Teken

Brian H, How long was this product in production for? Was there a period where this device actually worked fine? Teken . . .

That is definitely a great dream . . . Teken . . .

This valuable tid bit provided by Brian H is extremely important for those using their Appliance Linc devices to control mission critical loads. I personally have both versions in use. As some devices I want the *Fail Safe* while others I want the *Fail Secure* to be deployed during a power interruption. There are instances where you do not want something to be powered back up during a electrical disaster event. Case in point my washer is tied into a water detection system. If it detects the presence of water it will shut off the power to the washer. In the same breath, should there be a lightning storm and the power goes out. This added benefit of the Appliance Linc will provide another level of protection against an electrical surge entering the device. This is just one of three fail safes I have in place to ensure specific devices are well protected against power events. Teken . . .

Some follow up: I installed the latest firmware last week and all appears well. During the testing and validation process some of my problems regarding the switchlinc timer relays seem to be partially corrected. To bring everyone back up to speed as to the events leading to this problem(s). During the 2.X.X release all of my SLT would operate in terms of their 15 min. default timers. Pressing the switch multiple times would add an extra hour to the clock. During the 3.X.X release several improvements were introduced which allowed the end user to make global changes to the SLT's. These include the ability to change the 1 minute blink status, timer values, traffic LED status, etc. At this time all my SLT switches stopped functioning in terms of basic timers. All of the 15 min. timers stopped working. Power cycling, hard resetting, adding / removing, and performing Insteon Engine queries proved unhelpful. Using the ISY interface to bring up the option settings of each device would display corrupted *default* timers. They either displayed as 0, 15, 255 minutes. The SLT switches with 0 & 15 min. timer values did not work at all. They simply acted like standard switchlinc relays . . . The ones with 255 minutes would indeed turn the SLT switch at the 4.25 hour mark. Having stated all of the above behaviors: In this latest release, the default timers have since changed to 0, 15, 30 minutes, all with no user intervention. I have tested these switches endlessly to confirm what I see, and what is happening. Currently the one switch with the 0 minute value (Tia's Room) operates with a 15 min. timer, the 30 minute (Ceiling) lights does indeed turn off at the 30 minute mark and also blinks the lights accordingly. The SLT at the stairs is the only device which shows a 15 min. timer, and operates as it should. With that said I would like to ask the forum members if these switches require a complete power cycle to take on new settings?? I will be performing these tests in the next few days as I will have the home all to myself. It is apparent that these devices can in fact be impacted by outside forces, whether it be firmware or the possible changing of values, and then power cycling them. It comes down to confirming how this is done and if its something that can be repeated reliably. Teken . . .

Would you be so kind and also confirm that your 2476ST 15 timers still operate as expected, along with the 1, 2 hour timers. Also, would you also try to change the default 15 timer using the ISY's option function and change that value to say 20 minutes and let me know if it sticks. As I continue to experience a loss in functionality of these key features. Teken . . .

Yes, that will reset it. Also, I can just turn the KPL off and on using main off/on button, and that too will reset it. But flipping the leviton connected to the CFLs on and off a few times will still cause the KPL to go flaky again. Very annoying. I can tell you that in the long term those events will damage the KPL. It will either corrupt the firmware, or it will cause a surge to affect the electronics in that unit. No need to ask me how I know . . . Teken . . .

I wish I could say I had the same experience. The four SLT simply stopped working and no amount of hard reseting along with restore device does anything to them. Teken . . .

The state of the door may play a role when the *All Off* button is pressed via the ISY console. I have not reprogrammed my unit to confirm that it is not affected by this. The manual states the door should be in the open state. While forum members state that it should be in the closed state. So, please do keep this in mind when you program the I/O link. As you may find that the door is forced open when someone accidentally engages the *All Off* mode while you're off site and your alarm system trips with out a clear reason as to why. Teken . . .

Can you also confirm that the timer function is working on the switch itself? In other words, press the on paddle once. The switch should go on for 15 minutes then shut down. Please also state the method you're using to reset the insteon device for us all. I have used the stated hard reset method to no avail. Teken . . .

