edokid Posted April 9, 2015 Posted April 9, 2015 Just thought I'd post this to help anyone else. Got this Z-Wave lock for Christmas and installed it on my front door no problem, works great with the ISY and could control it and what not without issue. Got home from vacation yesterday to find my door had been kicked right in, all the frame split, the strike plate with screws about 6 feet into the house and deadbolt still extended, not even a mark on the door. Police said the deadbolt wasn't a very good one that someone was able to basically use their shoulder to just shove the door in. It's also supposed to have some tamper alarm that sends off an alarm when the door is forced in, but even testing it with the police (extending the deadbolt and hitting it hard with a hammer or hand wouldn't make that alarm go off even with it enabled). I also have alerts in the ISY set to send notification if deadbolt is jammed or tamper is exceeded, neither of which triggered (there's also notifications if the door is unlocked, that does work when I tested it). So not sure what the lock considers jammed or tamper exceeded. What's annoying is I used to have it that any time the front door opened it would turn all the lights on if I was in away mode, but I disabled it since family was getting annoyed since we'd always forget to turn it off and then all the lights would go on with no easy way to reset everything back to the way it was. The back door to the kitchen had a much cheaper older deadbolt and it looks like they tried but couldn't get it to open, but the Schlage popped open easily. Luckily all they stole was a jar of change from the living room, opened all my drawers in my bedroom, and then stole a $800 bike from the garage by unlocking and opening the garage door from a KPL in the living room labeled "Garage" which is beyond scary. Just thought I'd share.
Teken Posted April 9, 2015 Posted April 9, 2015 First sorry to hear such an event happen to you. Having your home broken into is the most terrifying thing you can ever experience and come home to. You just never feel the same after such an event . . . I do have to point out that the lock is only part of the equation to force protection. I know its the current fad to use these new toys on the most used doors. But, realize with out upgrading all of the hardware that applies to the door frame assembly is simply a waste of time and effort. As you noted the strike plate is what failed and is often the case. You need to use a combination of (extended) strike plate exceeding 12" to spread the load upon being impacted. The door hinges also need to be upgraded along with the door plate as well. Couple this with 3-4" SS screws will ensure the supporting frame stays in place. It goes with out saying all of the above hardware is completely useless if the door has side windows or the door itself has an entire glass outlay. From a force protection stand point its the worst possible door you can have. You can enhance this area by using (which I highly recommend) by installing a out swinging security storm door. As I have indicated many times depending upon make, model, install, and hardware. It requires more than 100 - 500% more effort to penetrate this style door. Because it requires a person to pull or use some sort of crow bar to pull towards which requires more mechanical strength. And know just don't buy a regular storm door that will just cut the time down to 5 seconds . . . These are lower cost storm doors by Larson but there are many other great brands on the market: http://www.lowes.ca/security-doors/larson-garden-view-black-steel-security-door-36-in-w-x-81-in-h_11547348.html?af=3632&cse=3632&gclid=CM_rsZW06cQCFZOLaQodrqsAHA Couple this with a real grade 1 dead bolt from Medeco or similar real lock companies. The entire door would need to be pulled off with a vehicle. The following devices are what I use and deploy for our clients when speaking about the first line of protection and force protection: http://armorconcepts.com/Door-Jamb-Armor/ Use this for all exterior doors while at home: http://thedoorguardian.com/products/ <-- This product can not be circumvented by picking, kicking in, or jimmied. Do not use this device where a door is considered a fire exist. Unless you know how to use this product properly.
edokid Posted April 9, 2015 Author Posted April 9, 2015 Awesome thanks so much, and yes it's true I shouldn't put the blame on the lock as I was checking other sites and products that sell rebar and when you compare those to what you get with the deadbolt, the deadbolt is really more for an honest person I think. One of those things where you never expect it can happen to you! We have 2 homes and I had removed my cameras to monitor my rabbits at my other place while we were away, worst timing! Although I'm sort of glad as actually seeing it happen on the camera I think might make it worse. Going to see if I can get some of those Z-Wave strobe or sirens as well and start using away mode more!
