andyf0 Posted January 23, 2015 Posted January 23, 2015 I am currently using programs with a lot of overhead assuming that with Z-Wave switches there is no difference between if "Control" vs if "Status". Does the ISY distinguish between local control and remote control of a switch? Thanks
oberkc Posted January 23, 2015 Posted January 23, 2015 That is an interesting question. I look forward to the answer. If you don't get satisfaction here, I wonder if a simple experiment might answer the question. If I needed to know the anwer to this, I think I would temprarily create a couple of simple programs: If Status zwave switch is on Then Nothing Else Nothing If Control zwave switch is on Then Nothing Else Nothing Toggle the switch manually on. Do both programs run? Toggle it off. Do both programs run? From there, control the switch through the ISY. Do both programs run? I am hoping that the clues from these experiments would yield a positive conclusion. The event viewer may also yield some clues.
416to305 Posted January 23, 2015 Posted January 23, 2015 It depends on the switch as most Z-Wave do not do instant status requiring you to poll it. So it's not possible to write a program that says "If control of Z-Wave switch is ON, do this or that". That's because the ISY doesn't know when manual control has happened. Some more expensive switches will update "instant" but there's still a couple second delay, so it would never be like Insteon where you can say "If the kitchen light is turned on, then turn the fire place on and the counter lights" type thing. I can guarantee the program suggestion above will not work. Just look in the ISY console at your Z-Wave switch and turn it on on the wall. Does it change to "On" in the ISY? Probably not, meaning control won't work, only status (once it polls).
Nestor Posted January 23, 2015 Posted January 23, 2015 Using a version of oberkc's program, (combining conditions with an "or"), I can confirm that the program never runs or shows as "true". I'm using GE Jasco switches.
andyf0 Posted January 23, 2015 Author Posted January 23, 2015 It depends on the switch as most Z-Wave do not do instant status requiring you to poll it. So it's not possible to write a program that says "If control of Z-Wave switch is ON, do this or that". That's because the ISY doesn't know when manual control has happened. Some more expensive switches will update "instant" but there's still a couple second delay, so it would never be like Insteon where you can say "If the kitchen light is turned on, then turn the fire place on and the counter lights" type thing. I can guarantee the program suggestion above will not work. Just look in the ISY console at your Z-Wave switch and turn it on on the wall. Does it change to "On" in the ISY? Probably not, meaning control won't work, only status (once it polls). I don't think you should be stating as general fact what happens in "your Z-Wave network". I don't have any experience with your EverLinc? switches but every one of my switches will report instantly when the paddle is pressed. This IS NOT "Instant Status" as you commonly quote. I have tried to steer you towards documents that explain the difference between "Association" & "Instant Status" in previous posts. I am using mostly Jasco (GE) On/Off switches and a couple of Jasco (GE) Dimmer Switches. I have one Leviton On/Off switch that does use "Instant Status" vs "Association", since it is out of range with the ISY directly, but really don't like the Leviton Style.
416to305 Posted January 23, 2015 Posted January 23, 2015 I don't think you should be stating as general fact what happens in "your Z-Wave network". I don't have any experience with your EverLinc? switches but every one of my switches will report instantly when the paddle is pressed. This IS NOT "Instant Status" as you commonly quote. I have tried to steer you towards documents that explain the difference between "Association" & "Instant Status" in previous posts. I am using mostly Jasco (GE) On/Off switches and a couple of Jasco (GE) Dimmer Switches. I have one Leviton On/Off switch that does use "Instant Status" vs "Association", since it is out of range with the ISY directly, but really don't like the Leviton Style. So if you're so smart then, why post a question asking if the ISY knows the difference between control or status since you already know the answer? If you have a Leviton device that supports their "instant status", then you can do what you want, but the majority of devices that are $50-60 for switches do not support that feature. I assumed your question meant that you had a typical Z-Wave switch and your programs using "Control" weren't working as otherwise why ask what you already know? Just tested my Leviton instant status switch with a control program and vs status and it works as expected same with Insteon, but for any Z-Wave device that needs to be polled, it's irrelevant as a program with "Control" is useless. Also maybe read a post before commenting, as you'll see I wrote "most Z-Wave devices do not do instant status, requiring you to poll it." Maybe you can point out to me where I said that whatever happens in "My Z-Wave network" as you say, is what goes? Trying to find that but don't see it anywhere?
oberkc Posted January 23, 2015 Posted January 23, 2015 I don't think you should be stating as general fact what happens in "your Z-Wave network". I don't have any experience with your EverLinc? switches but every one of my switches will report instantly when the paddle is pressed. This IS NOT "Instant Status" as you commonly quote. I have tried to steer you towards documents that explain the difference between "Association" & "Instant Status" in previous posts. I am using mostly Jasco (GE) On/Off switches and a couple of Jasco (GE) Dimmer Switches. I have one Leviton On/Off switch that does use "Instant Status" vs "Association", since it is out of range with the ISY directly, but really don't like the Leviton Style. Now, suddenly, I am missing something. If your devices DO report when pressed, I wonder why your program, earlier, did not run. This strikes me as inconsistent, or as an indication perhaps that the zwave command is not getting through, somehow.
andyf0 Posted January 23, 2015 Author Posted January 23, 2015 Now, suddenly, I am missing something. If your devices DO report when pressed, I wonder why your program, earlier, did not run. This strikes me as inconsistent, or as an indication perhaps that the zwave command is not getting through, somehow. That was Nestor that tried your programs and said nothing happens. I currently use "if status is ON" for my Z-Wave switches and they work fine. I was just wondering if "if CONTROL is switched ON" would work. It's easy to see them work ... open Event Viewer Level-3 and push the paddle on the switch.
oberkc Posted January 23, 2015 Posted January 23, 2015 That was Nestor that tried your programs and said nothing happens. I currently use "if status is ON" for my Z-Wave switches and they work fine. I was just wondering if "if CONTROL is switched ON" would work. It's easy to see them work ... open Event Viewer Level-3 and push the paddle on the switch. Sorry. I am easily confused.
Michel Kohanim Posted January 25, 2015 Posted January 25, 2015 Hi andyf0, They should work the same as INSTEON devices as long as you get status feedback. With kind regards, Michel
andyf0 Posted January 25, 2015 Author Posted January 25, 2015 Finally had time to sit down and try this. "if CONTROL" doesn't work with Z-Wave switches. I checked the state of the switch and it was changing from OFF to ON to OFF but there was no response to the program that had "if CONTROL Z-Wave-Switch is turned ON". Only "if STATUS Z-Wave-Switch is ON" worked. So it really doesn't work like INSTEON does.
oberkc Posted January 26, 2015 Posted January 26, 2015 I checked the state of the switch and it was changing from OFF to ON to OFF When you state that "it was changing", does this mean that you were manually turning on and off the switch, or by some other indirect means?
andyf0 Posted January 26, 2015 Author Posted January 26, 2015 I meant I was pressing the paddles on the switch. Please tell me I'm not the only one whose switches provide feedback to the ISY when their buttons are pressed........
Michel Kohanim Posted January 26, 2015 Posted January 26, 2015 Hi andyf0, I will check and get back to you. With kind regards, Michel
Michel Kohanim Posted January 26, 2015 Posted January 26, 2015 Hi andyf0, I am sorry for the wrong information. The issue is that, unlike INSTEON, Z-Wave switches just send a notification of something happening . We don't really know what happened without querying the device. We might be able to do some heuristic once we get scenes working. With kind regards, Michel
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