I think I may have narrowed down one possible reason. The two dual band KPL relays both allow the load button and the secondary buttons to have a on, off, fast on, fast off, etc options. While the older units do not . . . For reference the dual band KPL's are v.40 Using the Admin Console and turning on the both KPLs turns on the central fan & the entry light. Which are the loads in their respective rooms. There is a bug some where . . . Teken . . .

Both of these KPL's are relay style devices. One is a dual band relay, the other is a regular 6 button relay converted to a 8 button KPL. In all cases the KPL button's are secondary controllers to the the ceiling light in the kitchen. None of them control the local load directly, they are simply linked via the Insteon network. Specifically, the dual band KPL relay in the Master Bedroom is using the H button. The Entry KPL is the D button. So, again I don't understand why this KPL does not have these options as the others? Teken . . .

Hello LeeG, I don't believe we are on the same page here. Let me try to explain again the problem at hand. If you look at the first screen capture you will see three lines of text. The one high lighted in blue had the option to select on, off, fast on, fast off, etc The other KPL which is also in the same screen capture in the action pane does not have any of these options. My question is why does this Insteon device not have these on, off, fast on, fast off, etc options as the other KPL relay? All there is are LED dimming features?? Teken . . .

I follow what you're trying to say. But, if you look at my program above you will notice I am able to add in a secondary KPL's button with a on/off. I don't understand how one can be added, while another one won't? In the interim I have added the scene to the *then* and will see if the two KPL's do in fact turn on / off once the 15 minute timer expires. Teken . . .

Strange bug has been found. Because the SWT does not work anymore I decided to use the power of the ISY to band aid this device. I have two relay KPL's which control the ceiling light in the kitchen. The problem I had initially was that once the timer in the kitchen had expired the two KPL buttons would not turn off. Displaying an incorrect state to the user. So, I added the two KPL to the original program and what struck me odd is the following. You will notice that this KPL Relay v.36 does not have the options to turn the device on / off?? Only the options to make changes to the LED levels?? Could someone please investigate this issue . . . Teken . . .

Michel, after further usage, I am sad to say I am getting the exact same result as Teken. A newly installed SWT works fine in all regards, including all check boxes and acting as a timer, except of course for the timer value cannot be changed. It just stays at 15. It was based on this 'new' switch that I gave my prior positive results post. However, my OLD SWTs which I had originally installed about 1-2 months ago and which were originally installed with 3.1.7 ISY firmware are totally hosed in terms of being able to be used as a timer. My guess is that something in the 3.1.7 or later firmware made changes which killed the timer function of these switches. I will try to so some more factory resets to get them back, but so far this seems like permanent damage to the SWT timer function. I guess I will continue to use these as standard relay switches. The only hope I see is that if we are able to write enough to the timer function to kill it, then maybe the timer function can indeed be changed. So perhaps over time there is hope for being able to 1) restore our switches to Timers, and 2) be able to custom set the time. Thank you for confirming it on your end as well. What ever can be done would be greatly appreciated! The reason this is so important to me now is that I am receiving another couple of these SLT units in the near future. I can not have these brand new devices damaged or corrupted. I have very specific areas / zones in the home which I have made a conscious decision to have devices which will do something by default natively with out any HA controller, or user interaction(s). As always I thank the UDI team for their continued support, and never ending improvements in the ISY-99 platform . . . Teken . . .

Yep Hoopty is correct. I was thinking about Twitter when I replied. Teken . . .

If you count the text message is it indeed with in the 140 character limit? Keep in mind all of the dates, times, and the repeated values are part of the 140 limit. My crappy phone breaks down the alerts into 2 portions, which is really annoying. I can't wait to get my iPhone because it can be made to accept the entire message with out splitting it into 2 sms messages. Teken . . .