Teken Posted April 9, 2015 Posted April 9, 2015 Awesome thanks so much, and yes it's true I shouldn't put the blame on the lock as I was checking other sites and products that sell rebar and when you compare those to what you get with the deadbolt, the deadbolt is really more for an honest person I think. One of those things where you never expect it can happen to you! We have 2 homes and I had removed my cameras to monitor my rabbits at my other place while we were away, worst timing! Although I'm sort of glad as actually seeing it happen on the camera I think might make it worse. Going to see if I can get some of those Z-Wave strobe or sirens as well and start using away mode more! Yes, I can tell you from personal experience seeing the event live or played back is pretty upsetting. I am unsure if you are going to pursue this via home insurance. If so I would humbly suggest you pay a little extra for a more robust door, framing, and the hardware I provided. When I built my home all of the exterior door framing was upgraded to 2 X 8 timber. This was sandwiched to 4-6 other 2 X 8 timber frames. The header and the bottom plate was also re-enforced in the same manner. This provides an extremely strong framing structure which can not be moved by a human force. Does this site have a monitored alarm system??
edokid Posted April 9, 2015 Author Posted April 9, 2015 Yeah we aren't doing insurance just since all they took was some change and the $800 bike from the garage so not worth it but I'm definitely going to upgrade all the door hardware. Does which site have monitored alarm? I was looking at www.kickproof.com or something similar.
edokid Posted April 9, 2015 Author Posted April 9, 2015 I forgot to add one sort of good piece with it. When I was away I logged into the admin console and I noticed it said Guest Bath motion sensor ON, but the guest bath light was off. It's linked as a direct scene as well, so I thought that was odd and just assumed something was glitching since I figured how can the motion be on but the lights are off. Just to be on the safe side though I hit all on for the lights, and now I'm thinking I wonder if the motion was on since someone was in the bathroom, lights came on, they turned them off manually, and I just happened to notice at the exact moment and scared them away by hitting the all on, since it really seemed like they were in and out super fast, laptops and everything were sitting out in plain sight that they ignored and instead took a jar of change.
Teken Posted April 9, 2015 Posted April 9, 2015 Yeah we aren't doing insurance just since all they took was some change and the $800 bike from the garage so not worth it but I'm definitely going to upgrade all the door hardware. Does which site have monitored alarm? I was looking at www.kickproof.com or something similar. Yeah, you really do have to balance the loss versus making a claim and also taking a hit on your premium. I would highly suggest you look for a local CS (Central Station) to monitor your home. I don't want to scare you but one hard truth is once someone has been broken into the odds of another break in is higher. This is because they know what contents are present and available now. If this is a home that is not occupied very often its safe to say (generally speaking) this wasn't a chance encounter. Stats clearly show such break ins are planned after watching a home for a period of time. Depending upon how much this is a career for them. This can be a one time smash and grab, or escalate to a revisit. I would urge you if this is not your primary residence remove all valuables and any items which do not need to be there. Since you have Insteon and the controller a lived in look should be easy to attain. As I have noted many times all of the electronics in the world is nothing when compared to force protection. This is the primary area that must be addressed, once done you can add in all the bells and whistles you like. What is troubling in this time we all live in is the fact many of the break ins are happening during broad day light. Thieves all know people like you and me are not at home generally from 9-5. I would humbly suggest you engage your neighbours so they can be aware and also be a look out for one another. Ensure you start some kind of community watch program with the local police. Doing so will allow you to place those community placards in your area after XX meetings and buy in from the local area residence. This sounds like a lot of work and effort which it is! But, realize two things here: Security is a lifestyle and is for the long term. This is not like the weather where it comes and goes this is for a lifetime. Starting up a community effort will help not only you but the area as a whole and lets the police know your area is serious. This also has the advantage of making them do more drive bys as part of their patrol routine. Once you get in good with the lead community police officer its not a hard thing to ask them to get the boys in blue to make a few extra trips to your area. I forgot to add one sort of good piece with it. When I was away I logged into the admin console and I noticed it said Guest Bath motion sensor ON, but the guest bath light was off. It's linked as a direct scene as well, so I thought that was odd and just assumed something was glitching since I figured how can the motion be on but the lights are off. Just to be on the safe side though I hit all on for the lights, and now I'm thinking I wonder if the motion was on since someone was in the bathroom, lights came on, they turned them off manually, and I just happened to notice at the exact moment and scared them away by hitting the all on, since it really seemed like they were in and out super fast, laptops and everything were sitting out in plain sight that they ignored and instead took a jar of change.
