Programs not responding

[smithlevenson]

Hey All,

I am having problems with Programs that haven't been touched in years. For some reason a few are not responding anymore. I haven't made any major changes to the system or network. The Last Run timestamps don't make very much sense for a lot of the programs, but the ones that aren't working are showing no timestamps at all. They will run if I right click and Run (Then). It is a mix of battery and wired switches. I power cycled the ISY, but nothing changed. It is definitely running a few programs correctly, but the majority are not running at all or are showing run when I know they didn't. 

Oh intermittent issues, how I love you....

 

Thanks for any suggestions.

[MrBill]

13 minutes ago, smithlevenson said:

Hey All,

I am having problems with Programs that haven't been touched in years. For some reason a few are not responding anymore. I haven't made any major changes to the system or network. The Last Run timestamps don't make very much sense for a lot of the programs, but the ones that aren't working are showing no timestamps at all. They will run if I right click and Run (Then). It is a mix of battery and wired switches. I power cycled the ISY, but nothing changed. It is definitely running a few programs correctly, but the majority are not running at all or are showing run when I know they didn't. 

Oh intermittent issues, how I love you....

 

Thanks for any suggestions.

Tell us your Firmware and UI versions from Help > About.

[MrBill]

Also as a first step... have you rebooted the ISY?

[smithlevenson]

Firmware and UI v.5.0.16A

 

EDITED the version Number

13 minutes ago, MrBill said:

Tell us your Firmware and UI versions from Help > About.

[smithlevenson]

1 minute ago, MrBill said:

Also as a first step... have you rebooted the ISY?

I did a power cycle. Nothing changed. I just started a reboot from the my.isy page. 

[lilyoyo1]

33 minutes ago, smithlevenson said:

Hey All,

I am having problems with Programs that haven't been touched in years. For some reason a few are not responding anymore. I haven't made any major changes to the system or network. The Last Run timestamps don't make very much sense for a lot of the programs, but the ones that aren't working are showing no timestamps at all. They will run if I right click and Run (Then). It is a mix of battery and wired switches. I power cycled the ISY, but nothing changed. It is definitely running a few programs correctly, but the majority are not running at all or are showing run when I know they didn't. 

Oh intermittent issues, how I love you....

 

Thanks for any suggestions.

post the programs the arent running

[smithlevenson]

Master Bath Fan Cutoff - [ID 0007][Parent 000C]

If
        'Upstairs / Master Bath / Master Bathroom Fan' is switched On
 
Then
        Wait  15 minutes 
        Set 'Upstairs / Master Bath / Master Bathroom Fan' Off
 
Else
   - No Actions - (To add one, press 'Action')

[MrBill]

If you have a 300 series z-wave board (z-wave version 4.55.00) you should upgrade the firmware to 5.0.16C)

if you don't have z-wave or have a 500 series board (z-wave version 6.81.00) you should upgrade to firmware 5.3.4.

You're current version is old and buggy, however that's likely not your problem... If your system was working for years, I suspect you either have a failing PLM or electrical noise...aka insteon signal blocking or signal sucking devices.  Check this section of the wiki: https://wiki.universal-devices.com/index.php?title=Main_Page#INSTEON_2

 

[lilyoyo1]

In addition to what MrBill said, Id also verify that the ISY is actually seeing the button presses. If it's not then that will confirm noise/plm issues. If the ISY does show the status change, run the event viewer on level 3 and see whats happening at the time its supposed to turn off.

[smithlevenson]

I wonder if there is a difference between. 

"'Upstairs / Master Bath / Master Bathroom Fan' Status is On"

and

"'Upstairs / Master Bath / Master Bathroom Fan' is switched On"
 

I doubt this is causing the problem, but the programs were all written for firmware v4. I figure the less unintentional mistakes the better, right?

[lilyoyo1]

13 minutes ago, smithlevenson said:

I wonder if there is a difference between. 

"'Upstairs / Master Bath / Master Bathroom Fan' Status is On"

and

"'Upstairs / Master Bath / Master Bathroom Fan' is switched On"
 

I doubt this is causing the problem, but the programs were all written for firmware v4. I figure the less unintentional mistakes the better, right?