Hello Michel, I have never been able to set the timer values in any firmware release. I do not use the HouseLinc software in any fashion any longer. The problem I have is that all of these SWT devices no longer operate in their native fashion. 1. All of them had a 15 minute timer at one point in time. They all flashed the lights at the 1 minute timer period. All of the switches would in fact increase in time from 15 minutes to XX hours, based on multiple taps. 2. Since 3.X.X firmware the values show with in the ISY *Options* list of 0, 15, 255 minutes for various devices. During one release (I don't recall which one) the switches still continued to operate their timer values regardless of what was being displayed. 3. Now, in the latest versions of the 3.X.X ISY firmware. All timer aspects no longer operate at all. It is clear to me that these devices can be written to. Otherwise there would be no way for the values to have changed from the default of 15 minutes. What is odd is that when you perform a Query Insteon Engine. Performing this same task in random order, will sometimes show a value from 15, to 255. This value will be restored once you log out and re-enter the ISY control panel. I am not sure how it is these devices can be written to in one instant. Then, later on not have the ability to do so later?? Performing a hard reset, removal, and deletion, then adding back dozens of times has no affect on these switches. I can not replace them as they are no longer being produced! Teken . . .

Hello Michel, I have updated the ISY with out issue. Unfortunately this firmware update does not address the SWT problem. With the help of Brian, all of the SWT have all been factory reset. Prior to doing this I removed all the scenes from the ISY. I than deleted the device from the ISY controller. At that point I performed a factory hard reset. The final outcome is the same. Any and all SWT which had working 15 timers do not work any longer. As stated before some of the devices now show 0, 15, 255 minutes in their respective captured timer values from the options list. Note, prior to this event in 3.1.7 release all of the SWT worked just fine and operated as expected. I have been able to confirm that all of the other check box's also operated as expected. ie. LED traffic, 1 minute count down, etc. Somewhere in the firmware update(s) all of these SWT have since stopped working in terms of timers. They do in fact operate as normal switches and always take on any programming from the ISY for work around fix. These devices appear to take on all program updates. But, something has corrupted them from their default firmware settings. Teken . . .

Hey Brian, Thanks for the steps for the factory reset for this device. Unfortunately there was no joy in doing this reset. Everything remains the same as before. Teken . . .

I have not done this myself on the 2476ST, but are you saying the following (from the manual) does not work? Ugh if so! Those steps will not work on this specific device at all. This sole product deviates from the standard Insteon has set forth on all other devices. You will notice that when you attempt to pull on the plastic tab it will NOT remain in that position. The reason being is there is no physical tab / spring to pull out which disengages the two contact points within the switch. I have no clue why this sole device is built this way . . . All 5 of these devices from various periods of time, production, and years are all the same. When this product works it is simply the best thing since sliced bread! When it doesn't, its a pain in the aszz! Teken . . .

Removing the device has no impact on the device. What process have you used to reset the SWT?? As this lone device is the only one where the clear plastic tab has zero affect. There is physically no relay behind this device to kill the power. Teken . . .

Well that isn't very inspiring for me then . . . As my device(s) all showed a 15 minute prior to the 3.X.X firmware launch. Now, some of them show 0, 15, 255 minute values. Which clearly indicates that these devices can in fact be written too. It would be most helpful if SmartHome would help UDI in the trouble shooting this problem! Currently none of the SwitchLinc timers operate as they did before. They no longer blink 1 minute prior to turning off. They no longer respond to mulit-taps to extend the run time. And, they certainly don't have the base 15 minute timers as they had when first installed. Blueman2, what is the version and firmware level of this device?? I will load this new release when I get home. I am currently locked out of the ISY at this moment and have no idea why this is! Teken . . .

Hello Michel, When ever the UDI team is ready is fine. I will await for the release via this forum so all can benefit from the updates. As always I thank you, and the UDI developmental team. Regards Teken . . .

For the sake of trying I decided to perform a manual enrollment of the device. I used both Switchlinc Timers that were in the drop down list. There was no change in the over all behavior but I did note that using one over the other required 10 times the amount of time to complete the same task. For what ever its worth this was the pop up error after completing the add device manually. Teken . . .