edokid Posted April 9, 2015 Author Posted April 9, 2015 Yeah that part I def know about them returning, which sucks! It is our primary residence but we have a condo downtown as well that we are at more often now, usually it's just me alone in the house when there. So going to change the doors or reenforce etc all entry ways first and make a point of not leaving laptops and what not just sitting out on the couch. We have a safe in the bedroom which has SO much jewelry in it which luckily they couldn't get at as that would have been like $20k+ in losses right there. Sucks since makes me not want to be there at all, but I think I just have to get over it and not let those losers win lol. There's definitely alarm companies here as we're in Toronto, just seemed overkill since our neighbourhood super safe and the police said they haven't had any other reported b&e's in the area lately. We've just always been hesitant on an alarm since I've always been told those calls are the lowest priority call you can get. Like when I came home and saw the door kicked in, I went in and checked the place out but online it said never enter call the police first. I called them, FIVE hours before they showed up! She comes in checks the place takes notes, then says she has to call in the forensics unit to come take pictures and dust for prints and might be a few hours for that! We told them just forget it since we had no plans on staying there last night. So just not sure how helpful it is if it takes that long for them to respond.
Teken Posted April 9, 2015 Posted April 9, 2015 Yeah that part I def know about them returning, which sucks! It is our primary residence but we have a condo downtown as well that we are at more often now, usually it's just me alone in the house when there. So going to change the doors or reenforce etc all entry ways first and make a point of not leaving laptops and what not just sitting out on the couch. We have a safe in the bedroom which has SO much jewelry in it which luckily they couldn't get at as that would have been like $20k+ in losses right there. Sucks since makes me not want to be there at all, but I think I just have to get over it and not let those losers win lol. There's definitely alarm companies here as we're in Toronto, just seemed overkill since our neighbourhood super safe and the police said they haven't had any other reported b&e's in the area lately. We've just always been hesitant on an alarm since I've always been told those calls are the lowest priority call you can get. Like when I came home and saw the door kicked in, I went in and checked the place out but online it said never enter call the police first. I called them, FIVE hours before they showed up! She comes in checks the place takes notes, then says she has to call in the forensics unit to come take pictures and dust for prints and might be a few hours for that! We told them just forget it since we had no plans on staying there last night. So just not sure how helpful it is if it takes that long for them to respond. Unfortunately, what you describe is very true. This is why people need to take proactive steps on their own to ensure their most expensive investment is well protected. Work on the force protection for all lower basement windows, exterior doors, and GDO. If you have motion lights ensure they operate and the length of time is set appropriately. Since you have the ISY Series Controller you can use the random feature to set specific lights to go on and off. Bring back the camera and hope it serves some back up purpose in the future. A security alarm system is not simply for break ins. Its to monitor for all out of band incidence that may occur such as sump failure, flood condition, low temp freeze, fire, CO, personal distress (heart attack) etc. Most insurance companies offer a discount for having said alarm system. The reality is if you had an alarm system you would have known right away. It would not have changed the breach of the door but you wouldn't be finding out about it hours or days later. A security alarm system is part of a eco system and lifestyle which is intended to assist the end users in monitoring and rendering support when needed. Active perimeter lighting is also key in force protection as it does not leave dark spaces to be used or hidden. Security camera's if deployed correctly also add in the security element. If your lifestyle can support a dog. You simply can not do better than a man's best friend. Well, besides a gun . . . Key take away's moving forward is to watch and know your surroundings. Repeated B&E's are like rape incidents, meaning 90% of all rapes are done by known people. Meaning, the people (if outside of a random B&E) are located with in 10 miles of your residence. From my vantage point I can see more than 150 houses and I know who is home, when, were, and how. I could kick in their door and take a flat screen TV in under 120 seconds and be gone. None of them know I can see right into their bedrooms etc. This is the power and fault with PTZ camera's. You can scan and see a large area with out being detected etc.