Control (switched) on means the device is physically turned on. Status is referring to status itself. Great if you use voice or apps to turn stuff on/off

[MrBill]

23 minutes ago, smithlevenson said:

I wonder if there is a difference between. 

"'Upstairs / Master Bath / Master Bathroom Fan' Status is On"

and

"'Upstairs / Master Bath / Master Bathroom Fan' is switched On"
 

I doubt this is causing the problem, but the programs were all written for firmware v4. I figure the less unintentional mistakes the better, right?

As used here, it won't make much difference.   There are use cases where one is more appropriate than the other, but in this case they are fairly interchangeable.

24 minutes ago, smithlevenson said:

but the programs were all written for firmware v4

That distinction existed in V4 as well.

[Geddy]

2 hours ago, smithlevenson said:

I doubt this is causing the problem, but the programs were all written for firmware v4.

5 hours ago, smithlevenson said:

Firmware and UI v.5.0.16A

6 hours ago, smithlevenson said:

Programs that haven't been touched in years

@smithlevenson so when did you upgrade to 5.0.16A? You say the programs were written in V4.x, "haven't been touched in years", but now you're on 5.0.16A. When did you upgrade? Did you update/save the programs since that upgrade?

Have you since upgraded to 5.3.4 as @MrBill suggested? Just wondered if any of your programs (other then the one you posted) had scene issues that were messed up from the 4.x to 5.x upgrade that didn't get sorted out. Or perhaps programs haven't been saved since the update. There were some early 5.x releases that had big program bugs from upgrade that might have required a lot more interaction to get them working again. 

What do you seen on the summary page of the program tab? Any yellow text in any of your programs there? (I forget what the text would say)

I'd lean more toward what @MrBill mentioned of PLM issues or Noise issues. Could come from simple new bulb installed, bulb going bad, or any little electrical change (known or unknown). Have any storms, power surges, or outages lately? 

 

[smithlevenson]

17 hours ago, Geddy said:

@smithlevenson so when did you upgrade to 5.0.16A? You say the programs were written in V4.x, "haven't been touched in years", but now you're on 5.0.16A. When did you upgrade? Did you update/save the programs since that upgrade?

Have you since upgraded to 5.3.4 as @MrBill suggested? Just wondered if any of your programs (other then the one you posted) had scene issues that were messed up from the 4.x to 5.x upgrade that didn't get sorted out. Or perhaps programs haven't been saved since the update. There were some early 5.x releases that had big program bugs from upgrade that might have required a lot more interaction to get them working again. 

What do you seen on the summary page of the program tab? Any yellow text in any of your programs there? (I forget what the text would say)

I'd lean more toward what @MrBill mentioned of PLM issues or Noise issues. Could come from simple new bulb installed, bulb going bad, or any little electrical change (known or unknown). Have any storms, power surges, or outages lately? 

 

Thank you for the detailed response. I upgraded to 5.0.16A sometime late 2020 early 2021. I never really had problems with it at the change over (other than the power on level of the lights changing with what time it was). I do have some yellow status "Out of Memory" that were for some old programs that aren't used any more (I think they were tied to an old node server, but could be mistaken). None of the programs in question are related to the yellow programs.

I have replaced my PLM once a few years back, but that could be it. Noise would be weird too, but possible. I will grab another PLM to be on the safe side. I might try to upgrade the firmware again and see if that helps.

[MrBill]

9 minutes ago, smithlevenson said:

I will grab another PLM to be on the safe side.

if you mean order one... good luck!

[smithlevenson]

On 3/18/2022 at 12:50 PM, MrBill said:

if you mean order one... good luck!

This world is upside down...

 

However. I deleted all the non functioning programs and then just replicated them and viola. They all work just fine. So weird. They have been working perfectly for 6 years and with no apparent changes, and then just stopped. 

[MrBill]

2 hours ago, smithlevenson said:

This world is upside down...

 

However. I deleted all the non functioning programs and then just replicated them and viola. They all work just fine. So weird. They have been working perfectly for 6 years and with no apparent changes, and then just stopped. 

Now that you have your system working again please upgrade from 5.0.16A.   I'm assuming you don't have any z-wave, if that's the case go to 5.3.4

If you do have z-wave check the version.... 4.55.00 upgrade to 5.0.16c and don't upgrade to further firmware.  5.0.16c is a very stable release.   If the z-wave version is 6.81 then once again 5.3.4.

