even functions. The option checkboxes do not stay set when loaded, each time. Edited July 27, 2017 by larryllix 1
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