edokid Posted April 9, 2015 Author Posted April 9, 2015 Definitely makes sense, as we have 2 homes it's not hard for people to know we are usually downtown as well. I noticed that also when checking one alarm system, said 25% off my home insurance with Allstate so that makes up for a large amount of the cost so I think I'll look into it. The Rogers home monitoring one is funny, does locks, motion etc but it's all obviously Z-Wave devices, wonder if they let you BYO I think I definitely would like to get one to at least monitor motion and if a door or window is broken as that's the main things for me. The leak sensor actually kept going off while I was away but it was just damp on the floor. I had unlocked the lock remotely and let my neighbour in to check it then locked it once he left. I'm wondering if it didn't fully engage or something even though it said Locked on the ISY.
Teken Posted April 9, 2015 Posted April 9, 2015 Definitely makes sense, as we have 2 homes it's not hard for people to know we are usually downtown as well. I noticed that also when checking one alarm system, said 25% off my home insurance with Allstate so that makes up for a large amount of the cost so I think I'll look into it. The Rogers home monitoring one is funny, does locks, motion etc but it's all obviously Z-Wave devices, wonder if they let you BYO I think I definitely would like to get one to at least monitor motion and if a door or window is broken as that's the main things for me. The leak sensor actually kept going off while I was away but it was just damp on the floor. I had unlocked the lock remotely and let my neighbour in to check it then locked it once he left. I'm wondering if it didn't fully engage or something even though it said Locked on the ISY. 25% discount is fantastic to hear in reduction of your home owners insurance. Any time you reduce the (risk) for the insurance co they love it. Moving forward take sometime to do a home inventory and use some of that smart tech you have like (smartphone) and take pictures of all of your furniture, appliances, electronics, clothes etc. I would highly suggest you go to the bank and open a safe deposit box. The annual fee is deductible from your annual CCRA tax return. Only keep bare essentials as its obvious neither of you wear all of this at one single time. Move all important documents to that safe deposit box so you're not insulted on another level by *Idenity Theft*. At this moment you should be placing a call to your CC company and bank and explain to them you were broken into. That you want your account flagged moving forward. This is a little painful but basically any loans will require a minimum of 24 (cooling off period) to be accepted and reviewed before being processed. The CC will flag your account to ensure any out of band spending is noted and monitored. This type of service is free and also shows the bank / CC you're aware and on top of it. Meaning any fraud that happens at this point is not your problem and you will not have to absorb the loss.
edokid Posted April 9, 2015 Author Posted April 9, 2015 Thanks all good tips for sure. I'm so bad with electronics, I have so much I don't even know what there is to the point that when they ask if any electronics were stolen it's like uh lol, probably wouldn't even notice. I feel like they were just looking for drugs or money since they left all the electronics and I even had packages from Amazon right at the door in the mailbox clearly visible that they ignored. They even had to step over a Playstation Vita and Kindle I left on the stairs, and then they had taken a few items out of my top night table drawer and put them on the bed (old iPod box) but RIGHT under the bed literally right at their feet was a MacBook Air with another one on the couch in the living room 2 feet away from the jar of loose change they took. In a way I'm kind of glad they took the bike as well though as it's almost more creepy to have someone break in and not touch anything other than going into my drawer in the bedroom taking a few items out on the bed, and then closing the drawer after them. They also took a bottle of rum that I had in the bedroom just sitting on the shelf.
Teken Posted April 9, 2015 Posted April 9, 2015 On a side note please do ensure you use and deploy the *Door Guardians* properly. I have them mounted at the top and bottom of each door which allows the impact force to spread out across the entire door panel assembly. Outside of cutting open the door with a sawzaw a door can not be breached even with a door ram. This assumes the door is of some decent quality and not some cheap 24 gauge thin steel door. The over all idea is to spread the force and load across all framing and door assemblies. Good Luck!
Xathros Posted April 9, 2015 Posted April 9, 2015 Just wanted to say Thank you to Teken for all of the valuable advice and information provided both in this thread and throughout these forums. You have given me much to think about in terms of my own home's security and sustainability. -Xathros
edokid Posted April 9, 2015 Author Posted April 9, 2015 Likewise, was at work so my replies a bit shorter but planning on reading the responses in more detail soon, really appreciate it!
