Smart Meter reading over Zigbee SEP 1.1

[fisix]

Hi there,

 

Recently, I purchased a software defined radio (SDR) to attempt to read and decode the broadcast readings from my electrical meter.  It was mainly for fun, but I had hoped it would work and I could get real time data without having to manually access SoCalEd's slow website and screw around with downloading data through that.

 

So far, it hasn't worked.  And, it appears that SoCal Edison allows certain devices to communicate with the meter over Zigbee, but it requires a SEP 1.1 stack and some kind of certificate or other.  

 

Does UDI have an add-on that would allow me to read my electricity usage directly through the meter broadcasts?  I have an ISY 994i, but no wireless/rf addons.  

 

Alternatively, does anyone know of a decent bridge that might work well with within the UDI device-sphere?

 

What I really want is just a way to retrieve, store, and plot the real time usage data - having it tie in directly with my ISY home control would be icing on the cake.

 

Thanks.

[paulbates]

Hi and welcome to the UDI forums!

 

Yes. There is a specific model for it, but its really an adapter card and a couple of software modules you can choose from if you already have an ISY.

 

https://www.universal-devices.com/utility/isy-994i-zs-series/

 

One of UDI's main commercial segments is power management. Call them or send in a support ticket and they can walk you through the most cost effective way to do it

 

Paul

[MWareman]

There is a Zigbee/SEP compatible ISY that does exactly this.

 

I'm not sure it's possible to add the power meter compatible radio to an existing ISY though... likely due to the crypto security involved. This is a different radio than the general Zigbee radio that's available as an option.

 

There really is no way to do this without engaging your power supplier (I'm going thru this with ComEd right now...)

[fisix]

Thanks guys, much appreciated.  I also did better searching after I posted and:

 

I saw the radio (even says SEP 1.1) on the UDI sales site here:

https://www.universal-devices.com/sales/

 

So it looks like the addon is available.  And SCE lists the ZS as compatible (see below for a copy and past from their website).

 

And there's this post:

 

http://forum.universal-devices.com/topic/16158-help-with-getting-zs-upgrade-running/?hl=%22smart+meter%22

 

So it's not a slam dunk that I'll get what I want.  I need to check with UDI to see if I can draw off the data the way I want.

 

There's also this:

 

https://rainforestautomation.com/rfa-z114-eagle-200/

 

But I don't know if it'll do what I want and I can't seem to be able to purchase one yet.  There's also these devices from digi:

http://www.semiconductorstore.com/cart/pc/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=62940

http://www.semiconductorstore.com/cart/pc/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=62349

 

But it's not clear whether they work with SCE or if they work well, and they don't appear to link up with the UDI (at least not yet).

 

I wish the SDR route had worked.

 

 

 

Smart Energy Profile 1.0/1.1 specification: Please note that we have not tested features of the device that are not currently supported by our programs.

Device Type MFG/ Model SEP Certified Confirmed Compatibility Energy Usage Text Load Control Energy Price Display

AzTech/S 000-0600 1.1 5/14/2012 X X   X Display

Rainforest/EMU1 RFA-Z105 1.1 10/17/2012 X X   X Display

Rainforest/EMU2 RFA-Z105-2 1.1 11/1/2012 X X   X Thermostat

ecobee/3.1.0.662 1.1 11/1/2012 X X X X Gateway

ADT PulseSM/- 1.1 8/17/2012 X X     Gateway Digi/
50X2E-Z1R-001-01 1.1 1/23/13 X X     Gateway

Ember/Emberpulse BBSE 1.1  1/6/2016 X X    X Gateway

Universal Devices/ISY-994i ZS 1.1 9/6/13 X X X   Gateway

Rainforest Eagle/RFA-Z109 1.1 9/20/13 X X     Thermostat

Emerson/EE542-1Z 1.1 11/12/13 X X X   Thermostat

Energate/Pioneer Z100 1.1 5/4/2012   X X   Thermostat

Energate/Foundation FZ100 1.1 5/15/13 X X X   Display

JetLun/RD77723 1.1 2/14/2014 X X   X

[fisix]

If you have any thoughts on whether the ZS addon will allow me to extract usage data to a third party device, please let me know.

 

Thanks!

[Michel Kohanim]

fisix,

 

ZS allows you get usage data from the meter. It does not send it anywhere else except to clients that subscribe to ISY. In short, there's NO third party integration for sending this data anywhere else.

 

With kind regards,

Michel

[fisix]

Thanks Michel,

 

Is there a way for me to access the data using, for example, a script running on a server on the same subnet as the ISY994?  Or can I set up the ISY to email data somewhere?

 

I think you see where I'm going - I'd like to be able to extract the data in some automatic way so that I can have more control over how the data is processed.