In any of the 3 cases, the update should take half hour or less of your time.  Backup, load the revised firmware, wait for the reboot, you're done... there is no adjustments needed to upgrade from 5.0.16A to either of the above.

 

[smithlevenson]

21 hours ago, MrBill said:

Now that you have your system working again please upgrade from 5.0.16A.   I'm assuming you don't have any z-wave, if that's the case go to 5.3.4

If you do have z-wave check the version.... 4.55.00 upgrade to 5.0.16c and don't upgrade to further firmware.  5.0.16c is a very stable release.   If the z-wave version is 6.81 then once again 5.3.4.

In any of the 3 cases, the update should take half hour or less of your time.  Backup, load the revised firmware, wait for the reboot, you're done... there is no adjustments needed to upgrade from 5.0.16A to either of the above.

 

Awesome totally will do. Thank you a million for all the advice.

 

Re-adding the programs worked for a bit, but then I found the real culprit. The status is not updating in ISY on the admin console. I am going to go ahead and upgrade, but I have to manually query to get the status to update (in the the console and the mobilinc app). Also the ISY Web Access is showing error, Loading: /config/

 

I wonder if I messed up a setting or trashed the config?

[smithlevenson]

Ok, upgrade to 5.0.16c done. It still isn't getting updated status to the ISY. It works just fine if I switch it on from the Mobilinc app or from the admin console. But neither are showing status for the bathroom fans unless they are toggled from the programs and not the switch itself. Maybe I need to airgap the switch and re-add it to the ISY?

[smithlevenson]

I did a "Restore Device" from the ISY admin console and it seemed to make the status start showing on the app and console. I guess I will have to see if this keeps up. 

[Geddy]

2 hours ago, smithlevenson said:

Ok, upgrade to 5.0.16c done.

Is there a reason you "only" went to 5.0.16C? Do you have the old style z-wave? Otherwise, you need to move all the way up to 5.4.3 before you continue to troubleshoot. If you've got the 300 series z-wave then I get it, but if you don't or aren't using z-wave you really should upgrade to the current version to make sure that any possible issues you continue to face weren't fixed along the way.

I mean, this was covered 2 weeks ago. So wondering why only partially upgrade. 

 

Now you're kind of all over the place in looking for/finding errors. 

I'm not sure why/where you're getting this:

5 hours ago, smithlevenson said:

Also the ISY Web Access is showing error, Loading: /config/

There's no reason (very little anyway) to use web access for the ISY994 device these days. Admin Console is best accessed through the Launcher (has been the preferred method since 2018). 

 

Seems like @MrBill was right...could be electrical noise or failing PLM. 

[MrBill]

You  can also open a ticket: support@universal-devices.com

They are fast and amazing!

[smithlevenson]

19 hours ago, Geddy said:

Is there a reason you "only" went to 5.0.16C? Do you have the old style z-wave? Otherwise, you need to move all the way up to 5.4.3 before you continue to troubleshoot. If you've got the 300 series z-wave then I get it, but if you don't or aren't using z-wave you really should upgrade to the current version to make sure that any possible issues you continue to face weren't fixed along the way.

I mean, this was covered 2 weeks ago. So wondering why only partially upgrade. 

 

My Z-Wave Version is listed as 4.55.00 bootloader version 0.00. I only went on Mr. Bill's advice to go to C. It seems to be working. If 4.55 works with 5.4.3 I can do that upgrade too.

[lilyoyo1]

17 minutes ago, smithlevenson said:

My Z-Wave Version is listed as 4.55.00 bootloader version 0.00. I only went on Mr. Bill's advice to go to C. It seems to be working. If 4.55 works with 5.4.3 I can do that upgrade too.

See MrBills post from earlier. It does not work.

https://forum.universal-devices.com/topic/35428-programs-not-responding/?do=findComment&comment=332535

[MrBill]

2 hours ago, smithlevenson said:

4.55.00

5.0.16C is your stopping point.

At this point in the game I don't recommend upgrading z-wave on a 994.  Instead save your upgrade money for Polisy + 700 series z-wave. This replaces the 994 completely, and gives you lots of functionality in one box.