Michel Kohanim Posted April 10, 2015 Posted April 10, 2015 Hi edokid, I am so very sorry to hear and thanks so very much for the feedback. With kind regards, Michel
edokid Posted April 12, 2015 Author Posted April 12, 2015 Hey Teken, The Door Guardian you mention, I bought them earlier at Canadian Tire but they say on them to childproof inward swinging doors, and then mentions also for adults with memory problems etc, but doesn't say anything about for security even on their site. Is that correct? Just wondering where you have it installed, as the manual shows they have it just over the deadbolt, but you mentioned using them to distribute the load more if someone kicks it. Just wondering if it makes more sense to put it on the top of the door since I'm getting one of those metal floor to ceiling type frames for the side the deadbolt goes into to replace the crappy strike plate. Just making sure this is right since it doesn't mention anything about kicking the door. Thanks! Oh one other quick question, how are the Elk security systems or should I just avoid DIY? Family is really against an alarm for some reason, and we don't have a phone line so when I checked with Alarmforce and ADT it was like $35 for just some cellular device, and Rogers is expensive without their internet. All we really want is if the door is kicked in again or motion, to have sirens go off to scare them away. Can do that with Z-Wave and the ISY but I don't trust it as much as a dedicated alarm. I believe I can get someone to monitor the Elk as well if necessary. I've seen it on here many times mentioned but not sure what makes the most sense as the Elk isn't overly cheap either but does seem more fun to play with.
Teken Posted April 12, 2015 Posted April 12, 2015 Hey Teken, The Door Guardian you mention, I bought them earlier at Canadian Tire but they say on them to childproof inward swinging doors, and then mentions also for adults with memory problems etc, but doesn't say anything about for security even on their site. Is that correct? Just wondering where you have it installed, as the manual shows they have it just over the deadbolt, but you mentioned using them to distribute the load more if someone kicks it. Just wondering if it makes more sense to put it on the top of the door since I'm getting one of those metal floor to ceiling type frames for the side the deadbolt goes into to replace the crappy strike plate. Just making sure this is right since it doesn't mention anything about kicking the door. Thanks! Oh one other quick question, how are the Elk security systems or should I just avoid DIY? Family is really against an alarm for some reason, and we don't have a phone line so when I checked with Alarmforce and ADT it was like $35 for just some cellular device, and Rogers is expensive without their internet. All we really want is if the door is kicked in again or motion, to have sirens go off to scare them away. Can do that with Z-Wave and the ISY but I don't trust it as much as a dedicated alarm. I believe I can get someone to monitor the Elk as well if necessary. I've seen it on here many times mentioned but not sure what makes the most sense as the Elk isn't overly cheap either but does seem more fun to play with. I have them installed above and below the door about 12" from the top / bottom. Used in this configuration along with the door knob locked & the dead bolt. You have four areas secured from impact. Couple this with the door armor kit will spread the forces across the entire door frame. Here is an example for a nice visual. Ideals are peaceful - History is violent
Teken Posted April 13, 2015 Posted April 13, 2015 Hey Teken, Oh one other quick question, how are the Elk security systems or should I just avoid DIY? Family is really against an alarm for some reason, and we don't have a phone line so when I checked with Alarmforce and ADT it was like $35 for just some cellular device, and Rogers is expensive without their internet. All we really want is if the door is kicked in again or motion, to have sirens go off to scare them away. Can do that with Z-Wave and the ISY but I don't trust it as much as a dedicated alarm. I believe I can get someone to monitor the Elk as well if necessary. I've seen it on here many times mentioned but not sure what makes the most sense as the Elk isn't overly cheap either but does seem more fun to play with. Nothing wrong in going the DIY route if you have the time, access, and experience. Hard wiring is the preferred and mandatory way to ensure a reliable and secure alarm system. Wireless sensors should only be used for layering or where access is impossible to route wires. It doesn't matter the brand of wireless device the reality is we as humans are lazy, forgetful, and busy. If you consider how many times you have performed a monthly smoke alarm test and a GFCI / AFCI test. You can be assured it could be counted on one hand . . . I have not met / read of one single person in more than 35 years who has performed the above tests on a consistent basis. Never mind documenting said process and procedures for audit purposes. More than likely I am the only person you will ever hear about doing such steps outside of a commercial facility where this is part of their SOP. I do this because this is part of my cUL insurance requirements and thus am provided extreme discounts for *less