Best ISY supported "smart" water main shutoff valve?

[Javi]

On 12/4/2023 at 10:01 AM, Panda88 said:

The flow meter is new and I have not integrated it yet - Unfortunately they do not offer the pipe size I need 1 1/4 so I have not bought one yet.  If someone could give me access I can try to integrate it - It could be set up with a separate account I could use to access it 

 

@Panda88, I installed the flow meter and valve over the holiday. Send me a PM or email I think I can add you as a user for testing.

 

[Javi]

I installed the YoLink Meter and Valve over the holiday after main line replacement, the meter and valve appear well built off the shelf items, so if the YoLink functionality does not work, or stops working both devices can be connected to a Z-Wave or Networked interface. 

YoLink Hardware:

Purchased the FlowSmart Control Meter and Valve Kit and YoLink hub for $402 with 20% holiday discount. Without discount I may have purchased something else.

https://shop.yosmart.com/products/ys5006-dn20s?_fid=6d7d771f3&_pos=5&_ss=c

The valve:

This appears to be an off the shelf TONHEFLOW valve rebranded by various companies. 

http://www.motorized-valve.com/A20-Stainless-Steel-motorized-valve/DN25-1-inch-CR501-NSF61-G-motorized-ball-valve-with-manual-override.html

Similar Zwave variant exists for $439/$387

https://shop.homeseer.com/products/z-wave-smart-water-valve?variant=38150151700655&currency=USD&utm_medium=product_sync&utm_source=google&utm_content=sag_organic&utm_campaign=sag_organic&srsltid=AfmBOoqjv61AvRc8ldg6CAnMaAIpkzwhWodbGCHFcmxNIBPUWmfkZuhNOCs

https://www.zwaveoutlet.com/collections/water-control/products/leak-gopher-z-wave-water-valve-control

I found at least one company which bundles a Z-Wave Relay with the same valve for $159 which shows a wiring diagram

https://innovativehomesys.com/products/z-wave-water-shutoff-valve-package?variant=43566407778467

Same Valve with Insteon Implementation diagram

https://innovativehomesys.com/collections/e-hvac/products/motorized-brass-water-shutoff-valve-with-feedback?variant=1183422031

 

The Meter:

This appears to be an off the shelf meter rebranded by various companies

Similar meter $160

https://www.ekmmetering.com/products/3-4-water-nsf?variant=33025363869757&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=Google+Shopping&currency=USD&country=US&gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQiA7aSsBhCiARIsALFvovxeTScOYja2OCipXHLBf5q1ZEe7ha-y_5EJNcRGkvs8lOEXh8tbvBwaApmpEALw_wcB

Similar meter with Z-Wave interface (in brass which may not be suitable for potable water) $229

https://shop.ezlo.com/products/fortrezz-flow-meter-75-z-wave-plus/?srsltid=AfmBOorHA2Tq5R_AwABCU8OKOn-susXq5fEedyopce0Pqowd7n6_wABCi8s

 

Final Thoughts:

The YoLink interface has a battery (backup when on AC) and AC connection, which is not the case for many of the Z-Wave Manufactures, although without local connections, this may be moot.

I'm not sure I'll keep the YoLink interface if their new, yet to be released, hub does not support Local Connections.  While the 20% discount pushed me to pull the trigger on purchase, I would have saved money by purchasing the off the shelf parts separately, although meter integration may have been difficult. It would be great if Fortrezz sold the Z-Wave interface decoupled from the meter as the brass meter may not be approved for potable water.

Interfacing the shutoff valve with Z-Wave appears to be straightforward, so I may go this route.

Interfacing the meter with Z-Wave, Zigbee, or network, may be difficult.   There are various European companies which sell Zigbee pulse meter counters but not sure if the would work.  The interface needs to send the pulse count not each pulse, which may be an issue.

Zigbee:

https://www.domadoo.fr/en/energy-monitoring-consumption-measurement/6536-lixee-zigbee-30-pulse-meter-water-gas-jeedom-and-home-assistant-compatible-3770014375155.html

ZWave (not too sure about this merchant)

https://ssl2002.webhosting.comcast.net/adox.comcastbiz.net/merchantmanager/product_info.php?products_id=2

Networked:

https://www.yoctopuce.com/EN/article/interfacing-a-water-meter

If anyone has experience with pulse counters which may work, please let me know.

 

 

[tazman]

Great post @Javivery informative thanks for sharing!

[Papa C]

On 11/26/2023 at 3:48 PM, Merlin said:

Well, I am currently using an Insteon 2852-222 Leak Sensor, which is wireless. I plan to pick up some more leak sensors, but with the Insteon model discontinued, I will likely get the Aeotec or Zooz Z-Wave leak sensor for the other locations I want to monitor. So, that is always going to be a potential issue.

After reading all the horror stories about using in-line "smart" valves (like the Moen Flo) I am leaning away from getting an in-line valve and just installing a traditional ball valve with an external valve controller, like the Zooz Titan to make it easy to remove/replace if it fails down the road.

That said, my home uses hydronic heat, with each zone operated via 24V Taco Zone Sentry valves. So, I would be more comfortable using one of those for the water main as well. I know they work well and are designed to last for years. I'd just need to find a 24V remote activation module (one that supports ethernet would be nice, though the one you linked is no longer available).

Yeah, after reading all the horror stories in the reviews of other "smart" valves, I have come to the same conclusion. But yes, if I were to get one, I'd add it before/after a manual shutoff in case of failure. I am considering the Zooz for ease of operation and replacement though. What are your thoughts on the Titan?

Thanks! I'll take a look. What are your thoughts on the Zooz Titan?

I'm still weighing my options, but I really appreciate the feedback folks!

I'm using a pair of these: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B083XGZXRH/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&th=1 

for the water supply to my washing machine.  It's nice in that they auto shut off on power loss (great for this application), they have others that don't auto close.

I control them with https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0846DZJD8/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 

Not knowing where your valve is, can you not get a 24v supply to the valve location?  I have a shut off IN the house added when I added a water softener.  I intend (one of these days) to add a controllable shut off there as well and would probably just go with another of these US Solid valves.  The ones I have get quite a workout every week.

[ktautomate]

I have 7+ years of experience with multiple valve automation types. I started with a Z-Wave DomeHA Water Main shutoff. Fortunately, I never had experience with "all on" issue. However, as a strap over the pipe and clamp onto the actuator type valve closer there was always a wee bit of play in the valve closing process. Sometimes when I attempted to close it would remain what appeared to be a slight bit open. The regular issue I encountered is unrequested shutoffs. No water sensor was tripped no request sent. Just decided to close. I admit that "failure" is much less concerning than unexpected opening of the valve. Either way it was enough to erode confidence in a Z-Wave device.  

Consequently, I shifted to a hard wired (24VAC hard wired relay), price was 6-10x the price of the cheap valve actuator and I had to pay another couple hundred to have it plumbed into the line. But you know the saying, you get what you pay for. The Elk replacement was one of the best moves I've made in my system. It's completely bullet proof. I've ever had a failed close, I've never had an unrequested open. It's truly amazing. If you can't afford a hard-wired valve controller you might wanna make sure you have a low insurance deductable, cause all it will take is one flood claim to make you wish you'd put in something that will really work, and work FAST (current versions close in less than 1 second).