PG3x list of features and benefits over PG3

[johnnyt]

Hi, 

Can someone provide (or point me to) a list of the major features and benefits (current and planned) of PG3x compared to PG3? The eisy user guide only tells you how to install it, and the announcement/release notes for PG3x only mention the following:

1. make node servers (and PG3x) more secure
2. Add setClientState API framework to support remote access to PG3x

And I don't know if #2 is new or just catching up to PG3. The rest look like fixes or minor enhancements to me.

I'm trying to decide if I migrate 994i to Polisy or eisy, and it's my understanding that Polisy will be stuck at PG3. Because I have a Polisy, I'd like to make use of it and if there's nothing I need in PG3x over the next 1-2 yrs I would be fine to stick with PG3.

If my understanding is wrong and PG3x will be coming to Polisy, great. I'd still like to know what PG3x will offer over PG3. 

Any info would be appreciated.

 

[MrBill]

40 minutes ago, johnnyt said:

Can someone provide (or point me to) a list of the major features and benefits (current and planned) of PG3x compared to PG3?

pg3x is superseding pg3.  It won't be a choice for the user going forward, there is no need to evaluate the major features and benefits.  eisy ships with pg3x, there's no choice there.  pg3 is being deprecated on Polisy and will someday be gone.

[johnnyt]

2 minutes ago, MrBill said:

pg3x is superseding pg3.  It won't be a choice for the user going forward, there is no need to evaluate the major features and benefits.  eisy ships with pg3x, there's no choice there.  pg3 is being deprecated on Polisy and will someday be gone.

Is Polisy going to be able to move to PG3x? 

 

[lilyoyo1]

1 hour ago, johnnyt said:

Is Polisy going to be able to move to PG3x? 

 

His last line answered that. In addition, the software for Polisy and eisy will be the same (except for hardware capabilities that eisy has such as the HDMI cable)

[Geddy]

2 hours ago, johnnyt said:

Is Polisy going to be able to move to PG3x? 

There was a quick comment about that in a recent news post from UDI 

https://www.universal-devices.com/eisyir-flirc/

Quote

eISYIR also works on Polisy v5.59 but you will need to migrate your PG3 to PG3x. This is a one-way and automatic migration procedure and there’s no going back. If interested, please backup your PG3 and then click on the link below:
https://polisy.local:8443/rest/pg3x.enable

I haven't seen any posts of people performing this step, but it's an option. 

Here's recent discussion about it:

 

 

[johnnyt]

53 minutes ago, lilyoyo1 said:

His last line answered that. 

Saying that PG3 is deprecated does not answer whether PG3x can be run on Polisy. PG2 is deprecated on Polisy and that didn't prevent PG3 from running on it.

[johnnyt]

13 minutes ago, Geddy said:

There was a quick comment about that in a recent news post from UDI 

https://www.universal-devices.com/eisyir-flirc/

I haven't seen any posts of people performing this step, but it's an option. 

Here's recent discussion about it:

 

 

Thanks for the helpful answer, @Geddy

So it's certainly less critical to know what's in PG3x so if there's no one or nothing that can list what's new in PG3x I guess I'll just wait and find out 1-2 features at a time.

[Geddy]

7 minutes ago, johnnyt said:

if there's no one or nothing that can list what's new in PG3x

I think the "differences" really only impact Node Server developers. @bpwwer would be the best to answer if there's anything impacting us, as users, between the two. But, it's probably not anything that would make one better/different than the other on the user side. It's more developer based from everything that's been posted previously. Without getting into the weeds (mostly because I don't know what the stuff means) I'll just leave it at that. 

But on the surface (for users) as best as I see it (currently)  PG3 = PG3x

PG3 runs on Polisy - able to update/upgrade to PG3x on Polisy (not a reversible update) 

PG3x runs on eisy natively

(just like @MrBill said in the first reply)

Current node server store for PG3 and PG3x are exactly the same. 

[bpwwer]

Currently the only "feature" difference between PG3 and PG3x is that PG3x is getting remote access support.  We can't do remote access for PG3 which is one of the main reasons PG3x was developed.   There are internal changes in PG3x that make the node servers more secure but that's not something that is user visible.

There are no other plans for PG3x specific features other than those that are enabled because of the remote access framework.  An example is that there is a Ring node server that will piggyback on the remote access framework and thus, will only run on PG3x.

As mentioned above, Polisy is capable of running PG3x and there is a migration path available to switch.  We can migrate from PG3 -> PG3x but we don't have an easy way to migrate back so make sure you make backups of everything before attempting to migrate PG3 -> PG3x.