risk*. Many people have had great success with the ELK system along with the ISY integration. It provides a lot of flexibility and integrates well with Insteon HA. I am not one of those people who use ELK or allow any HA system to have command and control of my security alarm system. This is because its against UL / cUL and is not endorsed or certified as being allowed in said applications. Having said this my security alarm system is fully aware of the HA system and can control many elements of my homes electrical system. The difference is that the alarm system has command and control of the home and its not reliant or controlled by another 3rd party system. Isolation of systems is not only expected but a requirement for business, enterprise, and commercial applications. My home is designed and built around many facets of these elements so am able to take advantage of the same techniques and deployment. Regardless of the alarm system you decide to purchase some key elements should be considered and planned. Since this is an existing home many of these elements simply can't be done with out huge labour costs etc. So this is more for information purposes for anyone considering such a project when under renovation or building a new home. - Always run extra pairs of CAT6, 22-4, 18-2 wire, coaxial, wire in all areas. - Install at least two key pads one at the entry another in the master bedroom. - Program the panel to *Ring Back* an acknowledgement of the arm, disarm, stay status to the CS. - When using Instant, stay, or special arming modes always reduce the count down to less than 15 seconds. - Always monitor the GDO status via the alarm system. - Deploy glass break sensors in all levels: Basement, Main, 2nd floor. - Use dual tech sensors when ever you can that have microwave / IR. - Cross over zones should always enable 100% room monitor coverage. - Never lease a system always buy it out right. - Ensure the installer code is changed once its in place. - Ensure the program lock out is not enabled by the installer. - Always program a *Duress* code and have on file a duress command word. - Most alarm systems have a basic 4/6 digit code option. Use 6 and don't use your DOB, etc More custom alarm system allow 12 digit rolling codes with challenge words. - Do not program the system to show bypassed zones when armed. - The installer should always provide a load calculation that falls with in the manufactures specs for wire length and voltage drop. - Always install a second exterior siren up high in the garage ceiling. - Install an exterior strobe light to ensure the police, ems, fire knows which house is in distress. - Program the siren duration for the maximum allowed in your province for fire, break in, etc. - Ensure the siren repeat cycle is set correctly for each mode. - Always ensure the alarm panel is secured with both security screws and a key latch. - Always perform a walk, creep, attack time test twice a year to ensure the sensors are well calibrated. - Have the security company perform a security audit to identify weakness, potential threats, and vulnerability. - Perform monthly cycle tests and battery run time tests on the alarm system. - Always upgrade the standard 7 Ah battery to a larger capacity. - Always ensure the EOL resistors are placed at the sensor and not at the panel. - Two form authentication should always be used for remote access: PIN code, User name, Password. More advanced systems use a rolling key card like I do. - If you decide to use a access control system always ensure the exterior pad requires PIN & Card. - Its always good practice to have the alarm system auto arm. - Always call in to confirm and validate who are the listed *Key Holders* along with *Secret / Duress* phrase(s). - Always have someone who you can trust and is (available) to check in on the home while away and is listed with the CS. - Enable bell *Squawk* where required in the arm, disarm, stay, force, instant modes. - Never allow delay counters to exceed 60 seconds when cross over zones are not enabled. - If you're Jewish there are a few companies that have a *Shabat Mode* this allows you to be somewhat compliant. - Always wire for tamper on all sensors and panel and do not program to ignore tamper on arm. - Not all pet immune sensors are made equal. Ensure the tech knows the size, type, and breed of animal. - Do not install indoor rated sensor outdoors, ever. - Follow installation guide lines with respect to height / distance, and material adjustments for glass, impact sensors. - If you deploy magnetic locking always follow fire codes with respect to *Fail Safe* modes. Fail Secure modes are not allowed to be used in residential installs. - Wireless sensors should always be set to report in at the shortest intervals. - Always use caution with RF rejection detection mode with RF sensors. Many are prone to false alerts. - If your system takes special batteries always have plenty of spares on hand. 7-11 isn't going to have them at 3:00 AM - Always program the key pad to force you to clear each fault from the system. Do not let the system clear the fault upon arm / disarm. - Always balance your needs with the system needs. Do not program the system to ignore basic faults like loss of line capture, send fail, device failure, failure to communicate, battery low, etc. Much more but I gots to go eat dinner . . .