 

Also, since I have you here, did you ever resolve the extra meter information request mentioned here?

http://forum.universal-devices.com/topic/16158-help-with-getting-zs-upgrade-running/?hl=%22smart+meter%22

 

I ask, because I also have a grid-tied solar system.

 

Appreciate any help.  Also, would I just purchase the Zigbee antenna, or would I need to purchase the Energy plugin as well?  

 

Note - I currently have the Network plugin (to link up with Alexa).

 

Again, thanks!

[Teken]

Thanks Michel,

 

Is there a way for me to access the data using, for example, a script running on a server on the same subnet as the ISY994?  Or can I set up the ISY to email data somewhere?

 

I think you see where I'm going - I'd like to be able to extract the data in some automatic way so that I can have more control over how the data is processed.

 

Also, since I have you here, did you ever resolve the extra meter information request mentioned here?

http://forum.universal-devices.com/topic/16158-help-with-getting-zs-upgrade-running/?hl=%22smart+meter%22

 

I ask, because I also have a grid-tied solar system.

 

Appreciate any help.  Also, would I just purchase the Zigbee antenna, or would I need to purchase the Energy plugin as well?  

 

Note - I currently have the Network plugin (to link up with Alexa).

 

Again, thanks!

 

When you purchase the ZigBee hardware this comes with the Energy Plugin. Since you have the Network Module you can definitely use and send the data to some other 3rd party service / on site data server. A perfect example is the *How To* wrote to connect to SEG *Smart Energy Group*. The basic principle is the same for other cloud hosted services. 

[Michel Kohanim]

Hi fisix,

 

Yes, you can have something that polls ISY (or subscribes to ISY) and then take the data and do whatever you wish.

 

I really don't know where to look at the other forum post. All data points are detailed in our WSDK/docs/OR-WS-SDK-Manual-Energy Management.pdf. You can find the WSDK here:

https://www.universal-devices.com/isy-developers/

 

With kind regards,

Michel

[fisix]

Thanks Teken!

 

Is this the thread to the how to?

http://forum.universal-devices.com/topic/12682-energy-monitoring-circuits-plugs-interface/

 

Or is it somewhere else?

[Michel Kohanim]

Hi fisix,

 

http://wiki.universal-devices.com/index.php?title=Main_Page#Smart_Grid-ISY994_ZS_Series

 

With kind regards,

Michel

[Teken]

Thanks FPS!

 

Is this the thread to the how to?

http://forum.universal-devices.com/topic/12682-energy-monitoring-circuits-plugs-interface/

 

Or is it somewhere else?

 

Post 59 from my partner in crime Xathros gives a quick snap shot. Post 61 from me in that same thread details how I sent 1 wire temperature data from my Autelis Bridge to SEG.

 

The basic principle are the same but do want to call out a few caveats. SEG for the longest time was free to use and have as many widgets, charts, dials, a person could ever want. Unfortunately due to the massive increase in popularity Sam at SEG saw a increase in bandwidth and storage costs to host all the historic data. Because of this he had to go to a free ~ paid tiered service.

 

Regardless, Sam offers one of the best cloud hosted services to connect what ever and have that data represented into visual charts / graphs. There are several other so called free sites but you will need to determine what their limitations are. It really comes down to use case and your needs and speaking only for myself this was my thought process.

 

My goal of any *Cloud Hosted* service was to offer more flexibility, fail over, and sharing. For long term use and to ensure privacy & security all of the data is stored on site where I have complete control over. I don't need to worry someone is going to close shop, start charging a monthly fee, or sell my data to someone. I can safely state that if Energy Monitoring / Energy Management is not a passing fad.

 

Please do consider purchasing a Brultech Green Eye Monitor (GEM) and Dash Box (DB): http://www.brultech.com/

 

The GEM tightly integrates with the ISY Series Controller for Home Automation where a person naturally transitions from Energy Monitoring to Energy Management. 

[fisix]

Hi fisix,

 

Yes, you can have something that polls ISY (or subscribes to ISY) and then take the data and do whatever you wish.

 

I really don't know where to look at the other forum post. All data points are detailed in our WSDK/docs/OR-WS-SDK-Manual-Energy Management.pdf. You can find the WSDK here:

https://www.universal-devices.com/isy-developers/

 

With kind regards,

Michel

 

 

I think the specific comment was near the end:

 

The poster noted:

 

 

I also have a 994i-ZS already paired with our local utility's bi-directional smart meter on the side of my house. I can see the demand signal and summation received reading on the meter in the ISY.

 

I am also a solar customer and deliver considerable energy to the utility during parts of the day.

 

I believe the SEP 1.x protocol sent from the meter has the delivered register, but the ISY does not grab it as a value.