[bgrubb1]

Thank you Bob

I have not seen a how to migrate other than the one line command in the flirc announcement

Is there directions ?

 

[Geddy]

2 hours ago, bgrubb1 said:

Is there directions ?

I don't have a Polisy to try it on, but from the comment above it seemed just put that URL in a browser and apparently there were processes to run and it would just result in having the system updated to PG3x. 

Nothing has been added to the wiki as far as processes so think it's just use that URL. 

@bpwwer do you know of anything else needed to upgrade from PG3 to PG3x on the Polisy?

Important comment above though:    make backups of everything before attempting to migrate PG3 -> PG3x.

(I might include a suggestion to take screen shots of ALL configuration pages for node servers you are running before the migration. Couldn't hurt just for visual reference if they need to be setup again.)

[bpwwer]

I'm not sure what that link does.  My assumption is that it sets a variable telling the Polisy that it should install PG3x instead of PG3 when doing updates.  It should also remove PG3 and install PG3x. and then restart everthing.

When PG3x first starts, it will check to see if it needs to migrate the database/node servers from PG3 to PG3x and will then proceed to do that.  Depending on how many node servers are installed, this can take some time.  It should send notices to the PG3x UI for each node server it migrates.  Expect at least 30 seconds to 1 minute for each node server.

If you interrupt this process you'll probably end up with some node servers migrated and some not so don't be in a rush, take your time.

It also logs the migration progress in the PG3x log file so if something does go wrong, downloading the PG3x log and attaching that to any support request (ticket or forum/PM).

I believe it does not try to start the node servers after it migrates them so they should all be in the disconnected state and you have to manually start each one.  

The migration should not effect any configuration or existing nodes.

My testing involved migrating 30+ node servers multiple times (so yes, it takes quite a while to run) and I didn't see any issues, but I can't account for all the different environments and combinations of node servers.

There's no easy way to go back to PG3.  In theory, the variable can be cleared, PG3 can be re-installed and restored from a PG3 backup and it should work.  There's probably some other stuff that PG3x did that will need to be cleaned up, but it should work.  This hasn't been tested so for now, best to consider it a one-way migration.

If you try https://polisy.local:8443/rest/pg3x.enable and it doesn't work, please submit a support ticket.  

[johnnyt]

Thanks for the helpful info @bpwwer.

It appears to me that there are more problems (growing pains) with eisy and PG3x than with Polisy and PG3 - at least from the posts I've read. Given PG3x will run on Polisy, this reinforces my thinking to migrate my 994i to Polisy rather than to eisy. For sure I will eventually use eisy and PG3x, but because I have a large system (I won't repeat details here), it's highly valuable to me to be able to reduce the "surface area" for problems and extra work before I migrate. If I can punt something down the road without losing much, count me in.

 

Edited April 5, 2023 by johnnyt

[lilyoyo1]

5 hours ago, johnnyt said:

Saying that PG3 is deprecated does not answer whether PG3x can be run on Polisy. PG2 is deprecated on Polisy and that didn't prevent PG3 from running on it.

He said pg3x supersedes pg3x and pg3x will be deprecated. Pg3 superceded pg2 which is why it currently runs on polisy

[bpwwer]

Yes, eventually (no current timeframe has been decided), PG3 will be deprecated. 

But for reference, I'm still doing almost all PG3 development on a Polisy with PG3.  Then once I have it working on PG3, I move it to PG3x on eisy.   PG3 on Polisy isn't going to suddenly disappear.  

Right now, it's only remote access to PG3x that doesn't and won't exist on PG3.  There may be some node servers that depend on either the remote access framework or eisy specific hardware that work on a Polisy.  Oh and PG3x will display update related notices like the admin console does.  That's also something PG3 can't do.

For people that are still using a i994 and have a Polisy, there's no good reason to try and migrate from i994 directly to PG3x.  I'd first move to Polisy/PG3 and once that is stable, then you can think about migrating to PG3x.

[Bumbershoot]

6 hours ago, bpwwer said:

An example is that there is a Ring node server that will piggyback on the remote access framework and thus, will only run on PG3x.

@bpwwer, this is the first indication I've seen that the Ring node server may come back to life.  If it's true, then I'm very pleased to hear it!

[hart2hart]

@bpwwer, this is the first indication I've seen that the Ring node server may come back to life.  If it's true, then I'm very pleased to hear it!

Me too!

[dwengrovitz]

On 4/5/2023 at 7:17 PM, hart2hart said:

This is the first indication I've seen that the Ring node server may come back to life.  If it's true, then I'm very pleased to hear it!

I noticed a Ring node server appeared in the Non-production Store for PG3x a couple days ago.