edokid Posted April 13, 2015 Author Posted April 13, 2015 Wow thanks for such a detailed post that's a huge help! I'm just trying to determine the best route to go, either ADT etc or looking at Elk or what not. It's mainly because my house is a semi-detached in a fairly busy area with just an average size front yard and small back yard with detached garage as I'm basically downtown Toronto so no such thing as a yard. So my house isn't like by itself or a huge distance between other houses and what not. Right now with the ISY I can do the Z-Wave door locks, thermostat, have motion sensors, can control almost all lights etc and even have IP cameras throughout just not set to record but will be soon. I'm going to write better HA programs for when I'm away, such as random lights, and really looking forward to v5.0 variables because I'd like to set outside lights to always be on, just maybe 20% brightness, but if motion is detected go up to 100% then return back to where it was etc, that coupled with changing things like not leaving electronics out or easily accessible. So what I'm really just looking for is door sensors for the 2 doors on my first floor and 2 windows, as well as motion sensors inside first floor and probably a door sensor on the 2nd floor and eventually all windows etc. Mostly just want it so if someone kicks the door in again, breaks the window, even somehow uses my door code but doesn't disarm the alarm, the sirens and strobes all go off and send me a notification. Central office monitoring would be nice but I really don't think it's that necessary only because if a siren and strobes are going off, there's probably 50 people all within just 200 feet of me so no one would be hanging around for long, especially if everything is hidden and not easy pickings. So that's why I thought maybe something like the Elk might be interesting if it can also talk to the ISY, so if the alarm goes off, turn on every light in the house or things like that. I don't want the ISY to ever be able to arm or disarm the alarm though, would want it more I think for things like when arming in away mode enable the "Random Lived in Look" program etc. Just not sure if it's still easier to pay or get a professional system installed paid monthly or go DIY with Elk, as from what I've heard any time an alarm goes off the cops show hours after so not sure how worth it it is.
Teken Posted April 13, 2015 Posted April 13, 2015 Self monitoring is a very bad idea. Imagine you just pissed me off from taking that nice Mac Book Air? So I just dropped a match and light your house on fire? By the time the fire has developed your house will be gone. A CS will provide that layer and reporting to police, fire department etc. I would ask you to simply consider all the people who ignore car alarms. A house alarm is simply on a much larger scale. Ideals are peaceful - History is violent
xKing Posted April 13, 2015 Posted April 13, 2015 I agree on self-monitoring being a bad idea - central station will always respond, while you may be out without cell coverage, dead phone battery or just unable to take the call. I use DSC system (installed myself but house has been pre-wired by the builder) plus EnvisaLink and DSCLink (thanks, io_guy) to integrate with ISY. I would 100% agree on installing Tamper detection contacts, I don't think I've ever seen a residential/light commercial system which would remain operational if intruder rips off the keypad and shorts red and black. Unless keypad is wireless of course (but wireless brings another bunch of problems like RF jam).
stusviews Posted April 13, 2015 Posted April 13, 2015 A security system should be fully functional without POCO power.
edokid Posted April 13, 2015 Author Posted April 13, 2015 The DSC looks interesting and much less expensive than the Elk so with that monitoring option that's definitely good. It's not that I don't want monitoring, it's the fact that the police themselves have said that alarm calls are the lowest priority, and when we called them after being broken into it was 5 hours before they showed. I already have the ISY doing leak monitoring, temperature etc, so any alarm I get I wouldn't have it do that as well, it would just be for siren and notifying the police but again not sure how valuable that is if they aren't going to show for hours since no one would even be there any longer. A neighbour would be there long before, but definitely going to look into it. Was thinking if I did the DSC with Internet Monitoring I'd just buy an LTE cellular modem, they start at like $5 a month for 100MB of usage and then scale up, so would need that anyway since no phone line.
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