 

Can someone from ISY tell me if it is possible to grab the delivered register from my meter in the ISY?

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

 

 

 

 

I'd like to make an official request to include the received data. As an ISY user myself, and as our local utility manager that will be rolling out OpenADR this year and already has Zigbee enabled meters.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

and you replied:

 

Hi Tim,

 

Of course. Please read my response to your PM. Since we already have a working relationship with your team, it would be best to continue going that route so that all features can be properly tested.

 

With kind regards,

Michel

 

 

 

That's the stuff I was mentioning.  

[Michel Kohanim]

Hi fisix,

 

currSumReceived/Delivered are all supported. You might have to go to 5.0.x for currSumReceived.

 

For future reference, referring us back to a forum post is much harder to manage than just saying what you are seek.

 

With kind regards,

Michel

[fisix]

Post 59 from my partner in crime Xathros gives a quick snap shot. Post 61 from me in that same thread details how I sent 1 wire temperature data from my Autelis Bridge to SEG.

 

The basic principle are the same but do want to call out a few caveats. SEG for the longest time was free to use and have as many widgets, charts, dials, a person could ever want. Unfortunately due to the massive increase in popularity Sam at SEG saw a increase in bandwidth and storage costs to host all the historic data. Because of this he had to go to a free ~ paid tiered service.

 

Regardless, Sam offers one of the best cloud hosted services to connect what ever and have that data represented into visual charts / graphs. There are several other so called free sites but you will need to determine what their limitations are. It really comes down to use case and your needs and speaking only for myself this was my thought process.

 

My goal of any *Cloud Hosted* service was to offer more flexibility, fail over, and sharing. For long term use and to ensure privacy & security all of the data is stored on site where I have complete control over. I don't need to worry someone is going to close shop, start charging a monthly fee, or sell my data to someone. I can safely state that if Energy Monitoring / Energy Management is not a passing fad.

 

Please do consider purchasing a Brultech Green Eye Monitor (GEM) and Dash Box (DB): http://www.brultech.com/

 

The GEM tightly integrates with the ISY Series Controller for Home Automation where a person naturally transitions from Energy Monitoring to Energy Management. 

 

 

I will definitely take a look, thank you.  My initial look seemed to indicate that the Btech systems were more about circuit monitoring and less about meter monitoring, but if the devices link up with SCE smart meters also, then that's an attractive solution, especially if I get more serious about a scratch built failover to battery backup when our grid goes down.  The context now is that I tried and failed to get a cheap $20 SDR to read my meter, so even the $125 ZS upgrade is a big step up, especially if I don't really know the quality and type of data I'll be able to view or extract for (relatively cheap) data reduction/processing. 

 

With respect to the data, I think I'd prefer just local storage (though not on the ISY, at least not more than just a few days - I don't want to even remotely run the risk of using all it's memory up for energy logging).  I already have a local webserver (running on an RPi) that I can use to publish whatever, and that I can access remotely.  I could even run some kind of AWS container for very very cheap if I desired to make it more public or offsite.  The cloud services are a nice way to quick and dirty publish something as a proof of concept, and to test what kind of visualizations/usability I'd want, but obviously not if extracting the data is a problem.  Which is what I'm trying to pin down.

 

I think we're on pretty much the same page.

 

Excellent discussion.  I wish I could just repurpose a cree zigbee radio or similar to link with the meter and get free (as in speech) access to the data stream from the meter that way, but it looks like the SEP 1.1 stack isn't easily acquired.  If I could do that, I could see what the meter will even be able to provide, and then make a fully informed decision on the best way to link it in with my ISY.

 

Just as an example, for energy management, and from a 3 minute perusal of the quick start guide, it looks like the ISY energy usage analysis is limited to max/min bands and the most recent usage measurement.  I think I'd prefer to make energy management/notification decisions more on a deeper analysis of how the energy usage reached a certain peak, and to do that I'd want to offload the data to my own repository so I can process it using bespoke scripts that then provide control signals back to the ISY to effect management through its network of devices, all within (preferably) a few tenths of a second or so (notification would be allowed to take much longer).  And the visualizations would be unrestrained.  

 

Based on the linked thread, I can probably get most of the way there.

[fisix]

Hi fisix,

 

currSumReceived/Delivered are all supported. You might have to go to 5.0.x for currSumReceived.

 

For future reference, referring us back to a forum post is much harder to manage than just saying what you are seek.

 

With kind regards,

Michel

 

Understood - thank you!  I think I'd be fine moving to 5.0.x, though I may try sticking with 4.6 first.

[fisix]

Just an update - I tried to purchase the power monitoring addon for the 994, but it's out of stock.  When it's back, I'll be getting it and I'll post back as to success.